Minecraft Forums

The mod API is probably the best thing since sliced bread. I doubt that the first cut will have all the features needed by most mods, but as long as they keep at it they will eventually get it right.

The merge of server and client code is a mixed bag. Good because it will make it easier to maintain. Bad because the server code has so many problems that will bleed into the client code. They should have fixed all the server issues before even considering this.

I am sure somebody commented on it already, but here it goes anyway: 1000x1000 multiplayer... ROFL!!!

That is fine for a few friends that trust each other, but it is certainly idiotic for an open server. With no plugins to stop griefers and no "distance" to go hide your place, this is going to be griefer central. A miserable experience for most players who try it.

But then, maybe they "fixed it" by not allowing open servers. It would be a typical Microsoft "feature".

Quote from Braystreet

I sincerely hope the combination of SMP and SSP doesn't make it live. This is the worst thing Mojang has ever done, which, admittedly, I've never thought they did anything wrong in the past. I bought a stable single player game in Alpha, and I've played a stable single player game for nigh-on two years, but today, I try the snapshot so I can help spot bugs and see the new features, as is my kingly duty, and this is simply awful. I gave them their money, I got the right to play SMP, and I never did, because it was awful. Now, I don't have a choice. Mobs are laggy, they have no collision detection. I can't pause the game to answer the phone because well, that'd be weird for other people since it automatically creates a server for me. I have to deal with extra lag because of the extra processes. I'm getting terrain glitches where I never have before. I'd rather they stop development altogether than make the game as bad as this.

I liked the writable books, I was looking forward to the mod support. I didn't have any feelings one way or another about the books. I don't feel like cocoa beans are compromising dungeons. Beds didn't end the world.

Forcing me to play crappy SMP? I will never update again. Minecraft has always been about giving the player choices, and if this goes live, we won't even have a choice about playing a fully functioning game.

EDIT - I know, I hate people who think their thoughts are worth a private thread when there are dozens of similar threads too, but there's no other threads specifically about this, and I think I've earned one, because I have a pocket.

Valid complaints, wrong conclusion... I hope.

As long as they address all of these issues before releasing it as a formal version, then there is no issue.

But if they are complete idiots and release a formal version in this conditions... all the complaints become totally valid.

From what I see, it is a very nice set of changes. As a developer I see the value of the client/server code cleanup.

At the same time I look forward to the changes... and hope that it will be a month or two before we see the next formal release (hopefully 1.3 with the mod api), because there is still way too much impact on real-life servers every time a new release comes out.

I look at the issue of water in Nether from a different perspective. Not whether it is realistic but whether it makes the game more enjoyable? After all, enjoyment is why we play.

From the perspective of enjoyment it is my opinion (and nothing more than my opinion) that water should not occur naturally in the Nether, but you should be able to haul it in and place it (or place ice to get water).

For some of us - nothing gives us a better sense of accomplishment than the completion of an impressive creation in a challenging environment like the Nether. Water would add many interesting options.

Quote from Dr Danco

I know right. Just try the mods before you make comments about new versions people!
I have this installed and working on 1.2.5 with no problems at all.

As a mod writer myself I have to say that it takes no time to post that the mod works with 1.2.5. Mine has been virtually unchanged since 1.2.3 but I update the post page every time minecraft updates.

If the author can't be bothered to at least update the post you have to wonder whether the mod has been abandoned.

Yeah... I seriously doubt he would abandoned such a popular mod, still the doubt pops up its ugly head.

It is easy to blame plugins for everything. And given that most plugin developers only got into Java recently, to write plugins... it is normal to assume they are defective.

But common sense (and coding experience) says that in order for a plugin to affect something like the drop rate of saplings, the plugin itself must be designed to touch the code for sapling drops.

There are some plugins that increase apple drop rates, and those might affect saplings, but even though most servers run some plugins hardly any run plugins that touch anywhere near this functionality. Combine that with the reports from a few people that took the time to verify the problem happens on vanilla servers (and discovered that it happens under "a yet to be discovered" condition)... and it is obvious that the problem is in minecraft, possibly minecraft server.

The level of ignorance of most of the responses is appalling. People should stay off threads when they don't understand the issue discussed.

The OP makes a valid point that Mojang has not yet addressed:

• Certain plugins are essential to run a server. Vanilla minecraft server is utterly inadequate. Saying "it's your fault for using those plugins" is just plain stupid.
• Updates to minecraft cause a need to update the plugins.
• Not updating to the latest version of minecraft makes the server obsolete. Players move on to servers that can handle "staying up to date". Saying "don't update" is also stupid - it costs the server players, donations, etc

Mojang has done a horrible job of backwards compatibility after an update. The future upcoming server API - if done right - might help plugins remain functional through minecraft version updates. But only time will tell.

Until then, frequent minecraft updates - no matter how nice the features - are just plain bad for servers.

Thirst... let's not give them more stupid ideas. Hunger was bad enough.

Do you honestly enjoy doing pointless tasks that take you away from building/mining/exploring?

I have been writing software for a very long time and in that time I've seen many people like Notch. He is an extremely bright tinkerer, but he is not a professional developer.

That makes him perfect to come up with great ideas (and some not so great ones... void fog anyone?) but he can't really follow through and produce a well designed and reliable feature. So long as he just gets involved with the start of new games and then hands them off for someone else to polish them, all is good.

And he is smart enough to know it, as shown by his recent blog post and earlier handing off minecraft to Jeb.

The fog is beyond stupid and needs to go. It doesn't add anything to the game.

Silk Touch needs to be removed from the game, it makes no sense and seems like it's only there to allow you to collect blocks you should be able to collect in the first place.

Now, before you go all fanboy on me, hear me out. Why should we have to use a specifically enchanted tool to collect blocks that should be collectable anyway? it's illogical!

Think about it.. We need Silk Touch to collect the following blocks (Correct me if I forgot one!)

-Glass/Glass Panes
-Diamond, Coal Lapis and Redstone Ores
-Mycelium
-Grass
-Double Slabs
-Ice
-Huge Mushrooms
-Glowstone
-Bookshelves

Now, instead of using this silly enchantment, why doesn't it just work like this? You know, a way that makes sense?

-Glass/Glass Panes
You just get them back when you break them? I've never heard of the only way to remove a window was to smash it into a million peices.

-Diamond, Coal Lapis and Redstone Ores
Instead of getting the diamond, coal, lapis or redstone directly when you break the block, how about you just get the ore block itself and "craft" it into the final product? This is better anyway, because if you were to really mine these ores, you'd have a big mess of the ore you want mixed in with stone/cobble/crap and you'd have to sort out. So just make an extra step of tossing the ore in a craft window and collecting the ore from it? Simple huh?

-Mycelium
Shovel. Collect. Done.

-Grass
Shovel. Collect. Done.

-Double Slabs
We shouldn't be able to pick these up anyway... and if we must, why not just have double slabs breaks into 2 half slabs like they do now anyway and have the option of creating pre-made double slabs in the craft window? (2 half slabs on top of each other)

-Ice
Collect with a pickaxe or shovel? you know? Like real life?

-Huge Mushrooms
See no reason we can't collect these.

-Glowstone
Should just be getting the dust from these, or just the block directly. Although I personally agree with the dust idea. That's just personal preference though.

-Bookshelves
Should be getting your bookshelf back, period. No special tools required.

Long story short, silk touch is a total waste of time.. and doesn't belong in the game. Why the heck should we have to use a "special" enchanted tool to collect blocks we should be able to collect anyway?

Am I seriously the only one thinking this?

Well, I think Minecraft was a grand game the way it was, just a bit shaky with bugs, and a few mechanical parts missing (pistons at one point, relays at an earlier point, and still no gear system). I think the recent developments that are story driven have derailed the "thread" of Minecraft. What Minecraft IS. I think the leveling system was all good, and maybe some perks and stuff, but I think that's where things started to trail off. It seems to me, Mojang was just trying to be new and inventive. They couldn't see that it had already been "new" and "inventive" because it brought EXTREME popularity to an ex-unpopular style of game, the sandbox game.

Not saying sandbox games were for unpopular people or nerds, but it was just very "underground" and not well known by the public.

Anyways, I think Mojang just got ahead of itself and started adding more and more features, trying to keep it's audience bedazzled.

Y'know when you were younger and you were talking to your friends and you were talking about how badass your house was gonna be when you become a famous rockstar? You'd be like "Yea, dude. I'd have a mansion on a hill, with a pool." and then your friend would be like "And laser sharks" and then they would just be there. You would reply with "And a turret defense system capable of killing NINJAS!" Eventually you just keep going down the list and you end up with this super long list of **** in your house.

I think that happened to Minecraft. I think Notch loved his toy so much, he started suffocating it. I think there's too much unfinished stuff and I just don't see how they are going to bug test the final build before launch.

Are they gonna.. uhh.. Bug test it at launch then?

Before you say "Internal testing," I would like to point out how extremely good, talented and experienced Mojangs testing team is, but it is currently hiding in a dark corner behind my cat.

Anyways, just my opinion.

I don't like the restrictions that have come to the New RPG heavy 1.9

I agree with the OP.

I like both MMORPGs and building sims.

As a building sim, Minecraft is stellar. As an RPG, it's laughable. It doesn't even count as an MMO, it's just an MO. It doesn't even count as an RPG (um, where are the roles? Unless one of them is "builder"?).

I've got my money's worth out of it (slightly more than one month's subscription to an MMORPG), but I'm very disappointed that building elements are taking a back seat to adventure elements. Good building games are rare these days, whereas RPGs and adventure games are not only a dime a dozen, they've got much better game mechanics and immersive graphics. One could argue that the latter is where the market is, but when I first played Minecraft (before 1.8), there were over 3 million purchases.

If Minecraft NPCs ever send me out to kill 10 creepers, I think I'll barf.

I think Notch should just have 3 different game modes

-Creative: As it is now, perhaps with more blocks

-Survival: With hunger, more stronger mobs and a harder beginning to the game, with more focus on building a secure base and venturing into dangerous terrain for special resources

-Adventure: With many of the new 1.9/1.8 features like enchantments, potions, dragons and realms but more linear with potions usually obtained in chests, unique/exciting mobs e.g. dragons, (Scary) endermen and more strogholds/dungeons/quests. Adventure mode should feel like an actual rpg, where your usually on the move and completing quests.

This should be done because Minecraft has evolved into a wide spectrum of genres and mashing them all into one won't work please different people who play the game for different reasons.

On a side note; people have a right to complain/express their opinion, whatever you see it as but Minecraft is still in development and open to suggestions and changes. Just because you disagree with something doesn't mean you have to flame/troll others.

You could try building it out of half slabs, I don't think snow can spawn on them. Not sure though, it just wouldn't make sense.

Quote from XMdead

I must agree with OP. Up to 1.7.3 the sandbox model of minecraft was something special and unique.

Some people say that Notch always intended to do this, but he didn't say it on the website or reviews, only tweets. Changing it towards RPG might be popular... but it is a complete betrayal of those who bought the old game.

Perhaps the solution will be to split the game one more time:

• Creative
• Survival (1.7.3 plus some of the features of 1.8/1.9)
• Adventure (full 1.9)

i'd go with that. the adventure stuff is interesting kind've, but it is lack-luster and gets boring faster than building does - for me. so being able to have a more construction oriented mode rather than exploring would be nice (though dragons are pretty cool, i must say(the ones that don't eat **** :tongue.gif:)).
and then more building on the construction and such, as more thing to mine is always a plus, more useful objects to make is always a plus. now sure, minecraft doesn't really match with having something like a modern computer in it or something, so i don't think anything past the dark ages makes a whole lot of sense (or maybe right up to the late 1600's?)
pulleys, motors, pumps, simple grading machines, etc i think match the fantasmal feel of minecraft.

while i like survival, with building - i don't really think i purchased this to play a Cuboid version of a hypothetical game of D&D with some Skyrim ;P

but as has been said, most of these additions don't really get in the way of the other playstyles. so i think it's okay for now, just that the last few updates were basically all the fantasy side so much of the community isn't really geared for, and not the constructive side. if future updates catered to both crowds at the same time - there would probably be much less wailing.

So, I've seen this issue been raised in several threads, so I decided to make a dedicated thread about it. I really, really don't get why people are obsessed with the fact that some like to builds grinders.

So far, the "arguments" I've heard, is that they consider this cheating, and that people are lazy for building them. I really want to adress these arguments, becose they have simply no value, what so ever. I am also allmost willing to bet on that, within a few responses of this thread, there will be at least one person repeating one or both of said arguments. Even though I provide a proper response to them now, in addition to providing a few other arguments to be considered by the mob-system "haters".

First of all, this has been stated several times; alot of people play minecraft out of the fact that it allows for building complex structures, functional structures, advanced electrical circuitry like CPUs, printers, piston elevators and railroad stations and drop sorting structures. The amout of players who are attracted towards this type of gameplay is huge, one of the most popular youtube channels about these kinds of builds is ethoslab, and he has 50222 subscribers at the moment, and a total of allmost 9 million views. In addition to that, we have alot of other channels, focusing on technical builds, and alot of these channels have in common that they tend to play on survival, rather than creative.

These people enjoy the game becouse it allows them to make said devices. Why doess this bother you? And again, redstone builds like printers and CPUs don't seem to bother people, but everything wich generates drops doess. Why? Sometimes, it really seems like people are just jealous becouse they can't figure out how to build something like that themselves (I hope that this is not true though).

I have no problem with the fact that people don't build these things themselves. If you like running out mob hunting during night, be my guest. I don't see how this affects me at all. But at the same time, how doess the fact that me and others like to build mob systems, affect you in any way? It's not like we are forcing you to play the game like we do, and all we ask is that you don't force us to play the game as you do. What is the point in calling people cheaters and lazy for enjoying different aspects of the game than you do?

In addition to this, some seem to think that Mojang will remove the possibility of mob systems at some point. I have yet to hear one person provide a good argument as to why this is a good idea. There is, however, some arguments as to why this is a very, very bad idea for Mojang. As I said, people who like to build stuff like this make out a very large sum of the people who play minecraft. Ethos 50 000 subs has a net value of 747500 Euros alone, and make out just a small portion of the people who play the game for the ability to make complex structures alone. Alot of these people would leave minecraft if the ability to make such structures where to be removed, and more importantly, the fact that you can build these things are attracting rather large sums of costumers to the game. In addition, large scale production has added a gameplay element to PVP gaming never seen before in gaming, and the combination between survival mode and complex structures is the same thing. Minecraft has practicly a monopoly on this feature, and it is attracting a large sum of costumers. How can removing said feature in any way be considered a good idea. It is a horrible idea financially, becouse it removes a very large part of the costumer potential.

To give another example. I don't care much for the adventure update, becouse it doesn't appeal to me that much. I tend to play the game mostly as I did pre 1.8. But I can see that it has introdused elements that can appeal to other people, and thus increase the costumer potential in the game as a total. Even though there are parts about it that I dislike, such as the new health system, I see that it can make the game interesting for more people than it annoys, and becouse of that, I welcome it, despite the fact that I find it annoying. But at the moment new features are messing up old features wich attracts alot of players, without making up for it in some way (yes, I am talking about Ender-griefers),and that is by definition a bad choice. But the issue in this thread is NOT endermen, it is to adress the issue of mob systems in total.

I can illustrate it by another example, removing redstone from the game would be a stupid idea also. Alot of people don't use redstone, so It wouldn't affect them, but It would also break the game for alot of people, thus making the costumer potential much smaller. Removing the ability to make mob farms, and automated farms would simply just make minecraft less good than it is today. I see no reasonable point in as to how this is a good idea. Any proper, well thought out response is welcome, but please, restrain from repeating the same arguments I have spent so long to refute. If you are to respond, provide good arguments as to why a: the fact that other people build mob farms bother you, and b: how it is a good idea to remove the feature from the game.

The idea the old game is still here is inaccurate. More like smothered under a whole lot of redundant things. For me the old minecraft died with ender-griefing, and Notches answer to a 'really horrible idea' was to reduce not remove or re-purpose it. Now we have tons of extra things being added that you can not ignore and go back to the roots. Any time a game strays so far from what it originally was that you have replaced it with something else, you have failed your fans that got this game on that original premise.

I would love to see all these things set in such a way they are options not requirements. But most importantly making sure the old spirit of the game lives on has to come first. If Mojang is willing to go with every random thought they have and rush it into game without considering the crowd or fixing it later then we are betrayed. Not a good move for an indie developer.