It's crazy how you were able to improve it the way you did; I highly think it's possible to make a 30K+/hr trap and after that I think it's time I retire on mega-trap building, haha... it already lags enough as it is on my pc.
I finished a trap that's 10 high 20 wide and 45 long and gives a surprisingly good amount of items, if anyone wants the upload/save to mess around with - keep in mind I test them on 100% effectiveness meaning I'm simulating having lit every cave within spawning distance.
Given this information I come out with this theoretical looting strategy:
- Build small house on the bottom of the world in the middle of some ocean.
- Find all caves within 144x144 blocks and light them up / fill them with water
- Choose one chunk 24 blocks away from you and build trap tower there.
- All mobs will spawn there, will spawn there fast and will give you effect nearly as good as chunk0,0 exploit.
- Sinrakin
A practical trap is something that can be built fairly easy, meaning moderate resources and fair knowledge of building the trap is the only thing required - this I'm more than aware of.
The effectiveness of these traps only amounts to how far you go to stop mob spawns elsewhere. When I build my traps, I make them in empty worlds to save the time of having to light up caves. The traps then show you what the full item counts would be if you build it and did maximum lighting around the area said above. You can't expect to just look at one of the traps someone builds in an empty world and rebuild it getting the same results... You have to make sure you light up all caves and surface area at sea level or mountains 100% or you won't get the same results.
That's the actual way a practical trap works, is how easy it is to construct - not how effective it is based on different people's worlds and how they are lit because variables will always make different numbers. If you want to see what a trap can do at 100% potential, testing it in an empty world is the fastest way to do so. After taking that into account, I aim to make the traps as effective, yet as easy to build as possible, as well as others who are working to do so.
We are trying to come up with ideas and solutions to make the traps better, and easier, and more effective - all at the same time. It's hard, and time consuming, often full of failures and mistakes. Don't just keep looking at what's here thinking we automatically say it's the best because we're not doing that, you give yourself the wrong idea thinking that way, we're just aiming to make a better trap in general - something that pushes the game to it's mechanics limit as much as possible while being generally easy to construct in all player aspects.
I just did a 5 minute test with a few fixes, like getting rid of all the Glass... drops can fall through glass and also get stuck inside. I also made the whole room smaller so there is not as much lag. In 60 minutes, this would work out to 28,280 drops....
Do you have a savefile, I'd love to see what you did to get the number up there
Like I said, the Glass traps drops and makes them fall off the water conveyor. I converted all the glass to smoothstone, except around the lighting, you will see.
Did you mean 18k or 28k drops, because I did a 15 minute test and got around 4500 drops. Nice improvement though, you weren't lying about the items getting stuck and falling through glass!
I just did a 5 minute test with a few fixes, like getting rid of all the Glass... drops can fall through glass and also get stuck inside. I also made the whole room smaller so there is not as much lag. In 60 minutes, this would work out to 28,280 drops....
Do you have a savefile, I'd love to see what you did to get the number up there
Ah, good choice of music, it's in my head now too - I see myself successfully eating a bowl of cereal later tonight playing that in my head like I achieved the impossible...
That depends on the area available to spawn though. For example if mobs can't spawn more than 144 blocks from you, and you have that entire area within bedazzled with torches but have a small dark room inside that area limit, mobs will only spawn in that room. Since it's very small though, not many will spawn, but it's still the only available place they can. If you start increasing that dark room though, more mobs will spawn based on the rules of chunks.
You just have to make sure you have the area lit as suggested in mob spawning science, lighting's essential. As far as forcing the mobs to die and gathering items, can you give me a video or download to a save of your trap? If I can look at it I'll tell you what's wrong.
I just finished a 19x19 (length/width) block tower that gave me 9,216 items with 16 floors - I'm doing tests with less floors, but I have a tutorial video on the way later tonight.
I have a trap that's 19x19 in width and length, not sure how high it will be yet but it's already producing very nice item counts - the problem is, I have chutes that spiders tend to climb back up. I'm looking for ideas on how to possibly stop or limit that.
I'm going to start at bedrock and then do a test with 1 floor, then 2 - all the way to sealevel or skyline if needed and record the results, hopefully this will give the builder an option to pick the number of items they'd like an hour and choose how high to build that way.
Let it be known that on 2/2/11 a breakthrough in Mob Spawning Science was made, 100% Modular and Customizable Mob Spawning Towers! Thank Sinstrite!
Also a quick question, how do you approach building these large structures?
You draw up diagrams or just jump in and head first?
I try to draw structures but then sometimes water physics and cacti breaking via adjacent blocks screw up my plans
Honestly I do a lot of forum reading on the mob spawning science and the latest towers before planning a new build. If you have the most updated knowledge that the entire community puts together, of above, and how the mechanics work, then you'll be at the top of your game when making a design. You wanna look at apocalypse_r and his approach, sometimes the better builds come out of improving someone's build, even though my design was sort of new, he still made it better in a practical sense. I'm also taking game design and I've taken architecture in college so I'm used to making a rough-draft of what I'd like to build first. You can do it on paper or in paint, but if you go in with a plan success is just easier.
I'm going to start at bedrock and then do a test with 1 floor, then 2 - all the way to sealevel or skyline if needed and record the results, hopefully this will give the builder an option to pick the number of items they'd like an hour and choose how high to build that way.
Sorry, online classes have the better part of my day. Pretty much to sum it up, there's two main rules I guess people need to keep on their list when making and testing traps:
Rule1 - Area lighting is the key to forcing mobs where you want them.
Rule2 - Gravity is not the answer to effective item farming.
By the way, I was in a Minecraft-mood (romantic, eh?) last night and did some stacking and condensing a bit on the 17k/hr trap and managed to get just over 21.1k items an hour. Since the focus is more about vertical building instead of horizontal now - Almost a cube design, honestly - I'm going to focus on that design combined with the 17k/hr design and pretty much see if I mix it with the design apocalypse_r did, and make something worth a calling practical and effective.
Hmm, you say area lighting, do you mean lighting all the caves above and below and around or just building a tower/cube and placing lighting outside of it?
I've created a new world and I wanna build a QUICK mob trap, emphasis on speed of building not items per hour...what do you suggest?
As far as the trap I'm working on goes, it's a very small cube actually, so the hardest part is going to be lighting all of the caves and surface area where it needs to be. It's probably going to be built on sea-level for easy access, because if it's in the sky or the very bottom, either way there's mob spawning to worry about as far as horizontal spawning is concerned. If you find a large sea though and build the trap in the middle then you can reduce slightly, the amount of caves and surface area to worry about as far as lighting's concerned. That's what I'm thinking anyways, we'll see how it turns out.
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- Build small house on the bottom of the world in the middle of some ocean.
- Find all caves within 144x144 blocks and light them up / fill them with water
- Choose one chunk 24 blocks away from you and build trap tower there.
- All mobs will spawn there, will spawn there fast and will give you effect nearly as good as chunk0,0 exploit.
- Sinrakin
A practical trap is something that can be built fairly easy, meaning moderate resources and fair knowledge of building the trap is the only thing required - this I'm more than aware of.
The effectiveness of these traps only amounts to how far you go to stop mob spawns elsewhere. When I build my traps, I make them in empty worlds to save the time of having to light up caves. The traps then show you what the full item counts would be if you build it and did maximum lighting around the area said above. You can't expect to just look at one of the traps someone builds in an empty world and rebuild it getting the same results... You have to make sure you light up all caves and surface area at sea level or mountains 100% or you won't get the same results.
That's the actual way a practical trap works, is how easy it is to construct - not how effective it is based on different people's worlds and how they are lit because variables will always make different numbers. If you want to see what a trap can do at 100% potential, testing it in an empty world is the fastest way to do so. After taking that into account, I aim to make the traps as effective, yet as easy to build as possible, as well as others who are working to do so.
We are trying to come up with ideas and solutions to make the traps better, and easier, and more effective - all at the same time. It's hard, and time consuming, often full of failures and mistakes. Don't just keep looking at what's here thinking we automatically say it's the best because we're not doing that, you give yourself the wrong idea thinking that way, we're just aiming to make a better trap in general - something that pushes the game to it's mechanics limit as much as possible while being generally easy to construct in all player aspects.
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Did you mean 18k or 28k drops, because I did a 15 minute test and got around 4500 drops. Nice improvement though, you weren't lying about the items getting stuck and falling through glass!
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Floors 02 = 2812/hr
Floors 04 = 6912/hr
Floors 06 = 7820/hr
Floors 07 = 8484/hr
Floors 08 = 9031/hr (current) [most effective next to max]
Floors 16 = 9216/hr (max possible)
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Do you have a savefile, I'd love to see what you did to get the number up there
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I just finished a 19x19 (length/width) block tower that gave me 9,216 items with 16 floors - I'm doing tests with less floors, but I have a tutorial video on the way later tonight.
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Here's the chutes currently:
Side view - chutes are around 18 blocks high
Overview - empty space is air
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Honestly I do a lot of forum reading on the mob spawning science and the latest towers before planning a new build. If you have the most updated knowledge that the entire community puts together, of above, and how the mechanics work, then you'll be at the top of your game when making a design. You wanna look at apocalypse_r and his approach, sometimes the better builds come out of improving someone's build, even though my design was sort of new, he still made it better in a practical sense. I'm also taking game design and I've taken architecture in college so I'm used to making a rough-draft of what I'd like to build first. You can do it on paper or in paint, but if you go in with a plan success is just easier.
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This was awhile back when it started as you see, and things have changed but it still serves the purpose - http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=40917
As far as the trap I'm working on goes, it's a very small cube actually, so the hardest part is going to be lighting all of the caves and surface area where it needs to be. It's probably going to be built on sea-level for easy access, because if it's in the sky or the very bottom, either way there's mob spawning to worry about as far as horizontal spawning is concerned. If you find a large sea though and build the trap in the middle then you can reduce slightly, the amount of caves and surface area to worry about as far as lighting's concerned. That's what I'm thinking anyways, we'll see how it turns out.