I find a useful general rule with mast placement is to put your foremast right at the front. Just a few blocks behind the bow. The mainmast halfway along the ship and the mizzen about three quarters of the way along - i.e. halfway between the mainmast and the stern. If you put them something like that you can't go far wrong. Sometimes the mainmast and mizzen are a bit further back, making for a larger gap between foremast and mainmast. Like on HMS Bellerophon -
From the looks of yours, I'd have put the mainmast and the mizzen both a few blocks further back.
But then that interferes with the stern castle. To me it looks too big and blocky. If you had the side of the hull curving upwards towards it it might look a bit better. Remember, it's all about curves! Also one thing that I'd always say is that if you're building a ship with a large stern castle, then it should have a fairly large forecastle too. They generally went hand in hand and they help to balance out the looks a bit. The best advice I can give for that purpose is to find an image of a ship that you want to emulate and keep it close to hand when you're building. It can really keep you on track for the right sort of shape.
So I suppose my main advice would be smaller stern castle, a bit more of a forecastle and spread the masts a bit more. You've got a good start, and that gives you a good platform to build on. Most shipbuilders who stick at it get a lot better as they go along.
And yeah, I've had a look at your mod thread. Good luck getting it done! I'm still debating with myself whether to put my ships 'out there' just yet. With the new tweaks I'm making I'm starting to feel more and more that some of the older ones need to be reworked before I would be happy letting people download them.
Today's work on Barfleur has been to tweak the stern, add side entrances, install the decks and cannon and start the masts. There's 98 cannon on board like the later armament layout rather than the 90 that the class were built with. The difference is the 8 guns on the quarterdeck.
I'm still messing around with the stern every so often, trying different blocks and patterns. The bumblebee is still my favourite so far, even though it's a slightly awkward "it'll do" favourite.
And as much fun as it is to work on 3-deckers, it's feeling really... chunky I guess compared to the 74 I did. I miss the elegance of doing a two decker. Maybe I'll do more two deckers!
Hey, guys. I know there weren't any age of sail catamarans, but I think they're totally cool. Have our resident ship dudes built any? If not, I'd like to challenge you to do so. Especially if they were in the same theme as the European style you all make.
I'm aware that's a ship with no historical bearing whatsoever, and some of you may vomit at the thought of such a clearly made up ship, but I think it'd be really cool, and if there was anyone that could do it it would be you dudes.
Hey, guys. I know there weren't any age of sail catamarans, but I think they're totally cool. Have our resident ship dudes built any? If not, I'd like to challenge you to do so. Especially if they were in the same theme as the European style you all make.
I'm aware that's a ship with no historical bearing whatsoever, and some of you may vomit at the thought of such a clearly made up ship, but I think it'd be really cool, and if there was anyone that could do it it would be you dudes.
You do, of course, recognize the fact that we are working with 1mx1mx1m blocks, occasionally stepping it up to 50cmx50cmx50cm, but even that doesn't give a whole lot of detail? How about, considering you seem to have lingered here a while, you try it? Confuse encourages building your own ships, so heed his advice!
Anyway, ConfuseACat, I think, if what I see is really the entrance, that you need to move it back a bit. My model of the Victory locates it at the very right-most part below the midships hammock netting, whereas yours is directly amidships.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Discipline, Pride, and Courage. A dangerous combination.
Hey, guys. I know there weren't any age of sail catamarans, but I think they're totally cool. Have our resident ship dudes built any? If not, I'd like to challenge you to do so. Especially if they were in the same theme as the European style you all make.
I'm aware that's a ship with no historical bearing whatsoever, and some of you may vomit at the thought of such a clearly made up ship, but I think it'd be really cool, and if there was anyone that could do it it would be you dudes.
It's possible that really large catamarans were built in antiquity, like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres. But you're right that there weren't any around in Western shipbuilding during the 18th century sort of era that I build in. Even around the world you probably wouldn't have found one bigger than a fishing vessel.
I'm not so convinced of the 'coolness' either. I already build what I think are the cool ships!
Anyway, ConfuseACat, I think, if what I see is really the entrance, that you need to move it back a bit. My model of the Victory locates it at the very right-most part below the midships hammock netting, whereas yours is directly amidships.
Ah yeah. I just threw it in midships. Looking at a nice big photo of Victory it seems to be in place of one of the gunports, where I just squeezed it in between two gunports. I'm not putting it in place of one of the gunports because that would throw off my carefully planned cannon count! I might move it, but I'm also seriously considering just getting rid of it entirely. The pictures I've found of the Barfleur class (paintings, models etc.) don't seem to show one at all.
It's possible that really large catamarans were built in antiquity, like http://en.wikipedia....Tessarakonteres. But you're right that there weren't any around in Western shipbuilding during the 18th century sort of era that I build in. Even around the world you probably wouldn't have found one bigger than a fishing vessel.
I'm not so convinced of the 'coolness' either. I already build what I think are the cool ships!
Ah yeah. I just threw it in midships. Looking at a nice big photo of Victory it seems to be in place of one of the gunports, where I just squeezed it in between two gunports. I'm not putting it in place of one of the gunports because that would throw off my carefully planned cannon count! I might move it, but I'm also seriously considering just getting rid of it entirely. The pictures I've found of the Barfleur class (paintings, models etc.) don't seem to show one at all.
They're very minor anyway, but it is still handy, say, in a Minecraft port to climb up the sides and get in, because you can't hop over fence gunwales.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Discipline, Pride, and Courage. A dangerous combination.
I made a schooner!
Idk about it, i think it's better than my last one, and made it very fast, also it's very compact (may be bad or good)
Idk about proportions but i think it looks good this time i used an image
Off to make a... hmm...
i think i'll try a frigate...
They're very minor anyway, but it is still handy, say, in a Minecraft port to climb up the sides and get in, because you can't hop over fence gunwales.
True. I might try out what I've seen in a few picures of models of the Barfleur, with a little platform off the side of the ship at around the level of the middle gundeck and a ladder going up to the gunwale. I'd probably stick a fence gate in at the top.
Ultimately the method I'll go with will be whichever one is less noticeable, which will probably be the side entrance. But I feel like I ought to try out the more accurate way for the class as well. Which is almost silly since I'm only using it for inspiration rather than a direct copy!
Drago, the shape's looking good. The draught looks like it could be a little shallow though, so you might want to consider making it a bit deeper. Remember that the ship's weight should be equal to the weight of the amount of water the ship displaces, so you need a decent amount of hull underwater.
Another update on my 2nd rate - she's masted and rigged. I don't think I've fitted out the orlop or added ballast to the hold yet, but once I've done that I'll put her into the water then copy and paste to do a version with sails.
Looking good. Does she have furnished interiors? That's the most annoying part for me!
She does now! Just done them. I agree they're not the most fun part.
I've come across some annoyances relating to my upgrade from 1.2.5 to 1.4.5
1) I think my combo of single player commands and optifine is glitching my graphics, giving me strobe-vanishing-chunk-syndrome
2) Bats are constantly getting in my way
3) World Edit can't seem to copy and paste between worlds any more. I don't know why, but when I copy then load a different world and try to paste it says there's no data on the clipboard.
Number 3's the real breaker for me. I build the ships in a superflat map then copy and paste them into another map. My second rate is stuck hovering over a superflat expanse of grassy nothingness. If I don't fix it soon I'm downgrading. Luckily I backed up my good old 1.2.5 folder! Annoyingly there are some of the newer features I wanted to play around with...
I have made the Hull of my frigate, Hows it look (and did i put the sails in a good place?)
Also is the size good because i think it's way too big, idk it might look better in the water.
Also where should i put the entrance to the lower decks, and how were they made , i've never seen a good look at a frigate.
I have made the Hull of my frigate, Hows it look (and did i put the sails in a good place?)
Also is the size good because i think it's way too big, idk it might look better in the water.
Also where should i put the entrance to the lower decks, and how were they made , i've never seen a good look at a frigate.
I suggest making your own shipyard thread, it will be easier to get viewed.
@ConfuseACat I still run on 1.2,
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Discipline, Pride, and Courage. A dangerous combination.
Nice! I like how you edited the moon in one of the pictures
Thanks, but I didn't do anything to it. That's just the KDS Photorealism moon, with the screenshot zoomed in using ctrl.
Drago, what do you mean by the entrance to the lower decks? The side entrances on the middle gun deck that you see on 3-deckers aren't needed, because the frigates were much lower and the gangplanks could be set straight from the deck to the gunwale. Within the ship men would usually move between the decks on very steep staircase/ladder things. The sort of thing where you can just about walk down it like a set of stairs if you're careful. Generally I just use ladders.
And for the masts, they're pretty good. Normally I'd try to have a slightly bigger gap between the foremast and the mainmast and a slightly smaller gap between the mainmast and the mizzen.
Thanks to some pointers in the Single Player Commands thread I've fixed my copy and pasting between worlds by copying, saving as a schematic, changing world, loading schematic and pasting. It's a couple more steps, but it means that once I've selected a different area getting my ship on the clipboard again is as simple as loading my schematic rather than having to find an instance of it and selecting the area again.
At the moment my 2nd rate sails version has the sails modelled from the bowsprit back to the foremast. I'll probably do the mainmast and mizzen tomorrow. But for now, here she is at anchor, a shot taken from the stern of Vanguard.
And I've just been thinking about the differences between 1st rates and 2nd rates. In real life, the numbers of cannon were almost the same. My Barfleur is a 98 and most RN 1st rates of the time only had a handful of cannons over 100. The real difference between a 1st and a 2nd was the construction; a 1st rate was normally built heavier and sturdier so that many of those 100 cannon were heavier than those carried by a 2nd. But here in minecraft I couldn't exactly replicate that construction. So I've been left in a situation where if I add a couple more cannons to this ship I can just call it a 1st rate. That feels wrong. I built a 2nd rate, I shouldn't be able to convert it to a 1st just by adding a couple of cannon!
My 2nd rate is now finished. As usual, all the screenshots are in the first post. Here's one of them.
I might just do another merchantman next, as I'm quite aware that all my navy ships have a very similar look to them. On purpose of course, to form them into a nice uniform battle squadron. But it does mean that they all look a bit same-y even with the improvements I've been making to my hull designs.
I'd really quite like to do a better 1st rate. The one I have at the moment is my very first ship and although I hit on a good way of doing the masts/rigging/sails pretty much straight away, I'm really starting to dislike several things about the hull. In order to make a new 1st rate noticeably different than this 2nd rate I might base it on the French Ocean class of 120 guns, at least that way the gun decks will be a bit longer than the 2nd rate's and you might be able to tell them apart!
But before that I may just do a nice little brigantine or something. I'm also tempted to step outside of my time period a bit and do my own version of John Blackthorne's Erasmus from the novel Shōgun. And possibly do a second 74, or an 80. Perhaps a 32 gun 5th rate to go alongside my 44 gun razee. A bomb vessel, a schooner, a ship-sloop... So many ships to build!
From the looks of yours, I'd have put the mainmast and the mizzen both a few blocks further back.
But then that interferes with the stern castle. To me it looks too big and blocky. If you had the side of the hull curving upwards towards it it might look a bit better. Remember, it's all about curves! Also one thing that I'd always say is that if you're building a ship with a large stern castle, then it should have a fairly large forecastle too. They generally went hand in hand and they help to balance out the looks a bit. The best advice I can give for that purpose is to find an image of a ship that you want to emulate and keep it close to hand when you're building. It can really keep you on track for the right sort of shape.
So I suppose my main advice would be smaller stern castle, a bit more of a forecastle and spread the masts a bit more. You've got a good start, and that gives you a good platform to build on. Most shipbuilders who stick at it get a lot better as they go along.
And yeah, I've had a look at your mod thread. Good luck getting it done! I'm still debating with myself whether to put my ships 'out there' just yet. With the new tweaks I'm making I'm starting to feel more and more that some of the older ones need to be reworked before I would be happy letting people download them.
Today's work on Barfleur has been to tweak the stern, add side entrances, install the decks and cannon and start the masts. There's 98 cannon on board like the later armament layout rather than the 90 that the class were built with. The difference is the 8 guns on the quarterdeck.
I'm still messing around with the stern every so often, trying different blocks and patterns. The bumblebee is still my favourite so far, even though it's a slightly awkward "it'll do" favourite.
And as much fun as it is to work on 3-deckers, it's feeling really... chunky I guess compared to the 74 I did. I miss the elegance of doing a two decker. Maybe I'll do more two deckers!
I'm aware that's a ship with no historical bearing whatsoever, and some of you may vomit at the thought of such a clearly made up ship, but I think it'd be really cool, and if there was anyone that could do it it would be you dudes.
You do, of course, recognize the fact that we are working with 1mx1mx1m blocks, occasionally stepping it up to 50cmx50cmx50cm, but even that doesn't give a whole lot of detail? How about, considering you seem to have lingered here a while, you try it? Confuse encourages building your own ships, so heed his advice!
Anyway, ConfuseACat, I think, if what I see is really the entrance, that you need to move it back a bit. My model of the Victory locates it at the very right-most part below the midships hammock netting, whereas yours is directly amidships.
It's possible that really large catamarans were built in antiquity, like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres. But you're right that there weren't any around in Western shipbuilding during the 18th century sort of era that I build in. Even around the world you probably wouldn't have found one bigger than a fishing vessel.
I'm not so convinced of the 'coolness' either. I already build what I think are the cool ships!
Ah yeah. I just threw it in midships. Looking at a nice big photo of Victory it seems to be in place of one of the gunports, where I just squeezed it in between two gunports. I'm not putting it in place of one of the gunports because that would throw off my carefully planned cannon count! I might move it, but I'm also seriously considering just getting rid of it entirely. The pictures I've found of the Barfleur class (paintings, models etc.) don't seem to show one at all.
They're very minor anyway, but it is still handy, say, in a Minecraft port to climb up the sides and get in, because you can't hop over fence gunwales.
Idk about it, i think it's better than my last one, and made it very fast, also it's very compact (may be bad or good)
Idk about proportions but i think it looks good this time i used an image
Off to make a... hmm...
i think i'll try a frigate...
(using this picture :http://www.google.co...9,r:8,s:0,i:108)
True. I might try out what I've seen in a few picures of models of the Barfleur, with a little platform off the side of the ship at around the level of the middle gundeck and a ladder going up to the gunwale. I'd probably stick a fence gate in at the top.
Ultimately the method I'll go with will be whichever one is less noticeable, which will probably be the side entrance. But I feel like I ought to try out the more accurate way for the class as well. Which is almost silly since I'm only using it for inspiration rather than a direct copy!
Drago, the shape's looking good. The draught looks like it could be a little shallow though, so you might want to consider making it a bit deeper. Remember that the ship's weight should be equal to the weight of the amount of water the ship displaces, so you need a decent amount of hull underwater.
Alright, alright, I'm coming over!
She does now! Just done them. I agree they're not the most fun part.
I've come across some annoyances relating to my upgrade from 1.2.5 to 1.4.5
1) I think my combo of single player commands and optifine is glitching my graphics, giving me strobe-vanishing-chunk-syndrome
2) Bats are constantly getting in my way
3) World Edit can't seem to copy and paste between worlds any more. I don't know why, but when I copy then load a different world and try to paste it says there's no data on the clipboard.
Number 3's the real breaker for me. I build the ships in a superflat map then copy and paste them into another map. My second rate is stuck hovering over a superflat expanse of grassy nothingness. If I don't fix it soon I'm downgrading. Luckily I backed up my good old 1.2.5 folder! Annoyingly there are some of the newer features I wanted to play around with...
Also is the size good because i think it's way too big, idk it might look better in the water.
Also where should i put the entrance to the lower decks, and how were they made , i've never seen a good look at a frigate.
I suggest making your own shipyard thread, it will be easier to get viewed.
@ConfuseACat I still run on 1.2,
Well i just trying to get better and better with your guys opinions, cause you guys are awesome
then i might once i perfect my ships
But you will be more likely to get visits from all shipbuilders here, because Confuse and myself are the only ones who are extremely frequently here.
Well then i get more awesome opinions
Thanks, but I didn't do anything to it. That's just the KDS Photorealism moon, with the screenshot zoomed in using ctrl.
Drago, what do you mean by the entrance to the lower decks? The side entrances on the middle gun deck that you see on 3-deckers aren't needed, because the frigates were much lower and the gangplanks could be set straight from the deck to the gunwale. Within the ship men would usually move between the decks on very steep staircase/ladder things. The sort of thing where you can just about walk down it like a set of stairs if you're careful. Generally I just use ladders.
And for the masts, they're pretty good. Normally I'd try to have a slightly bigger gap between the foremast and the mainmast and a slightly smaller gap between the mainmast and the mizzen.
Thanks to some pointers in the Single Player Commands thread I've fixed my copy and pasting between worlds by copying, saving as a schematic, changing world, loading schematic and pasting. It's a couple more steps, but it means that once I've selected a different area getting my ship on the clipboard again is as simple as loading my schematic rather than having to find an instance of it and selecting the area again.
At the moment my 2nd rate sails version has the sails modelled from the bowsprit back to the foremast. I'll probably do the mainmast and mizzen tomorrow. But for now, here she is at anchor, a shot taken from the stern of Vanguard.
And I've just been thinking about the differences between 1st rates and 2nd rates. In real life, the numbers of cannon were almost the same. My Barfleur is a 98 and most RN 1st rates of the time only had a handful of cannons over 100. The real difference between a 1st and a 2nd was the construction; a 1st rate was normally built heavier and sturdier so that many of those 100 cannon were heavier than those carried by a 2nd. But here in minecraft I couldn't exactly replicate that construction. So I've been left in a situation where if I add a couple more cannons to this ship I can just call it a 1st rate. That feels wrong. I built a 2nd rate, I shouldn't be able to convert it to a 1st just by adding a couple of cannon!
I might just do another merchantman next, as I'm quite aware that all my navy ships have a very similar look to them. On purpose of course, to form them into a nice uniform battle squadron. But it does mean that they all look a bit same-y even with the improvements I've been making to my hull designs.
I'd really quite like to do a better 1st rate. The one I have at the moment is my very first ship and although I hit on a good way of doing the masts/rigging/sails pretty much straight away, I'm really starting to dislike several things about the hull. In order to make a new 1st rate noticeably different than this 2nd rate I might base it on the French Ocean class of 120 guns, at least that way the gun decks will be a bit longer than the 2nd rate's and you might be able to tell them apart!
But before that I may just do a nice little brigantine or something. I'm also tempted to step outside of my time period a bit and do my own version of John Blackthorne's Erasmus from the novel Shōgun. And possibly do a second 74, or an 80. Perhaps a 32 gun 5th rate to go alongside my 44 gun razee. A bomb vessel, a schooner, a ship-sloop... So many ships to build!