Not to mention just for the sake of having a look for myself I went and checked it out.
No.
The graphics are terrible. Although I use texture packs(I hate the glass texture) Minecraft's graphics are what brought the charm into the game, and what keeps it going. The simplicity. You can bring in all this techy high quality epic graphics ******** in another game, but Minecraft will ALWAYS be Minecraft.
Legos are still the same as I remember from when I was a kid.
The same plastic material.
Same bumps.
Only thing that's changed? More pieces, more variety, more things to build with. but you still have the same old plastic block with bumps on it.
This is what Minecraft has. I surely hope Notch NEVER changes the simpleness that is Minecraft.
This is what I am afraid of, I don't want Notch to add enchantments spells, alchemy and whatever the **** hes doing.
You can use the EXACT same Minecraft textures in Manic Miner, porting is extremely easy, so for people complaining about the graphics, it doesn't matter.
fun fact: nobodys forcing you to use a feature, instead of being against an update because you dont like it, you could be less selfish and let it come, just dont use it
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By reading this, you agree to give me your house, money, xbox 360, soul, contents of your fridge, rigged d20, and wizard hat
Quote from TKuja1 »
Sand and water?
Thats what you use to protect yourself from radiation?
I to have checked into this Manic Digger. I don't think I have ever seen such a blatant clone of a game ever. I mean seriously. Games copy off each other all the time, but never have I seen a game that basically IS the game it's ripping off of. It's one thing to borrow the basic idea(that being sandbox game that you can build in), it's totally another to just clone the game. Manic Digger is nothing but some guy unable to create something for himself.
Is it possible Manic Digger could one day become better? Sure, but like many have already said...the original is always better. It's like after the success of Diablo 2, crap tons of games sprung up to leech off the success of hack and slash rpgs(not saying Diablo created them, but it definitely put it out in the open for everyone to see). None of those games are as fun and fulfilling as the original.
Did Notch come up with the idea for a sandbox builder? Of course not, but he took the idea, shaped it into his image, and came up with something that over 200,000 people enjoy. Manic Digger can even come up with new, innovative ideas for the genre...It will always be a clone, nothing more.
It's just like Torchlight 1 & 2 vs Diablo 3. Torchlight is just a clone, it's like a big firework; it will make a loud boom, shoot up and light up the sky with pretty colors, and every one will go "ooohhh! Ahhh!!" at the spectacle. But a clone will always cower in the shadow of the original, no matter how much some people don't like the changes the new version of it may bring.
Manic Digger is so similar to Minecraft, I am surprised Notch hasn't taken legal action against them.
They sued and got a third party version of their software removed from the net.
Besides this alternate client thing is stupid. You do realize its the server software that matters here right? Having an alternate client won't get you new/different features. The most it would get you is a free way to connect to minecraft servers.
As for Manic Digger itself? I absolutely hate its crafting system, that turned me off right there. Also you really can't sue for someone stealing your idea for a video game, thank god, keeps developers on their toes.
Bad assumptions:
1) It's open sources so development will never stop. WRONG: Developers can easily lose interest, especially when they aren't being paid for their time, and the project isn't directly useful to their daily life (ie. not a development tool they use).
2) It's open source so some will just fork and continue work. WRONG: While this does happen it's definitely not a given, and with something as complex as a game, its hard for new people to maintain quality right away.
3) DOTA games where made by large companies who "ripped off the idea". WRONG: most of the DOTA games are made by startups run by developers of the Starcraft maps themselves. It's more like the Manic Digger guy deciding to creating Minecraft then the other way around.
It's just like Torchlight 1 & 2 vs Diablo 3. Torchlight is just a clone, it's like a big firework; it will make a loud boom, shoot up and light up the sky with pretty colors, and every one will go "ooohhh! Ahhh!!" at the spectacle. But a clone will always cower in the shadow of the original, no matter how much some people don't like the changes the new version of it may bring.
Funny thing about that actually. Torchlight was made by some of the veteran designers of Diablo I & II.
I'm not saying it isn't a clone, but the perspective changes a little when the people are cloning one of their own creations.
An expected response on a forum full of fags that rage at notch for not updating and utterly suck up to him in defence against those who are raging at him for not updating should have been what you received; If you were expecting any other reaction you're an idiot.
Also, people have already paid for this and there's a rolling community of more than 200,000 accounts. People scarcely migrate from something they've already paid for to something both inferior and inhabited by people who are apparently as idiotic as you
Oh and may I remind you, Minecraft was inspired by Infiniminer. Cheap knock off of Minecraft that Manic Digger is, Minecraft is merely Infiniminer with a lot more features
Funny thing about that actually. Torchlight was made by some of the veteran designers of Diablo I & II.
I'm not saying it isn't a clone, but the perspective changes a little when the people are cloning one of their own creations.
Yes that is true, but it's not all of them, and it's not just their creation. Many of those former Blizzard North Employees went off to work on Guild Wars, and most of the more prominent ones went on to create Hellgate: London.
What Torchlight is, is some of those guys falling back on what they know how to do, because what they tried to do failed. So, they cloned Diablo. So much so that the level design actually follows that of Diablo 3. It's very obvious that they are just trying to bank on fans being impatient for Diablo 3. (and is working sadly) It's really funny to, Torchlight 2 is coming out in early 2011, and in the list of features....it will effectively have everything Diablo 2 had 10 years ago :tongue.gif:
Clones are clones, and they will never have the money, power, or motivation to live up to the original. Notch may be pretty much a one man team, but he has motivation. Minecraft is his baby, and although he can't always take care of it, you can bet he has plans within plans working in the sweet balding head of his.
All this clamor is just happening because people are being bitchy because they think because they paid for the game they should get updates every week. Notch doesn't promise updates, he promises that you paid for a pre-order - that you own the game already when the price is higher and the game is officially released. People need to sit back and be patient. The only reason Notch adds content to the game right now, is because he enjoys doing it. He enjoys giving us new things to explore, play with, or create.
You can't enjoy something if your stressed out and tired. Notch has been traveling in the last month, only to come home and have things start blowing up in his face with paypal issues, trying to start a real company, and then because he loves us all so much(and with as much money as he has made, you can bet he does), he tried to release an update for us which ended up causing more problems because he was so worn out. The man deserves a weekend without Minecraft. Everyone should chill out, and go play the bloody game.
(this all wasn't directed at you lightning, I was just ranting in general.)
Lets take a look at the two fairly and add in some notes about Dota.
Manic Digger is clearly developing at a much faster rate than Minecraft. This is mainly due to available time spent and available manpower. Manic Digger also looks to be a more stable game. However the problem here is that Manic Digger is a clear ripoff of the idea that Minecraft is. Because Minecraft is not under any protections, other than the owner's copyright (As far as I know), it is possible for this idea to be copyrighted and protected under multi-national copyright laws, but it doesn't prevent people from still making clones. Manic Digger is also open-source, and free, providing the community to expand and create their own modifications, if they harness the skill to do so.
Minecraft has been in development for quite some time. The development time is fairly slow. This is because of the limited manpower and time spent in developing this game. This is an unfortunate circumstance that Notch chooses to place himself in, and will continually compound the stress upon him. Notch has made over $500,000 easily since the start of his game, giving him plenty of financial backing to progress the game at any pace he chooses to do. Minecraft has an extremely large community, and recently was expanded tremendously by the help of free advertisement via livestream accounts from professional competitive gamers, youtube accounts, blogs, and game review sites. This not including person to person word of mouth.
Which of the two is the better choice?
The first choice gives you the freedom to expand upon the game however you want, so long as you possess the needed skill. It is also a clear ripoff of the original title, giving question to the motives behind the creators of Manic Digger and calling into question their professional reputation. However, the game is completely free, and will continue to rise so long as they don't "screw up".
The second choice, Minecraft, will one day be open-source. It currently costs a rough $12.00 USD. This is an extremely low one time payment (If you buy during Alpha) compared to more modern systems of payment (60 for a title and possibly monthly fees for other titles). Minecraft has a heavily devoted fanbase and a very dedicated developer. Minecraft also has the financial resources to continue, probably indefinitely, with development.
Which would I choose?
I choose the original. I prefer not to play a game that could become involved in potential copyright infringement practices, nor do I wish to participate in a community that supports stealing other individuals intellectual ideas, regardless of whether or not that idea is protected under national or international laws.
Regarding Dota.
Dota was created by an individual known to the LOL community as Pendragon. Pendragon created Dota. Riot hired Pendragon to make a spin-off of his own creation into a new genre, MOBA. There is no point in using this story to relate to your Manic Digger situation, because it has nothing to do with it. The only thing I see here happening with Manic Digger, is a clear ripoff of the original artist in an attempt to build upon one's own portfolio. The developer/s would be better off helping build upon Minecraft, rather than trying to split a community up, cause flame wars, and cause inter-gaming community chaos.
Leandro, Notch is currently creating a company, dealing with server downtime and Paypal problems, and, yes, attempting to release updates. Manic Digger is a blatant ripoff of Minecraft (even if it is open-source), with terrible-looking, unpolished graphics, that hasn't updated since a July update that introduced SHADOWS. It has had less development time than Minecraft, but there's no fanbase (understandably), several of the textures (TNT anyone?) are ripped directly from Minecraft, and others are only slightly edited, and the developers seem to have abandoned it. You want Notch to update more often, but you also only want him to do exactly what you want, and nothing else. Notch does listen to what fans want, but he also has his own ideas, and has the ability to put what he wants into his OWN CREATION. Personally, I think that the 13 dollars I spent on this were 13 dollars well spent. If Notch stopped updating right now, I would not be angry, because I would still have a fun game more than worth 13 dollars.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I think reality stays at the door when you have creepy frog girls that don't move properly and react to pain with a mysteriously deep grunt."-Varriount
Oh, shut the **** uo all of you.
If people want to like Manic Digger, they can like it.
Must I remind you that Minecraft is a copy of Infiniminer?
Do I see any people trolling about how Infiniminer is ages better than minecraft? No. Yet that's exactly what you're doing for Manic Digger.
Personally, I like Manic Digger, and think it's a pretty damn good game.
@Kahai: Manic Digger works perfectly fine for me and lots of other people, so anything that goes wrong is your fault, not the fault of the creators of Manic Digger.
@X52: Fail troll is fail. There are no toilets in Manic Digger, even though I'm pretty sure a toilet has better graphics, since it's REAL LIFE.
Medic, Minecraft was INSPIRED by Infiniminer. It has proceeded to take an entirely new direction, and introduce new ideas. Manic Digger is a RIPOFF of Minecraft. It has identical graphics, and is introducing nothing new, only putting in worse versions of features Minecraft already has.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I think reality stays at the door when you have creepy frog girls that don't move properly and react to pain with a mysteriously deep grunt."-Varriount
Ya know, it gets really irritating when people whine about a lack of updates. You'd think Notch signed over his life and soul to the development of the game when people paid for it, and he must now spend every waking hour working on Minecraft.
Geez, let the guy take a break and mentally unwind... he's done an amazing amount of work so far, and his servers just went Chernobyl on him last week. I can't blame him for wanting a breather. If the lack of updates were to continue for 2-3 months, THEN I'd start to be concerned for the future of Minecraft; honestly, I want him to take a break, so he doesn't get burnt out, because I've personally suffered coding burnout, and lost a $20k contract due to it -- burnout sucks... and yet you still feel like sh** for not working on the project you know you should be working on.
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Quote from Lukedude100 »
Im 13 and I have a verified PayPal. I put my OWN money on it and I used it to buy the game. I'm sure you can figure out a way to buy it.
Not to mention just for the sake of having a look for myself I went and checked it out.
No.
The graphics are terrible. Although I use texture packs(I hate the glass texture) Minecraft's graphics are what brought the charm into the game, and what keeps it going. The simplicity. You can bring in all this techy high quality epic graphics ******** in another game, but Minecraft will ALWAYS be Minecraft.
Legos are still the same as I remember from when I was a kid.
The same plastic material.
Same bumps.
Only thing that's changed? More pieces, more variety, more things to build with. but you still have the same old plastic block with bumps on it.
This is what Minecraft has. I surely hope Notch NEVER changes the simpleness that is Minecraft.
This is what I am afraid of, I don't want Notch to add enchantments spells, alchemy and whatever the **** hes doing.
You can use the EXACT same Minecraft textures in Manic Miner, porting is extremely easy, so for people complaining about the graphics, it doesn't matter.
I dont for a second believe that Notch adding things like enchantments or alchemy will do anything other than make Minecraft EVEN BETTER. Why? Because, through playing Minecraft so far, I've already seen that Notch very DEFINITELY knows what he's doing when it comes to game design. If he wants to add enchantments, you better believe it'll be freaking grand, cause chances are, it will be.
Now, on the note of this whole Manic Digger thing.... frankly I think the whole thing is silly. Game "clones" are an old practice. Old old old. Been going on since the Golden Age of arcades. And frankly, it often can end up being a good thing. The clones CAN become good games in their own right, but as a rule, never will surpass the original. It's happened over and over and over again throughout the years, and will continue to happen more. There's not a whole lot of point in complaining about it. Manic Digger could become a fine game in it's own right. Totally possible. And if it does, I doubt it'll steal sales from Minecraft at all.
But I also just plain have faith in THIS game and Notch's ability to design and improve it. I cant see anything topping Minecraft anytime soon, and that includes clones of it.
Oh, shut the **** uo all of you.
If people want to like Manic Digger, they can like it.
Must I remind you that Minecraft is a copy of Infiniminer?
Do I see any people trolling about how Infiniminer is ages better than minecraft? No. Yet that's exactly what you're doing for Manic Digger.
Personally, I like Manic Digger, and think it's a pretty damn good game.
@Kahai: Manic Digger works perfectly fine for me and lots of other people, so anything that goes wrong is your fault, not the fault of the creators of Manic Digger.
@X52: Fail troll is fail. There are no toilets in Manic Digger, even though I'm pretty sure a toilet has better graphics, since it's REAL LIFE.
Minecraft is not a copy of Infiniminer. I've seen that game.... they really dont look much alike. but yes, Minecraft was at least inspired by it. I think alot of people's problems with Manic Digger is that currently it looks almost EXACTLY like Minecraft, right down to the look of the trees. Now, dont get me wrong. As I said up above I have no issues with clone games. It's like with Pac-Man. That's a great game. And there's a bazillion clones of it. And that's fine, cause it means there's even more fun games of that type I can play. Right now though, Manic Digger has nothing to really seperate it from Minecraft, except for the fact that right now there's very, very little to do in it (yes, I've tried it), and it doesnt work all that well right now.
As such, I dont think it's all that good of a game yet. I cant really judge it until there's more of it there. But right now, it doesnt compare to Minecraft, which has alot more going on.
Anyone who attempts to defend Manic Digger by saying Minecraft copied Infiminer is fial.
In the art world, people get inspired by other things. Notch was obviously inspired by Infiminer, as he said so. But he took the game in a different direction. He was inspired, then made it his own. Manic Digger did not. Manic Digger saw Minecraft, then took it, and copied it. There is no "other" direction, it's the same thing.
/thread
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People who build absolutely stunning objects of fantastic creativity, those who are the leaders in what you can only imagine to accomplish in the infinite possibility that is Minecraft, I applaud you.
Not trying to defend anything of Manic Digger here, but it's only a violation because it's specifically in the ToS.
Steampunk Pack - Steampunk textures.
Frenden's Texture Pack - Nice simple 16x16 texture pack.
Alchemy - *drool* Yesss...
fun fact: nobodys forcing you to use a feature, instead of being against an update because you dont like it, you could be less selfish and let it come, just dont use it
Is it possible Manic Digger could one day become better? Sure, but like many have already said...the original is always better. It's like after the success of Diablo 2, crap tons of games sprung up to leech off the success of hack and slash rpgs(not saying Diablo created them, but it definitely put it out in the open for everyone to see). None of those games are as fun and fulfilling as the original.
Did Notch come up with the idea for a sandbox builder? Of course not, but he took the idea, shaped it into his image, and came up with something that over 200,000 people enjoy. Manic Digger can even come up with new, innovative ideas for the genre...It will always be a clone, nothing more.
It's just like Torchlight 1 & 2 vs Diablo 3. Torchlight is just a clone, it's like a big firework; it will make a loud boom, shoot up and light up the sky with pretty colors, and every one will go "ooohhh! Ahhh!!" at the spectacle. But a clone will always cower in the shadow of the original, no matter how much some people don't like the changes the new version of it may bring.
Manic Digger is so similar to Minecraft, I am surprised Notch hasn't taken legal action against them.
They sued and got a third party version of their software removed from the net.
Besides this alternate client thing is stupid. You do realize its the server software that matters here right? Having an alternate client won't get you new/different features. The most it would get you is a free way to connect to minecraft servers.
As for Manic Digger itself? I absolutely hate its crafting system, that turned me off right there. Also you really can't sue for someone stealing your idea for a video game, thank god, keeps developers on their toes.
1) It's open sources so development will never stop. WRONG: Developers can easily lose interest, especially when they aren't being paid for their time, and the project isn't directly useful to their daily life (ie. not a development tool they use).
2) It's open source so some will just fork and continue work. WRONG: While this does happen it's definitely not a given, and with something as complex as a game, its hard for new people to maintain quality right away.
3) DOTA games where made by large companies who "ripped off the idea". WRONG: most of the DOTA games are made by startups run by developers of the Starcraft maps themselves. It's more like the Manic Digger guy deciding to creating Minecraft then the other way around.
Funny thing about that actually. Torchlight was made by some of the veteran designers of Diablo I & II.
I'm not saying it isn't a clone, but the perspective changes a little when the people are cloning one of their own creations.
lol
---
@ the one that started this mess, how is this:
a better game?
fails on opening of single player instantly.
Yes that is true, but it's not all of them, and it's not just their creation. Many of those former Blizzard North Employees went off to work on Guild Wars, and most of the more prominent ones went on to create Hellgate: London.
What Torchlight is, is some of those guys falling back on what they know how to do, because what they tried to do failed. So, they cloned Diablo. So much so that the level design actually follows that of Diablo 3. It's very obvious that they are just trying to bank on fans being impatient for Diablo 3. (and is working sadly) It's really funny to, Torchlight 2 is coming out in early 2011, and in the list of features....it will effectively have everything Diablo 2 had 10 years ago :tongue.gif:
Clones are clones, and they will never have the money, power, or motivation to live up to the original. Notch may be pretty much a one man team, but he has motivation. Minecraft is his baby, and although he can't always take care of it, you can bet he has plans within plans working in the sweet balding head of his.
All this clamor is just happening because people are being bitchy because they think because they paid for the game they should get updates every week. Notch doesn't promise updates, he promises that you paid for a pre-order - that you own the game already when the price is higher and the game is officially released. People need to sit back and be patient. The only reason Notch adds content to the game right now, is because he enjoys doing it. He enjoys giving us new things to explore, play with, or create.
You can't enjoy something if your stressed out and tired. Notch has been traveling in the last month, only to come home and have things start blowing up in his face with paypal issues, trying to start a real company, and then because he loves us all so much(and with as much money as he has made, you can bet he does), he tried to release an update for us which ended up causing more problems because he was so worn out. The man deserves a weekend without Minecraft. Everyone should chill out, and go play the bloody game.
(this all wasn't directed at you lightning, I was just ranting in general.)
Manic Digger is clearly developing at a much faster rate than Minecraft. This is mainly due to available time spent and available manpower. Manic Digger also looks to be a more stable game. However the problem here is that Manic Digger is a clear ripoff of the idea that Minecraft is. Because Minecraft is not under any protections, other than the owner's copyright (As far as I know), it is possible for this idea to be copyrighted and protected under multi-national copyright laws, but it doesn't prevent people from still making clones. Manic Digger is also open-source, and free, providing the community to expand and create their own modifications, if they harness the skill to do so.
Minecraft has been in development for quite some time. The development time is fairly slow. This is because of the limited manpower and time spent in developing this game. This is an unfortunate circumstance that Notch chooses to place himself in, and will continually compound the stress upon him. Notch has made over $500,000 easily since the start of his game, giving him plenty of financial backing to progress the game at any pace he chooses to do. Minecraft has an extremely large community, and recently was expanded tremendously by the help of free advertisement via livestream accounts from professional competitive gamers, youtube accounts, blogs, and game review sites. This not including person to person word of mouth.
Which of the two is the better choice?
The first choice gives you the freedom to expand upon the game however you want, so long as you possess the needed skill. It is also a clear ripoff of the original title, giving question to the motives behind the creators of Manic Digger and calling into question their professional reputation. However, the game is completely free, and will continue to rise so long as they don't "screw up".
The second choice, Minecraft, will one day be open-source. It currently costs a rough $12.00 USD. This is an extremely low one time payment (If you buy during Alpha) compared to more modern systems of payment (60 for a title and possibly monthly fees for other titles). Minecraft has a heavily devoted fanbase and a very dedicated developer. Minecraft also has the financial resources to continue, probably indefinitely, with development.
Which would I choose?
I choose the original. I prefer not to play a game that could become involved in potential copyright infringement practices, nor do I wish to participate in a community that supports stealing other individuals intellectual ideas, regardless of whether or not that idea is protected under national or international laws.
Regarding Dota.
Dota was created by an individual known to the LOL community as Pendragon. Pendragon created Dota. Riot hired Pendragon to make a spin-off of his own creation into a new genre, MOBA. There is no point in using this story to relate to your Manic Digger situation, because it has nothing to do with it. The only thing I see here happening with Manic Digger, is a clear ripoff of the original artist in an attempt to build upon one's own portfolio. The developer/s would be better off helping build upon Minecraft, rather than trying to split a community up, cause flame wars, and cause inter-gaming community chaos.
Take care.
If people want to like Manic Digger, they can like it.
Must I remind you that Minecraft is a copy of Infiniminer?
Do I see any people trolling about how Infiniminer is ages better than minecraft? No. Yet that's exactly what you're doing for Manic Digger.
Personally, I like Manic Digger, and think it's a pretty damn good game.
@Kahai: Manic Digger works perfectly fine for me and lots of other people, so anything that goes wrong is your fault, not the fault of the creators of Manic Digger.
@X52: Fail troll is fail. There are no toilets in Manic Digger, even though I'm pretty sure a toilet has better graphics, since it's REAL LIFE.
Well, that's because Infiniminer isn't ages better than Minecraft. And Manic Digger is not better than Minecraft.
Let me sketch this visually:
Infiniminer < Minecraft > Manic Digger
Geez, let the guy take a break and mentally unwind... he's done an amazing amount of work so far, and his servers just went Chernobyl on him last week. I can't blame him for wanting a breather. If the lack of updates were to continue for 2-3 months, THEN I'd start to be concerned for the future of Minecraft; honestly, I want him to take a break, so he doesn't get burnt out, because I've personally suffered coding burnout, and lost a $20k contract due to it -- burnout sucks... and yet you still feel like sh** for not working on the project you know you should be working on.
agreed, we should not support games that are simple copies of things that have already been done by another company.
I dont for a second believe that Notch adding things like enchantments or alchemy will do anything other than make Minecraft EVEN BETTER. Why? Because, through playing Minecraft so far, I've already seen that Notch very DEFINITELY knows what he's doing when it comes to game design. If he wants to add enchantments, you better believe it'll be freaking grand, cause chances are, it will be.
Now, on the note of this whole Manic Digger thing.... frankly I think the whole thing is silly. Game "clones" are an old practice. Old old old. Been going on since the Golden Age of arcades. And frankly, it often can end up being a good thing. The clones CAN become good games in their own right, but as a rule, never will surpass the original. It's happened over and over and over again throughout the years, and will continue to happen more. There's not a whole lot of point in complaining about it. Manic Digger could become a fine game in it's own right. Totally possible. And if it does, I doubt it'll steal sales from Minecraft at all.
But I also just plain have faith in THIS game and Notch's ability to design and improve it. I cant see anything topping Minecraft anytime soon, and that includes clones of it.
Minecraft is not a copy of Infiniminer. I've seen that game.... they really dont look much alike. but yes, Minecraft was at least inspired by it. I think alot of people's problems with Manic Digger is that currently it looks almost EXACTLY like Minecraft, right down to the look of the trees. Now, dont get me wrong. As I said up above I have no issues with clone games. It's like with Pac-Man. That's a great game. And there's a bazillion clones of it. And that's fine, cause it means there's even more fun games of that type I can play. Right now though, Manic Digger has nothing to really seperate it from Minecraft, except for the fact that right now there's very, very little to do in it (yes, I've tried it), and it doesnt work all that well right now.
As such, I dont think it's all that good of a game yet. I cant really judge it until there's more of it there. But right now, it doesnt compare to Minecraft, which has alot more going on.
In the art world, people get inspired by other things. Notch was obviously inspired by Infiminer, as he said so. But he took the game in a different direction. He was inspired, then made it his own. Manic Digger did not. Manic Digger saw Minecraft, then took it, and copied it. There is no "other" direction, it's the same thing.
/thread
We. Have. Creepers.
Minecraft. Is. Win.
TAC: 1:3
"He who sees thy challenge shall be victorious."