I'm trying to make the farm, but I want to more sure nothing goes wrong. So, here is what I want to ask:
1. Is this correct? I mean the spacing. I don't know much about the ocean monument chunk.
1.
2. Does the grinding spot have to be centered in the ocean monument? I mean, can I build it on the edge of the ocean monument?
3. Is there no way to prevent a guardian from spawning in water? (For example, high light level prevents zombies from spawning. Of course, removing all solid block is possible, but that's not what I wanted.)
4. What's the MOST efficient design of the guardian farm? So far I think this one is the best, idk if somebody has a better one.
5. If there's a spawner spawning mobs within the range, how will it affect the spawn rate?
6. Is there a y-axis range for guardians to spawn? (I.E. Does guardian spawn only in about y:50 or sth or can they spawn in y:255?)
1: Not sure what you are asking; this appears to show that you have placed your initial walls (for draining the monument exterior) so as to leave a two block gap between the walls and the monument proper. While important for any base you construct, the exact positioning of the walls does not matter for Guardian farming, so long as all the spawnable water is removed.
2: Centering the killroom in the Ocean Monument footprint is unimportant so long as the killroom is centered in the farm footprint to minimise the mean [arithmatic average] distance spawning guardians need to be moved and thus the maximize the throughput. [Few guardian farms take up even a major fraction of the 58x58 footprint of the Monument.]
3: From the Gaurdian page "they can spawn only if the spawning block and the block below the spawning block are water (regardless of stationary water or flowing water), and the block above the spawning block has no collision mask (air, water, sign, etc.)."
[The wiki has been known to contain errors however and I seem to recall spawns in 1 deep water so I'd want to test that before relying on it.]
Note that removing all solid blocks will not be effective.
4: Mumbo Jumbo's build [the linked video] appears to be based on a gnembon design the last update of which I am aware is LINK.
The main changes involve:
increasing the air gap under the water and above the lava
swapping the glass for Redstone Blocks. (Later comments indicate Observers also work.)
5: Hostile mobs in the world will occupy part of the mob cap, whether they spawn 'naturally' or from a spawner makes no difference. Assuming there is a spawner near where you want to locate your guardian farm, arranging things so that you are >16 blocks from the spawner is advised. [While not optimal, a few mobs from the spawner created when you pass by it on the way to the guardian farm will not have too great an effect as these will despawn normally. More likely, the guardian farm will impact the rates if you try to use the spawner.]
6: The guardian page states "Most of them will spawn in between Y=39(floor of the ocean monument) to Y=63", but does not define "most". Given that Guardians must spawn in water, it should not be difficult to prevent spawns in undesirable areas.
[Anecdotally:
I've never seen one spawn above Y=63 (although I've also never tried to create that situation)
Spawns do not appear to occur in the water based item transport system near the killroom in this video (@~12m00). q.v. LINK]
The design you're attempting has been made for maximum efficiency; I've never used that design as the added complexity of the build process has been off-putting and I've never had the need/desire for that much prismarine.
Good luck, looking forward to the progress reports…
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why does everything have to be so stoopid?" Harvey Pekar (from American Splendor)
WARNING: I have an extemely "grindy" playstyle; YMMV — if this doesn't seem fun to you, mine what you can from it & bin the rest.
The guardians will only spawn in a cuboid centered around the area of the monument, which i recall is a 58 x 58 x 23 or something - the same size as the monument occupies. This does not include any support pillars present under the base (you may see guardians swimming under there but they swam from elsewhere).
Lighting up any caves in the surrounding area of the monument does help the efficiency of the farm.
- Being able to "see" the sky will reduce Guardian spawns in a block of water greatly. So the fish tank (spawning area) needs to be have a non-transparent roof.
- A relatively modest "fish tank" would deliver enough prismarine blocks and lanterns for most people, whether or not everything else is drained. This is because there are so many spawning spots in a volume of water. (The same volume of darkroom spawning would effectively waste at least 2/3 the space.)
- Guardians sink pretty rapidly on their own, so only design downward flowing water if really going for max efficiency.
Lemme try to recall what you guys are saying, just in case I made them wrong:
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
Guardians will not spawn outside the monument footprint. So long as the only water within the monument volumn (58x58 & y=39-63) is in the guardian farm, the position of the exterior wall will affect only base design, not the farm.
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
"the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself" Only true for maximum rates, a farm (including gnembon's various designs) will work (albeit slower) with an off center kill chamber.
Because mobs do not spawn centered in a block, I would place the edge of a farm 1 block in from the edge of the monument for 'safety', but I am aware of no information that the one covered water space within the monument is favored over any other.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
Sky view (as is used to determine village houses) matters, not light level. (In this context, "sky view" means the topmost water block in a column has nothing but transparent blocks above it.)
[Adding an opaque block above a column will change the spawn rate for that column (removing the 95% fail constraint), but barely reduce the light level (from 15 to 14 when standing directly beneath a single solid block).]
I've not seen a design using rate control pistons (oddly enough, pistons are considered transparent ), but this should work… [A similar mechanic is used in Tango Teks' self assembling village iron farm designs.]
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
True.
6. Y:39-63
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why does everything have to be so stoopid?" Harvey Pekar (from American Splendor)
WARNING: I have an extemely "grindy" playstyle; YMMV — if this doesn't seem fun to you, mine what you can from it & bin the rest.
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
Guardians will not spawn outside the monument footprint. So long as the only water within the monument volumn (58x58 & y=39-63) is in the guardian farm, the position of the exterior wall will affect only base design, not the farm.
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
"the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself" Only true for maximum rates, a farm (including gnembon's various designs) will work (albeit slower) with an off center kill chamber.
Because mobs do not spawn centered in a block, I would place the edge of a farm 1 block in from the edge of the monument for 'safety', but I am aware of no information that the one covered water space within the monument is favored over any other.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
Sky view (as is used to determine village houses) matters, not light level. (In this context, "sky view" means the topmost water block in a column has nothing but transparent blocks above it.)
[Adding an opaque block above a column will change the spawn rate for that column (removing the 95% fail constraint), but barely reduce the light level (from 15 to 14 when standing directly beneath a single solid block).]
I've not seen a design using rate control pistons (oddly enough, pistons are considered transparent ), but this should work… [A similar mechanic is used in Tango Teks' self assembling village iron farm designs.]
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
True.
6. Y:39-63
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
Thanks for the reply, that should answer all of my questions.
You just about got it. I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about with spawners though. As a general rule, Guardians are hostile mobs and count toward the hostile mob cap. This means that if there are a bunch of other hostiles present in the caves around or anything rates will be decreased. Does that help?
Lemme try to recall what you guys are saying, just in case I made them wrong:
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
6. Y:39-63
If there's any mistake, please correct me.
Guardians only spawn within the 58x58 footprint of the farm, between Y39 and Y63 (according to the wiki). There is some ambiguity in the wiki about guardian spawns above sea level, so it's possible they may spawn higher (assuming there is water to spawn in), but I have not tested that myself. Note that no other hostile mobs will spawn in that area. So if you clear the volume the monument occupies of water you don't have to worry about lighting up rooms, as guardians are the only hostile mob that can spawn in the monument location. If you have any space outside the 58x58 footprint, or under the floor level (Y38), then normal hostile mob spawning rules apply.
Guardians have an equal chance of spawning anywhere within the monument volume, so whether or not you need to center anything will depend on the design of your farm.
Sky exposure affects spawning, not light level. If the spawn water block is exposed to the sky, either directly or indirectly (below liquid or fully transparent blocks) spawning will fail 95% of the time. Cover your spawn area.
Probably, he's pretty awesome.
Monster spawners themselves are not affected by the mob cap. They will happily keep spawning mobs until they crash your game or server. However, the mobs they spawn are added to the mobs cap, so if you have an active spawner nearby it can and will affect your guardian spawns. If you want a collection only dungeon grinder which quickly dispatches the spawned mobs, then it probably won't make too much difference. If you want an XP farm where you let the mobs accumulate, then that will slow down and possibly stop guardian spawns (if you want XP, then use your guardian farm for that, it's much faster than a dungeon grinder).
I'm pretty sure when I tested that, guardians also spawned at Y38, but it's been awhile so test that for yourself.
I'm trying to make the farm, but I want to more sure nothing goes wrong. So, here is what I want to ask:
1. Is this correct? I mean the spacing. I don't know much about the ocean monument chunk.
1.
2. Does the grinding spot have to be centered in the ocean monument? I mean, can I build it on the edge of the ocean monument?
3. Is there no way to prevent a guardian from spawning in water? (For example, high light level prevents zombies from spawning. Of course, removing all solid block is possible, but that's not what I wanted.)
4. What's the MOST efficient design of the guardian farm? So far I think this one is the best, idk if somebody has a better one.
5. If there's a spawner spawning mobs within the range, how will it affect the spawn rate?
6. Is there a y-axis range for guardians to spawn? (I.E. Does guardian spawn only in about y:50 or sth or can they spawn in y:255?)
Thanks if u can answer me.
Couple links for general reference:
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Guardian
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Ocean_monument
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Tutorials/Guardian_farming [old but may still be somewhat useful]
Your questions:
1: Not sure what you are asking; this appears to show that you have placed your initial walls (for draining the monument exterior) so as to leave a two block gap between the walls and the monument proper. While important for any base you construct, the exact positioning of the walls does not matter for Guardian farming, so long as all the spawnable water is removed.
2: Centering the killroom in the Ocean Monument footprint is unimportant so long as the killroom is centered in the farm footprint to minimise the mean [arithmatic average] distance spawning guardians need to be moved and thus the maximize the throughput. [Few guardian farms take up even a major fraction of the 58x58 footprint of the Monument.]
3: From the Gaurdian page "they can spawn only if the spawning block and the block below the spawning block are water (regardless of stationary water or flowing water), and the block above the spawning block has no collision mask (air, water, sign, etc.)."
[The wiki has been known to contain errors however and I seem to recall spawns in 1 deep water so I'd want to test that before relying on it.]
Note that removing all solid blocks will not be effective.
4: Mumbo Jumbo's build [the linked video] appears to be based on a gnembon design the last update of which I am aware is LINK .
The main changes involve:
5: Hostile mobs in the world will occupy part of the mob cap, whether they spawn 'naturally' or from a spawner makes no difference. Assuming there is a spawner near where you want to locate your guardian farm, arranging things so that you are >16 blocks from the spawner is advised. [While not optimal, a few mobs from the spawner created when you pass by it on the way to the guardian farm will not have too great an effect as these will despawn normally. More likely, the guardian farm will impact the rates if you try to use the spawner.]
6: The guardian page states "Most of them will spawn in between Y=39(floor of the ocean monument) to Y=63", but does not define "most". Given that Guardians must spawn in water, it should not be difficult to prevent spawns in undesirable areas.
[Anecdotally:
I've never seen one spawn above Y=63 (although I've also never tried to create that situation)
Spawns do not appear to occur in the water based item transport system near the killroom in this video (@~12m00). q.v. LINK ]
The design you're attempting has been made for maximum efficiency; I've never used that design as the added complexity of the build process has been off-putting and I've never had the need/desire for that much prismarine.
Good luck, looking forward to the progress reports…
Some helpful pointers towards the end of this thread https://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-java-edition/survival-mode/2385597-draining-an-ocean-monument?
The guardians will only spawn in a cuboid centered around the area of the monument, which i recall is a 58 x 58 x 23 or something - the same size as the monument occupies. This does not include any support pillars present under the base (you may see guardians swimming under there but they swam from elsewhere).
Lighting up any caves in the surrounding area of the monument does help the efficiency of the farm.
Mintutor now works in 1.13!
MrKite & Mc_Etlam ... I salute you!
- Being able to "see" the sky will reduce Guardian spawns in a block of water greatly. So the fish tank (spawning area) needs to be have a non-transparent roof.
- A relatively modest "fish tank" would deliver enough prismarine blocks and lanterns for most people, whether or not everything else is drained. This is because there are so many spawning spots in a volume of water. (The same volume of darkroom spawning would effectively waste at least 2/3 the space.)
- Guardians sink pretty rapidly on their own, so only design downward flowing water if really going for max efficiency.
Tips and tricks and a direct guide. His actual design for guardian farm is the simplest and among the most efficient. We love you Gnembon!
Thanks for all the replies.
Lemme try to recall what you guys are saying, just in case I made them wrong:
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
6. Y:39-63
If there's any mistake, please correct me.
quote=YMbrothers;
Replies
1. The 2 block spacing is fine. (You know, if the wall is positioned incorrectly, idk whether guardians will spawn outside the wall or not)
Guardians will not spawn outside the monument footprint. So long as the only water within the monument volumn (58x58 & y=39-63) is in the guardian farm, the position of the exterior wall will affect only base design, not the farm.
2. The farm doesn't need to be centered in the monument structure. Yet if I'm using Gnembon's design, the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself, while the whole farm (The 十 shaped farm) can be on the edge of the monument.
"the kill chamber must be near the center of the farm itself" Only true for maximum rates, a farm (including gnembon's various designs) will work (albeit slower) with an off center kill chamber.
Because mobs do not spawn centered in a block, I would place the edge of a farm 1 block in from the edge of the monument for 'safety', but I am aware of no information that the one covered water space within the monument is favored over any other.
3. So the light level (only sunlight) does affect the spawn rate. (Does that mean I can use pistons to move the covering block, so it can control the spawn rate?)
Sky view (as is used to determine village houses) matters, not light level. (In this context, "sky view" means the topmost water block in a column has nothing but transparent blocks above it.)
[Adding an opaque block above a column will change the spawn rate for that column (removing the 95% fail constraint), but barely reduce the light level (from 15 to 14 when standing directly beneath a single solid block).]
I've not seen a design using rate control pistons (oddly enough, pistons are considered transparent ), but this should work… [A similar mechanic is used in Tango Teks' self assembling village iron farm designs.]
4. Well, Gnembon's design s the most efficient
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
5. Spawners do affect the spawn rate, so it's best to not put it below the kill chamber of the guardian farm. (Sad )
True.
6. Y:39-63
Correct, to the best of my knowledge.
Thanks for the reply, that should answer all of my questions.
You just about got it. I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about with spawners though. As a general rule, Guardians are hostile mobs and count toward the hostile mob cap. This means that if there are a bunch of other hostiles present in the caves around or anything rates will be decreased. Does that help?