With 1.17 months away and new cave generation being huge there are some issues. You used to be able to use a torch to see a full section of a cave but its not the same anymore with caves being bigger. We need flashlights. Available in off hand even for bedrock, lights up half the amount of a torch but wherever you point and reaches up to 15 blocks away. This could be crafted with a crystal shard in top crafting slot, a piece of redststone dust in the middle, and an iron ingot on the bottom
15 blocks isn't that much at all when you have caves that are this large (I have no idea what the caves in 1.17 are like, these are from my own mod); this is also the maximum range of any current light sources so there isn't much of a difference; you can see how limited the range of light from lava is (light level 15, so it drops to 0 after 15 blocks):
Even if they maintained full intensity up to 15 blocks (which would require some form of dynamic/visual lighting) that still isn't that much; many of the caves shown above are over 100 blocks across and 50 blocks deep with even larger caves possible, and you'd still need to place torches for consistent illumination and to prevent mobs from spawning - even then I've killed over 600 mobs while lighting up a single giant cave as they continuously respawn in the dark areas. Also, as seen above you can use ladders or pillar up to place torches on the walls and ceilings:
15 blocks isn't that much at all when you have caves that are this large (I have no idea what the caves in 1.17 are like, these are from my own mod); this is also the maximum range of any current light sources so there isn't much of a difference; you can see how limited the range of light from lava is (light level 15, so it drops to 0 after 15 blocks):
Even if they maintained full intensity up to 15 blocks (which would require some form of dynamic/visual lighting) that still isn't that much; many of the caves shown above are over 100 blocks across and 50 blocks deep with even larger caves possible, and you'd still need to place torches for consistent illumination and to prevent mobs from spawning - even then I've killed over 600 mobs while lighting up a single giant cave as they continuously respawn in the dark areas. Also, as seen above you can use ladders or pillar up to place torches on the walls and ceilings:
I close off the dark areas of my mines to stop the hostile mobs from causing me problems. I've had experiences in the past on Minecraft Java where skeletons would shoot at me while I was close to a lava pool and nearly died that way, I was fortunate enough to stop myself from falling in and deal with it, but the knockback can send you into a lava pool or off a cliff of an underground ravine etc.
I think the luminosity of the light sources are fine with the exception of soul fire, any brighter and they'd be overpowered, considering how cheaply made torches are I think Mojang nailed the balance of them perfectly. I wouldn't use much soul fire lighting for my Overworld projects, but I definitely would use torches, jack o lanterns or regular lanterns for street lighting and medieval style castle builds.
I don't think a light level of above 15 would be appropriate balance for lighting, and especially not 30+.
Could you imagine how easy it would be then? people would cheese the lighting system like booze for an alcoholic.
as I've said before, while I do oppose changes that could make the game excessively frustrating or difficult, I do not wish for changes that'll remove all challenge either.
I close off the dark areas of my mines to stop the hostile mobs from causing me problems.
This only works for small and loosely interconnected "tunnel" caves, not the enormous caves that I showed, or "swiss cheese" caves, and presumably, the new caves in 1.17 - the only other option is to not explore them at all and things like lava and falling are easily mitigated with water buckets and enchantments - I never died at all in TMCWv4 over more than a month of playtime despite the far greater danger of lava and falling and double the mob density compared to vanilla (also, do you really mean player-made mines when you refer to "mines"? It annoys me a bit when people refer to natural caves as "mines", which causes confusion as seen here. Also, there is no reason for player-made mines to be dark unless you forgo torches because of the broken lighting system that lets you see in what should be total darkness - I see people doing this all the time on YouTube).
This only works for small and loosely interconnected "tunnel" caves, not the enormous caves that I showed, or "swiss cheese" caves, and presumably, the new caves in 1.17 - the only other option is to not explore them at all and things like lava and falling are easily mitigated with water buckets and enchantments - I never died at all in TMCWv4 over more than a month of playtime despite the far greater danger of lava and falling and double the mob density compared to vanilla (also, do you really mean player-made mines when you refer to "mines"? It annoys me a bit when people refer to natural caves as "mines", which causes confusion as seen here. Also, there is no reason for player-made mines to be dark unless you forgo torches because of the broken lighting system that lets you see in what should be total darkness - I see people doing this all the time on YouTube).
IMO it only counts as a mine if you intend to explore it solely for the mining of resources and if it branches off from the main tunnel of your mineshaft.
Some caves do have easily accessible iron, some you don't luck out on and you have to dig out a fair bit of terrain before finding the first vein of iron ore.
The only time I would tend to overlook dark caves the majority of the time is when it is above gravel, where they're not so obvious but falling gravel can expose cave systems on the upper level of the subterranean environment, which can happen when you're mining for diamonds, lapis and redstone.
But since I'm wearing armour it's not a big deal, as I usually have enough time to react before the fatal blow can be dealt to me, plus I carry a bucket of water. My only death on my current survival world I made 3 weeks ago on normal difficulty on bedrock edition came from fall damage, from messing about with a trident with riptide whilst it was raining. Good use of beds makes deaths less of a problem in the game, although losing XP does suck.
Is it possible that hostile mobs can still catch me out in future? yes, that's the same for everyone. But by then I would have more than enough materials to replace what was lost anyway.
The Caves and Cliffs update from what I've seen so far is offering good things for Minecraft players of different play-styles, it will make mining more challenging but in a good and fun way, it's not something that is imposed on you or something that makes it unbalanced/unfair, if you don't want to deal with the Warden then you can simply ignore it by closing the biome off and going somewhere else, these are the kinds of updates the game needs, not ones that force players to contend with unnecessary grinding or loss of items from mob griefing and theft of loot, like some suggestions being made.
By the way this also means lighting has indirectly been rebalanced, because with bigger and deeper cave systems means you need more lights to properly illuminate them, a change I do not mind at all and neither do other people seem to.
With 1.17 months away and new cave generation being huge there are some issues. You used to be able to use a torch to see a full section of a cave but its not the same anymore with caves being bigger. We need flashlights. Available in off hand even for bedrock, lights up half the amount of a torch but wherever you point and reaches up to 15 blocks away. This could be crafted with a crystal shard in top crafting slot, a piece of redststone dust in the middle, and an iron ingot on the bottom
I like minecraft more dark when it's night time or when i enter caves.
It would be nice to see some glowing plants or minerals here and there with very low light levels.
Instead of adding a new tool, why don't make torches & lanterns light up the area around you while you hold them.
It's just one of the many good things optifine gives us and i can't play without that!
That could be the mechanic for lanterns, giving them more purpose then just beeing pretty decorations.
My projects:
-are abandoned for now. I might pick 'em up in the future.
For now i'm working on a private modpack that suit's my own playstyle.
I am gonna stay in modded 1.12.2 untill my potato dies. No mercy! :Q
I don't feel like flashlights fit the style of the game
lanterns were the best we got and I was grateful for them,
my only complaints about them is the soul fire variants suck because of their low light level.
This means in the Overworld it is too risky to use soul fire as a primary way to light up your town,
light emitted from objects diminishes one level per block away from the source.
But regular lanterns have become my favourite light source
and are far better looking for some builds than torches.
Maybe not lantern or flashlight.
How about we can hold a torch when walking.
Mods support this idea.
My videos: https://www.youtube.com/user/robingravel
My cartoons: http://www.dailymotion.com/robin-gravel
Flash Animation (if your computer supports flash):
http://robingravel.byethost15.com/eflash.htm
Few flash movies have easter egg/extras
15 blocks isn't that much at all when you have caves that are this large (I have no idea what the caves in 1.17 are like, these are from my own mod); this is also the maximum range of any current light sources so there isn't much of a difference; you can see how limited the range of light from lava is (light level 15, so it drops to 0 after 15 blocks):
Even if they maintained full intensity up to 15 blocks (which would require some form of dynamic/visual lighting) that still isn't that much; many of the caves shown above are over 100 blocks across and 50 blocks deep with even larger caves possible, and you'd still need to place torches for consistent illumination and to prevent mobs from spawning - even then I've killed over 600 mobs while lighting up a single giant cave as they continuously respawn in the dark areas. Also, as seen above you can use ladders or pillar up to place torches on the walls and ceilings:
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
I close off the dark areas of my mines to stop the hostile mobs from causing me problems. I've had experiences in the past on Minecraft Java where skeletons would shoot at me while I was close to a lava pool and nearly died that way, I was fortunate enough to stop myself from falling in and deal with it, but the knockback can send you into a lava pool or off a cliff of an underground ravine etc.
I think the luminosity of the light sources are fine with the exception of soul fire, any brighter and they'd be overpowered, considering how cheaply made torches are I think Mojang nailed the balance of them perfectly. I wouldn't use much soul fire lighting for my Overworld projects, but I definitely would use torches, jack o lanterns or regular lanterns for street lighting and medieval style castle builds.
I don't think a light level of above 15 would be appropriate balance for lighting, and especially not 30+.
Could you imagine how easy it would be then? people would cheese the lighting system like booze for an alcoholic.
as I've said before, while I do oppose changes that could make the game excessively frustrating or difficult, I do not wish for changes that'll remove all challenge either.
This only works for small and loosely interconnected "tunnel" caves, not the enormous caves that I showed, or "swiss cheese" caves, and presumably, the new caves in 1.17 - the only other option is to not explore them at all and things like lava and falling are easily mitigated with water buckets and enchantments - I never died at all in TMCWv4 over more than a month of playtime despite the far greater danger of lava and falling and double the mob density compared to vanilla (also, do you really mean player-made mines when you refer to "mines"? It annoys me a bit when people refer to natural caves as "mines", which causes confusion as seen here. Also, there is no reason for player-made mines to be dark unless you forgo torches because of the broken lighting system that lets you see in what should be total darkness - I see people doing this all the time on YouTube).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
IMO it only counts as a mine if you intend to explore it solely for the mining of resources and if it branches off from the main tunnel of your mineshaft.
Some caves do have easily accessible iron, some you don't luck out on and you have to dig out a fair bit of terrain before finding the first vein of iron ore.
The only time I would tend to overlook dark caves the majority of the time is when it is above gravel, where they're not so obvious but falling gravel can expose cave systems on the upper level of the subterranean environment, which can happen when you're mining for diamonds, lapis and redstone.
But since I'm wearing armour it's not a big deal, as I usually have enough time to react before the fatal blow can be dealt to me, plus I carry a bucket of water. My only death on my current survival world I made 3 weeks ago on normal difficulty on bedrock edition came from fall damage, from messing about with a trident with riptide whilst it was raining. Good use of beds makes deaths less of a problem in the game, although losing XP does suck.
Is it possible that hostile mobs can still catch me out in future? yes, that's the same for everyone. But by then I would have more than enough materials to replace what was lost anyway.
The Caves and Cliffs update from what I've seen so far is offering good things for Minecraft players of different play-styles, it will make mining more challenging but in a good and fun way, it's not something that is imposed on you or something that makes it unbalanced/unfair, if you don't want to deal with the Warden then you can simply ignore it by closing the biome off and going somewhere else, these are the kinds of updates the game needs, not ones that force players to contend with unnecessary grinding or loss of items from mob griefing and theft of loot, like some suggestions being made.
By the way this also means lighting has indirectly been rebalanced, because with bigger and deeper cave systems means you need more lights to properly illuminate them, a change I do not mind at all and neither do other people seem to.