I present to you: Enhancements! Taking the chance away from enchanting.
Wait, didn't you already suggest this on another thread?
Well yes, but this one's different. That one got flak for adding 15 pointless gems. This one won't have any of that.
What are enhancements?
Enhancements are a new way of upgrading your tool, replacing enchanting. Whereas with enchanting you rely on chance (and lapis and XP) to get what you want, enhancing takes semi-common items you probably have, and nothing else.
How do they work?
To enhance your tool, you need an Enhancement Table (attachment 1). This is crafted just like an enchanting table, but with 3 paper repclacing the book (attatchment 2).
When opened, the table opens up a GUI with a single slot. Place your tool in the slot and more slots open up for gems to be placed in (coming soon).
What enhancements are there?
There are 18 enhancements in total, 2 of which can only be obtained through trading or chest loot.
In this table, T = effects on tools (pickaxe/axe/shovel/shears), W = effects on weapons (sword/axe/trident), R = effects on ranged weapons (bow/crossbow/trident), A - effects on armour and shields.
Diamond - Unbreaking - Last longer - max 5
Redstone - Haste - T Mine faster, W Swing faster, R Fire faster - max 5
Blaze Powder - Firey - WR Inflict fire damage, A Reduce fire damage - max 3
Obsidian - Tough - WR Pierce armor, A Reduce damage - max 5
Ender Pearl - Lure - T Pull in items, WR Pull in mobs, A Increase mob spawn, F (fishing rods) Pull in fish faster - max 3
Scute - Aqua Affinity - T Mine faster underwater, W Swing faster underwater, R Fire faster underwater, A Swim faster, AH (Helmets) Breathe underwater - max 3
Nether Quartz - Sharp - WR Deal more damage, T Damage attackers - max 5
Lapis - Luck - TWR Get more drops, A Increase chance of enemy missing - max 5
Endstone - Reinforced - R Penetrate mobs, A Reduce blast damage - max 3
Redstone Torch - Shocking - WR Stun mobs (strike with lightning if stormy), A Reduce damage form lightning - max 3
Wither Rose - Decay - WR Deal wither damage, A Reduce wither damage - max 3
Slime Block - Knockback - WR Deal knockback, A Reduce knockback - max 3
Gold Ingot - Smite - WR Deal more damage against undead - max 3
Ancient Silk* - Silky - T Get the exact block, W Get mob heads - 1 level
Mending Moss* - Mending - Repair itself - 1 level
Ancient Silk and Mending Moss can be found in chest loot or bought from priest villagers for 12-17 emeralds each.
Enhancing takes 1 of the material for level 1, but the cost triples for each additional level (however, level 5 requires 64 of the material) so getting Sharp 5 requires a whopping 104 nether quartz!
How many enhancements can you put on a single tool?
Good question. Every different tier of tool has a different amount of sockets for gems.
Wood/stone tools, leather/chain armour, bows, fishing rods, shears - 3 sockets
Iron/diamond tools/armour, crossbows, tridents, shields - 4 sockets
Anything golden - 5 sockets
Yes, golden tools now have at least some purpose - superior enhanceability.
What will happen to my god diamond _?
Don't worry, because your super-OP enchanted gear will become super-OP enhanced gear.
For example, a Fortune III Unbreaking III Efficiency V diamond pickaxe will become a Luck 3 Unbreaking 3 Haste 5 diamond pickaxe. You will only lose enchantments if you are over the limit (i.e. a Power V Punch V Unbreking III Infinity I Flame I bow), in which case the game removes your least-needed enchantments (ie. Punch and Flame).
Does it cost any XP?
Nope. In fact, I'd like to see XP removed altogether (although that's for another thread, to avoid being wishlisty).
Why replace enchantments with enhancements?
As the old thread's OP stated, enchanting is a lottery. You'll waste a lot of XP, lapis, leather and time getting the enchantments you wanted (I still haven't managed to get Infinity on my bow).
I don't like the idea of replacing enchanting altogether. And if you ask me, your suggested system sounds much more tedious and spreadsheet-y than placing a tool/book in an enchanting table and clicking a button.
No support.
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Watch out for the crabocalypse. Some say the day will never come. But it will.
Feel free to drop by for a chat whenever.
If you'd like to talk with me about other games, here are a few I play.
Team Fortress 2
Borderlands series (Borderlands 2 is my favorite game, ever. TPS combat is a lot of fun and makes up for the lower-quality story, in my opinion)
Elder Scrolls series
Warframe (IGN is something like That_One_Flesh_Atronach)
Pokémon series (HGSS forever)
Rocket League
Fallout series
Left 4 Dead 2 (Boomer files always corrupt though)
SUPERHOT (SUPERHOT is the most innovative shooter I've played in years!)
Dead Rising series (Dead Rising 2 is one of my favorite games, and the 3rd was a lot of fun. 1st has poor survivor AI and the 4th is bad)
Just Cause series
Come to think of it, I mainly play fighting-based games.
Isn't this basically just the system from Tinker's Construct, but without a Smeltery and modified slightly? Not that I am opposed to that, I'm just curious.
I could really take or leave this system. I definitely don't like it overriding enchantments on existing gear, plus the "least-needed" enchantments is subjective.
I think what would be ideal is a combination of both systems. Being able to potentially get a good mix of enchantments right off the bat with enchanting, or being in for a longer grind to make exactly what you want.
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I think what would be ideal is a combination of both systems. Being able to potentially get a good mix of enchantments right off the bat with enchanting, or being in for a longer grind to make exactly what you want.
This is already the case - directly enchant items to get random enchantments, which may or may not be what you want (tip: mouse over the enchantment options to see one of the offered enchantments; you can also disenchant items on a grindstone in return for some XP and the ability to re-enchant it, or try enchanting a different item - they really have made enchanting massively easier since 1.8, or even 1.3, which greatly reduced XP costs) - or enchant or trade for books to get specific enchantments (this is what I do for most of my gear to avoid wasting diamonds or my extremely rare modded gear, as I also play in 1.6.4 (with the same enchantment mechanics) so I can't see what they will get, and items like chestplates could always get something like Thorns which may not show up in the tooltip).
Either way, I don't find enchanting to be an issue since I only do it one time; I use the same set of gear for the lifetime of a world (32.7+ days of time played for my current world), which is also partly why I see no point in having fancy trading halls or XP farms. I get most of my XP by mining quartz, which also doubles as a building material for my main base, so I get two things done at once; afterwards I get more XP than I need from normal gameplay to keep my gear in repair, with a higher overall cost than since 1.9 with Mending (speaking of which, if XP were removed how would Mending work? Granted, I think it is OP since you only need XP to repair an item, making what should be a major part of the game (Minecraft) pointless, and the cost is the same regardless of its quality, in sharp contrast to the pre-1.8 repair system, where you could simply rename an item to keep the penalty down but you had to pay the full enchantment cost (e.g. 5 levels for Sharpness V, 4 for Knockback II, 6 for Unbreaking III, plus 6 more levels for having 3 enchantments for a total of 21 levels before adding any other costs), as well as for the durability restored (currently a flat 2 levels for an item or 1 per unit, as opposed to 1-17 levels), so most items could only have 3 enchantments, sometimes 4, before they became too expensive to repair).
I would also like to see mending require only a fixed cost of raw materials, no XP required, but I didn't add it here as it would become too wishlisty.
I don't like the idea of replacing enchanting altogether. And if you ask me, your suggested system sounds much more tedious and spreadsheet-y than placing a tool/book in an enchanting table and clicking a button.
No support.
Placing a tool and some materials in an table and clicking a button is no more tedious than placing a tool and a book in a table and clicking a button.
Isn't this basically just the system from Tinker's Construct, but without a Smeltery and modified slightly? Not that I am opposed to that, I'm just curious.
Yes, it's inspired by TCon's similar system.
I could really take or leave this system. I definitely don't like it overriding enchantments on existing gear, plus the "least-needed" enchantments is subjective.
Don't worry, all existing enchantments will carry over (provided they don't get cut). Neededness is determined by objective orders.
I think what would be ideal is a combination of both systems. Being able to potentially get a good mix of enchantments right off the bat with enchanting, or being in for a longer grind to make exactly what you want.
Placing a tool and some materials in an table and clicking a button is no more tedious than placing a tool and a book in a table and clicking a button.
Except you have to go out and grind to get resources to enhance. Compare finding all these resources just for one extra enchantment level compared to breeding cows for a few hours and getting max-level enchantments consistently. Every time you want to add Unbreaking to a tool, you have to sacrifice a diamond per level. XP can also be tedious to obtain but becomes substantially easier in the late-game. (1395 XP; for reference, about 280 Enderman must be killed to go from 0 to 30.) Plus, enchanting only takes one to three levels, meaning that buy sacrificing three levels, you'll only need 306 XP to reach 30 again. Those six diamonds you spent crafting a pick and putting Unbreaking 3 on it can basically guarantee Efficiency 4 and Unbreaking 3 at level 30 enchants on two pickaxes. That's ignoring other enchantments like Fortune or Silk Touch. There are also enchanted books that guarantee you'll get the enchantments on there. Enchanted books are easy to obtain: villagers, dungeon chests, End Cities. Even just fishing can net you the rare Mending books.
Enchanting shouldn't be a chore to obtain. The most common and useful enchantment consumes one of the rarest resources in the game? Not everybody can go mining that much. The benefits should outweigh the costs, not vice-versa.
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Watch out for the crabocalypse. Some say the day will never come. But it will.
Feel free to drop by for a chat whenever.
If you'd like to talk with me about other games, here are a few I play.
Team Fortress 2
Borderlands series (Borderlands 2 is my favorite game, ever. TPS combat is a lot of fun and makes up for the lower-quality story, in my opinion)
Elder Scrolls series
Warframe (IGN is something like That_One_Flesh_Atronach)
Pokémon series (HGSS forever)
Rocket League
Fallout series
Left 4 Dead 2 (Boomer files always corrupt though)
SUPERHOT (SUPERHOT is the most innovative shooter I've played in years!)
Dead Rising series (Dead Rising 2 is one of my favorite games, and the 3rd was a lot of fun. 1st has poor survivor AI and the 4th is bad)
Just Cause series
Come to think of it, I mainly play fighting-based games.
Except you have to go out and grind to get resources to enhance. Compare finding all these resources just for one extra enchantment level compared to breeding cows for a few hours and getting max-level enchantments consistently. Every time you want to add Unbreaking to a tool, you have to sacrifice a diamond per level. XP can also be tedious to obtain but becomes substantially easier in the late-game. (1395 XP; for reference, about 280 Enderman must be killed to go from 0 to 30.) Plus, enchanting only takes one to three levels, meaning that buy sacrificing three levels, you'll only need 306 XP to reach 30 again. Those six diamonds you spent crafting a pick and putting Unbreaking 3 on it can basically guarantee Efficiency 4 and Unbreaking 3 at level 30 enchants on two pickaxes. That's ignoring other enchantments like Fortune or Silk Touch. There are also enchanted books that guarantee you'll get the enchantments on there. Enchanted books are easy to obtain: villagers, dungeon chests, End Cities. Even just fishing can net you the rare Mending books.
Enchanting shouldn't be a chore to obtain. The most common and useful enchantment consumes one of the rarest resources in the game? Not everybody can go mining that much. The benefits should outweigh the costs, not vice-versa.
While I might change diamonds, most of the others (Haste, Luck, Tough, Sharp) are resources you will probably have a few of by the time you make the enhancement table (although some, like Decay, which are more OP, are more expensive.)
I think both sides make some valid points, which is why I think having both systems would work. The current system is a bit easier (imo, I agree with Jancrash), because tons of different tasks give you experience. That is offset by the fact there is a higher risk when you die (a normal death should still let you get your items, but you lose most of your XP), and the system using XP is randomized.
Meanwhile, this alternative system may be more tedious to get large amounts of specific items, but you get exactly what you want if you are willing to put in the time. I know the OP is pushing for a replacement of the existing enchanting system but I really think they could work best in conjunction with each other.
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Maybe some type of imbuing gem from villagers would work better?
That's basically what my original suggestion was about: 15 different types of gem dropped from one ore or bought from villagers. Problem: It adds 15 useless items. Which is why I came up with this one instead.
I present to you: Enhancements! Taking the chance away from enchanting.
Y'know it's funny... I was actually thinking of making a similar enchantment overhaul renaming Enchantments to Enhancements in the spirit of renaming Achievements to Advancements. Part of it adds new items and new enhancements such as the ability to completely suppress fire damage, albeit not being able to apply any additional protections on the armor.
Wait, didn't you already suggest this on another thread?
Well yes, but this one's different. That one got flak for adding 15 pointless gems. This one won't have any of that.
Okay to be fair I think you may have written this one before I came up with my idea. I seem to remember reading that post.
What are enhancements?
Enhancements are a new way of upgrading your tool, replacing enchanting. Whereas with enchanting you rely on chance (and lapis and XP) to get what you want, enhancing takes semi-common items you probably have, and nothing else.
A lot of people complain about the chance in enchantments but I'm not exactly sure why this feature gets so much flak since IMO it's supposed to be a bit of a gamble. I think it's because enchantments like Sharpness or Power act as entirely new tiers, whereas enchantments like Bane of Arthropods are complete trash.
How do they work?
To enhance your tool, you need an Enhancement Table (attachment 1). This is crafted just like an enchanting table, but with 3 paper repclacing the book (attatchment 2).
I'm not sure if you were planning to upload these later or not but I don't see any attachments. Also, why the change to 3 paper?
When opened, the table opens up a GUI with a single slot. Place your tool in the slot and more slots open up for gems to be placed in (coming soon).
What enhancements are there?
There are 18 enhancements in total, 2 of which can only be obtained through trading or chest loot.
In this table, T = effects on tools (pickaxe/axe/shovel/shears), W = effects on weapons (sword/axe/trident), R = effects on ranged weapons (bow/crossbow/trident), A - effects on armour and shields.
Mmkay
Diamond - Unbreaking - Last longer - max 5
Right away I'm not sure about this one since I generally consider Unbreaking, especially levels 1-3, to be a cheap early-game enchantment. I also find Unbreaking especially useful since I tend to use iron tools long into the mid-game because of how cheap they are.
Redstone - Haste - T Mine faster, W Swing faster, R Fire faster - max 5
This sounds okay, albeit I'm not sure about "Swing Faster". While I'm not as much of a defender of 1.9 combat as I was back in the day, I don't think upsetting the balance like this should be done on its own. If you're going to make a combat overhaul, I would do it and get it over with.
Blaze Powder - Firey - WR Inflict fire damage, A Reduce fire damage - max 3
I like the use of blaze powder but I think this is a bit cheap for a specialized enchantment.
Obsidian - Tough - WR Pierce armor, A Reduce damage - max 5
Okay
Ender Pearl - Lure - T Pull in items, WR Pull in mobs, A Increase mob spawn, F (fishing rods) Pull in fish faster - max 3
While this ender pearl cost makes sense for the new Tool and Weapon uses, I feel like it's a bit much to enchant a fishing rod. Ender Pearls are kinda expensive before you reach the end IMO since endermen spawn semi-infrequently, are somewhat dangerous to fight and even when you win against one, there's a chance it won't drop one. I definitely wouldn't want to put ender pearls on my fishing rods early-game.
Scute - Aqua Affinity - T Mine faster underwater, W Swing faster underwater, R Fire faster underwater, A Swim faster, AH (Helmets) Breathe underwater - max 3
Hmmmmmm
I'm not sure about this since it kinda makes the Turtle Helmet completely redundant.
Nether Quartz - Sharp - WR Deal more damage, T Damage attackers - max 5
It's kinda hard to judge this one since Nether Quartz gets progressively more expensive on servers, Nether Quartz gets more and more difficult to find near spawn. On the other hand, Nether Quartz is incredibly cheap in singleplayer, just as much as redstone or lapis.
Lapis - Luck - TWR Get more drops, A Increase chance of enemy missing - max 5
I feel like diamonds would be a better resource for luck even if Tinkers' Construct uses lapis.
Endstone - Reinforced - R Penetrate mobs, A Reduce blast damage - max 3
Ok.
Redstone Torch - Shocking - WR Stun mobs (strike with lightning if stormy), A Reduce damage form lightning - max 3
This is way too cheap.
Wither Rose - Decay - WR Deal wither damage, A Reduce wither damage - max 3
Please no. Poison thrown by witches is already OP enough. Also, why reduce wither damage on its own when you could have an enchantment er... enhancement that reduces all magic attacks?
Slime Block - Knockback - WR Deal knockback, A Reduce knockback - max 3
Okay
Gold Ingot - Smite - WR Deal more damage against undead - max 3
Ehhhhh okay
Ancient Silk* - Silky - T Get the exact block, W Get mob heads - 1 level
Should Silk Touch really be that rare? It's probably less useful practically than something like Fortune or Sharpness, and is only really useful for getting some aesthetic blocks, or for saving coal when you want to build a giant castle out of stone bricks.
Mending Moss* - Mending - Repair itself - 1 level
Okay well... If Silk Touch was expensive, Mending is really cheap.
Mending is an enchantment that makes your tools practically indestructible, and considering how some of these enhancements can cost barely anything at all like the Shocking enhancement, that means a lot of these are one-time payments.
Ancient Silk and Mending Moss can be found in chest loot or bought from priest villagers for 12-17 emeralds each.
Enhancing takes 1 of the material for level 1, but the cost triples for each additional level (however, level 5 requires 64 of the material) so getting Sharp 5 requires a whopping 104 nether quartz!
Uhhhh... so Unbreaking costs... 104 Diamonds? Is that really balanced? Also... what exactly do you mean by the cost tripling, because 1*(3^(5-1)) does not equal 104? I'm not really sure what else "triples for each additional level" could possibly mean.
Also, as a writing note, could you have disclosed this before you mentioned which items you're paying for each enhancement?
How many enhancements can you put on a single tool?
Good question. Every different tier of tool has a different amount of sockets for gems.
Wood/stone tools, leather/chain armour, bows, fishing rods, shears - 3 sockets
Iron/diamond tools/armour, crossbows, tridents, shields - 4 sockets
Anything golden - 5 sockets
Yes, golden tools now have at least some purpose - superior enhanceability.
Eehhhhh... I don't know that Golden Tools will have that much more purpose.
What will happen to my god diamond _?
Don't worry, because your super-OP enchanted gear will become super-OP enhanced gear.
For example, a Fortune III Unbreaking III Efficiency V diamond pickaxe will become a Luck 3 Unbreaking 3 Haste 5 diamond pickaxe. You will only lose enchantments if you are over the limit (i.e. a Power V Punch V Unbreking III Infinity I Flame I bow), in which case the game removes your least-needed enchantments (ie. Punch and Flame).
Least-needed is a subjective measurement. Some people might consider the Flame on that bow to be useful, for example.
Does it cost any XP?
Nope. In fact, I'd like to see XP removed altogether (although that's for another thread, to avoid being wishlisty).
I would say I disagree with this but I've never really tossed around the idea before. That being said, if your argument is that XP is too grindy, I would argue this enhancement system is far more grindy considering that while XP can be gained passively throughout your playtime, these items need to be actively mined or crafted.
Why replace enchantments with enhancements?
As the old thread's OP stated, enchanting is a lottery. You'll waste a lot of XP, lapis, leather and time getting the enchantments you wanted (I still haven't managed to get Infinity on my bow).
Again with the writing tips, I don't understand why this question isn't answered immediately. This is the initial argument you need to make before you can suggest me you have a better idea and you chose to answer it in two sentences at the end of your post.
Also, I feel like it's a moot point saying you'll waste a lot of lapis and leather on the enchantments you want since you'll waste far more resources on these new enhancements. Seriously... 81 104 Diamonds for... Unbreaking V? Unbreaking V? And meanwhile Luck V only requires 81 104 Lapis, which I can get far easier.
Lastly, while you say enchanting is a lottery... I will again restate that I think that's the point. Before Mending, you would have to either repair or replace your tools semi-frequently even if you used diamond tools. This means each time you enchant a tool, you're hoping for good stuff. I'm not convinced that the goal of enchanting was ever "I'm specifically looking for these enchantments, and will grind to get them until I find them."
Now granted, this lottery system on its own needs improvement such as making enchantments like Bane of Arthropods worth getting, but I don't think RNG on its own is entirely an evil in game design.
No Support.
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Y'know it's funny... I was actually thinking of making a similar enchantment overhaul renaming Enchantments to Enhancements in the spirit of renaming Achievements to Advancements. Part of it adds new items and new enhancements such as the ability to completely suppress fire damage, albeit not being able to apply any additional protections on the armor.
Okay to be fair I think you may have written this one before I came up with my idea. I seem to remember reading that post.
A lot of people complain about the chance in enchantments but I'm not exactly sure why this feature gets so much flak since IMO it's supposed to be a bit of a gamble. I think it's because enchantments like Sharpness or Power act as entirely new tiers, whereas enchantments like Bane of Arthropods are complete trash.
I'm not sure if you were planning to upload these later or not but I don't see any attachments. Also, why the change to 3 paper?
Mmkay
Right away I'm not sure about this one since I generally consider Unbreaking, especially levels 1-3, to be a cheap early-game enchantment. I also find Unbreaking especially useful since I tend to use iron tools long into the mid-game because of how cheap they are.
This sounds okay, albeit I'm not sure about "Swing Faster". While I'm not as much of a defender of 1.9 combat as I was back in the day, I don't think upsetting the balance like this should be done on its own. If you're going to make a combat overhaul, I would do it and get it over with.
I like the use of blaze powder but I think this is a bit cheap for a specialized enchantment.
Okay
While this ender pearl cost makes sense for the new Tool and Weapon uses, I feel like it's a bit much to enchant a fishing rod. Ender Pearls are kinda expensive before you reach the end IMO since endermen spawn semi-infrequently, are somewhat dangerous to fight and even when you win against one, there's a chance it won't drop one. I definitely wouldn't want to put ender pearls on my fishing rods early-game.
Hmmmmmm
I'm not sure about this since it kinda makes the Turtle Helmet completely redundant.
It's kinda hard to judge this one since Nether Quartz gets progressively more expensive on servers, Nether Quartz gets more and more difficult to find near spawn. On the other hand, Nether Quartz is incredibly cheap in singleplayer, just as much as redstone or lapis.
I feel like diamonds would be a better resource for luck even if Tinkers' Construct uses lapis.
Ok.
This is way too cheap.
Please no. Poison thrown by witches is already OP enough. Also, why reduce wither damage on its own when you could have an enchantment er... enhancement that reduces all magic attacks?
Okay
Ehhhhh okay
Should Silk Touch really be that rare? It's probably less useful practically than something like Fortune or Sharpness, and is only really useful for getting some aesthetic blocks, or for saving coal when you want to build a giant castle out of stone bricks.
Okay well... If Silk Touch was expensive, Mending is really cheap.
Mending is an enchantment that makes your tools practically indestructible, and considering how some of these enhancements can cost barely anything at all like the Shocking enhancement, that means a lot of these are one-time payments.
Uhhhh... so Unbreaking costs... 104 Diamonds? Is that really balanced? Also... what exactly do you mean by the cost tripling, because 1*(3^(5-1)) does not equal 104? I'm not really sure what else "triples for each additional level" could possibly mean.
Also, as a writing note, could you have disclosed this before you mentioned which items you're paying for each enhancement?
Eehhhhh... I don't know that Golden Tools will have that much more purpose.
Least-needed is a subjective measurement. Some people might consider the Flame on that bow to be useful, for example.
I would say I disagree with this but I've never really tossed around the idea before. That being said, if your argument is that XP is too grindy, I would argue this enhancement system is far more grindy considering that while XP can be gained passively throughout your playtime, these items need to be actively mined or crafted.
Again with the writing tips, I don't understand why this question isn't answered immediately. This is the initial argument you need to make before you can suggest me you have a better idea and you chose to answer it in two sentences at the end of your post.
Also, I feel like it's a moot point saying you'll waste a lot of lapis and leather on the enchantments you want since you'll waste far more resources on these new enhancements. Seriously... 81 104 Diamonds for... Unbreaking V? Unbreaking V? And meanwhile Luck V only requires 81 104 Lapis, which I can get far easier.
Lastly, while you say enchanting is a lottery... I will again restate that I think that's the point. Before Mending, you would have to either repair or replace your tools semi-frequently even if you used diamond tools. This means each time you enchant a tool, you're hoping for good stuff.
I'll take those into account. (Sorry for long quote - deletion doesn't work as well on mobile.)
Before Mending, you would have to either repair or replace your tools semi-frequently even if you used diamond tools. This means each time you enchant a tool, you're hoping for good stuff. I'm not convinced that the goal of enchanting was ever "I'm specifically looking for these enchantments, and will grind to get them until I find them."
Fun fact: This was only true for 1.8 - before then you could simply rename your gear and the prior work penalty would always remain fixed at 2 levels; I've literally mined millions of blocks with the same pickaxe thanks to this, which is also why I don't see any issues with enchanting myself - the only things I enchant after the early-mid game are iron pickaxes I find in mineshafts for 1 level, which I use to mine out tunnels for railways (even though I could just use my Efficiency V, Unbreaking III diamond pickaxe, much as in my first world I trade with villagers for diamond gear used for repairing when I could easily use mined diamonds):
Note that I did not actually enchant 528 pickaxes, most of them were bought from villagers and used to repair a single pickaxe (well, two, as I used to use a Fortune pickaxe in this world before I stopped because it greatly reduced the amount of resources I collect, which are just a byproduct of caving for fun. I also used up a few items early on but I was mainly using iron tools back then). The same also applies to other diamond items and shears:
Likewise, this was from a modded world, where I replaced renaming with Mending (exactly the same as renaming but harder to get) and used much more expensive modded items - I only ever made a single pickaxe as these items can only be repaired with single units (I used a couple unenchanted shovels for terraforming, combining them for a "3rd" item crafted. Armor is not shown but I also only made one chestplate, leggings, and boots):
Also, as mentioned before, I think that if Mending worked like renaming and the old repair system was in place it would be much more balanced as you are limited to what you can put on your gear (it costs 33 levels to repair the aforementioned pickaxe with a sacrifice, 31 if it is optimally damaged (88% combined durability, which results in 100% after a 12% bonus); if you add Fortune III you are now restricted to repairing it with single diamonds for 37 levels each. Even then, it is entirely sustainable to use, at least when caving). I actually did this in TMCW, where my version of Mending works exactly the same, with some cost adjustments so Mending items cost about the same as before (I made Mending cost 8 levels, instead of the 4 in 1.9's version, this also means that non-Mending items are cheaper).
Such limitations would also make people less likely to grind for "god" items (e.g. swords with Sharpness V, Unbreaking III, Knockback II, Fire Aspect II, Sweeping Edge III, Looting III, Mending), greatly reducing the cost of making them in the first place (in other words, I believe that part of the problem is that players feel compelled to make "perfect" gear with every enchantment possible). I did see that the OP wants a similar system, where diamond items can only get 4 "enchancments" but the old system let you make better items at the cost of being unable to repair them (also, gold items do already get better enchantments, just that their other properties make them mostly useless; a Sharpness V gold sword (7 attack damage) is only as strong as an unenchanted diamond sword (prior to 1.9 it was better as Sharpness added 1.25 damage per level, but the durability makes it worthless when I've used up 1/4 of an Unbreaking III diamond sword in a single play session of caving).
Fun fact: This was only true for 1.8 - before then you could simply rename your gear and the prior work penalty would always remain fixed at 2 levels
Fair enough, I'll concede I'm practically illiterate on the anvil system.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My avatar is a texture from a small block game I made in Python. It's not very good and it probably won't work if you install it.
I'm very alone in my Minecraft worlds as I don't have a very good internet connection to run a server. If you're like me, you might be interested in my Posse mod suggestion.
All the item quantities need to be rebalanced, but that's not a terribly important issue.
The overall idea is similar to what I've been thinking, but I don't quite agree on the general allocation of items to enchantment effects. It's too focused on trying to give an item a thematically appropriate effect, and not enough on whether the actual effects are nice or if the final pool of possible enchantments looks good as a big picture.
Rather than sockets, how about this:
Placing enhancements reduces the max durability of an item. The value scales up with more/harder enhancements, but it is a fixed number rather than a percentage of total durability. This inherently makes diamond the best material for enhancements, although I never really thought about how to make gold tools useful.
I present to you: Enhancements! Taking the chance away from enchanting.
Wait, didn't you already suggest this on another thread?
Well yes, but this one's different. That one got flak for adding 15 pointless gems. This one won't have any of that.
What are enhancements?
Enhancements are a new way of upgrading your tool, replacing enchanting. Whereas with enchanting you rely on chance (and lapis and XP) to get what you want, enhancing takes semi-common items you probably have, and nothing else.
How do they work?
To enhance your tool, you need an Enhancement Table (attachment 1). This is crafted just like an enchanting table, but with 3 paper repclacing the book (attatchment 2).
When opened, the table opens up a GUI with a single slot. Place your tool in the slot and more slots open up for gems to be placed in (coming soon).
What enhancements are there?
There are 18 enhancements in total, 2 of which can only be obtained through trading or chest loot.
In this table, T = effects on tools (pickaxe/axe/shovel/shears), W = effects on weapons (sword/axe/trident), R = effects on ranged weapons (bow/crossbow/trident), A - effects on armour and shields.
Diamond - Unbreaking - Last longer - max 5
Redstone - Haste - T Mine faster, W Swing faster, R Fire faster - max 5
Blaze Powder - Firey - WR Inflict fire damage, A Reduce fire damage - max 3
Obsidian - Tough - WR Pierce armor, A Reduce damage - max 5
Ender Pearl - Lure - T Pull in items, WR Pull in mobs, A Increase mob spawn, F (fishing rods) Pull in fish faster - max 3
Scute - Aqua Affinity - T Mine faster underwater, W Swing faster underwater, R Fire faster underwater, A Swim faster, AH (Helmets) Breathe underwater - max 3
Nether Quartz - Sharp - WR Deal more damage, T Damage attackers - max 5
Lapis - Luck - TWR Get more drops, A Increase chance of enemy missing - max 5
Endstone - Reinforced - R Penetrate mobs, A Reduce blast damage - max 3
Redstone Torch - Shocking - WR Stun mobs (strike with lightning if stormy), A Reduce damage form lightning - max 3
Wither Rose - Decay - WR Deal wither damage, A Reduce wither damage - max 3
Slime Block - Knockback - WR Deal knockback, A Reduce knockback - max 3
Gold Ingot - Smite - WR Deal more damage against undead - max 3
Ancient Silk* - Silky - T Get the exact block, W Get mob heads - 1 level
Mending Moss* - Mending - Repair itself - 1 level
Ancient Silk and Mending Moss can be found in chest loot or bought from priest villagers for 12-17 emeralds each.
Enhancing takes 1 of the material for level 1, but the cost triples for each additional level (however, level 5 requires 64 of the material) so getting Sharp 5 requires a whopping 104 nether quartz!
How many enhancements can you put on a single tool?
Good question. Every different tier of tool has a different amount of sockets for gems.
Wood/stone tools, leather/chain armour, bows, fishing rods, shears - 3 sockets
Iron/diamond tools/armour, crossbows, tridents, shields - 4 sockets
Anything golden - 5 sockets
Yes, golden tools now have at least some purpose - superior enhanceability.
What will happen to my god diamond _?
Don't worry, because your super-OP enchanted gear will become super-OP enhanced gear.
For example, a Fortune III Unbreaking III Efficiency V diamond pickaxe will become a Luck 3 Unbreaking 3 Haste 5 diamond pickaxe. You will only lose enchantments if you are over the limit (i.e. a Power V Punch V Unbreking III Infinity I Flame I bow), in which case the game removes your least-needed enchantments (ie. Punch and Flame).
Does it cost any XP?
Nope. In fact, I'd like to see XP removed altogether (although that's for another thread, to avoid being wishlisty).
Why replace enchantments with enhancements?
As the old thread's OP stated, enchanting is a lottery. You'll waste a lot of XP, lapis, leather and time getting the enchantments you wanted (I still haven't managed to get Infinity on my bow).
My suggestions: Enhancements - Throwable Fire Charges - On Phantoms and Elytra. Also check out The Minecraftian Language. This signature is not here to waste your space.
I don't like the idea of replacing enchanting altogether. And if you ask me, your suggested system sounds much more tedious and spreadsheet-y than placing a tool/book in an enchanting table and clicking a button.
No support.
Watch out for the crabocalypse. Some say the day will never come. But it will.
Feel free to drop by for a chat whenever.
If you'd like to talk with me about other games, here are a few I play.
Team Fortress 2
Borderlands series (Borderlands 2 is my favorite game, ever. TPS combat is a lot of fun and makes up for the lower-quality story, in my opinion)
Elder Scrolls series
Warframe (IGN is something like That_One_Flesh_Atronach)
Pokémon series (HGSS forever)
Rocket League
Fallout series
Left 4 Dead 2 (Boomer files always corrupt though)
SUPERHOT (SUPERHOT is the most innovative shooter I've played in years!)
Dead Rising series (Dead Rising 2 is one of my favorite games, and the 3rd was a lot of fun. 1st has poor survivor AI and the 4th is bad)
Just Cause series
Come to think of it, I mainly play fighting-based games.
Isn't this basically just the system from Tinker's Construct, but without a Smeltery and modified slightly? Not that I am opposed to that, I'm just curious.
I could really take or leave this system. I definitely don't like it overriding enchantments on existing gear, plus the "least-needed" enchantments is subjective.
I think what would be ideal is a combination of both systems. Being able to potentially get a good mix of enchantments right off the bat with enchanting, or being in for a longer grind to make exactly what you want.
Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-discussion/suggestions/2775557-guidelines-for-the-suggestions-forum
This is already the case - directly enchant items to get random enchantments, which may or may not be what you want (tip: mouse over the enchantment options to see one of the offered enchantments; you can also disenchant items on a grindstone in return for some XP and the ability to re-enchant it, or try enchanting a different item - they really have made enchanting massively easier since 1.8, or even 1.3, which greatly reduced XP costs) - or enchant or trade for books to get specific enchantments (this is what I do for most of my gear to avoid wasting diamonds or my extremely rare modded gear, as I also play in 1.6.4 (with the same enchantment mechanics) so I can't see what they will get, and items like chestplates could always get something like Thorns which may not show up in the tooltip).
Either way, I don't find enchanting to be an issue since I only do it one time; I use the same set of gear for the lifetime of a world (32.7+ days of time played for my current world), which is also partly why I see no point in having fancy trading halls or XP farms. I get most of my XP by mining quartz, which also doubles as a building material for my main base, so I get two things done at once; afterwards I get more XP than I need from normal gameplay to keep my gear in repair, with a higher overall cost than since 1.9 with Mending (speaking of which, if XP were removed how would Mending work? Granted, I think it is OP since you only need XP to repair an item, making what should be a major part of the game (Minecraft) pointless, and the cost is the same regardless of its quality, in sharp contrast to the pre-1.8 repair system, where you could simply rename an item to keep the penalty down but you had to pay the full enchantment cost (e.g. 5 levels for Sharpness V, 4 for Knockback II, 6 for Unbreaking III, plus 6 more levels for having 3 enchantments for a total of 21 levels before adding any other costs), as well as for the durability restored (currently a flat 2 levels for an item or 1 per unit, as opposed to 1-17 levels), so most items could only have 3 enchantments, sometimes 4, before they became too expensive to repair).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
I would also like to see mending require only a fixed cost of raw materials, no XP required, but I didn't add it here as it would become too wishlisty.
Placing a tool and some materials in an table and clicking a button is no more tedious than placing a tool and a book in a table and clicking a button.
Yes, it's inspired by TCon's similar system.
Don't worry, all existing enchantments will carry over (provided they don't get cut). Neededness is determined by objective orders.
My suggestions: Enhancements - Throwable Fire Charges - On Phantoms and Elytra. Also check out The Minecraftian Language. This signature is not here to waste your space.
Except you have to go out and grind to get resources to enhance. Compare finding all these resources just for one extra enchantment level compared to breeding cows for a few hours and getting max-level enchantments consistently. Every time you want to add Unbreaking to a tool, you have to sacrifice a diamond per level. XP can also be tedious to obtain but becomes substantially easier in the late-game. (1395 XP; for reference, about 280 Enderman must be killed to go from 0 to 30.) Plus, enchanting only takes one to three levels, meaning that buy sacrificing three levels, you'll only need 306 XP to reach 30 again. Those six diamonds you spent crafting a pick and putting Unbreaking 3 on it can basically guarantee Efficiency 4 and Unbreaking 3 at level 30 enchants on two pickaxes. That's ignoring other enchantments like Fortune or Silk Touch. There are also enchanted books that guarantee you'll get the enchantments on there. Enchanted books are easy to obtain: villagers, dungeon chests, End Cities. Even just fishing can net you the rare Mending books.
Enchanting shouldn't be a chore to obtain. The most common and useful enchantment consumes one of the rarest resources in the game? Not everybody can go mining that much. The benefits should outweigh the costs, not vice-versa.
Watch out for the crabocalypse. Some say the day will never come. But it will.
Feel free to drop by for a chat whenever.
If you'd like to talk with me about other games, here are a few I play.
Team Fortress 2
Borderlands series (Borderlands 2 is my favorite game, ever. TPS combat is a lot of fun and makes up for the lower-quality story, in my opinion)
Elder Scrolls series
Warframe (IGN is something like That_One_Flesh_Atronach)
Pokémon series (HGSS forever)
Rocket League
Fallout series
Left 4 Dead 2 (Boomer files always corrupt though)
SUPERHOT (SUPERHOT is the most innovative shooter I've played in years!)
Dead Rising series (Dead Rising 2 is one of my favorite games, and the 3rd was a lot of fun. 1st has poor survivor AI and the 4th is bad)
Just Cause series
Come to think of it, I mainly play fighting-based games.
While I might change diamonds, most of the others (Haste, Luck, Tough, Sharp) are resources you will probably have a few of by the time you make the enhancement table (although some, like Decay, which are more OP, are more expensive.)
My suggestions: Enhancements - Throwable Fire Charges - On Phantoms and Elytra. Also check out The Minecraftian Language. This signature is not here to waste your space.
I think both sides make some valid points, which is why I think having both systems would work. The current system is a bit easier (imo, I agree with Jancrash), because tons of different tasks give you experience. That is offset by the fact there is a higher risk when you die (a normal death should still let you get your items, but you lose most of your XP), and the system using XP is randomized.
Meanwhile, this alternative system may be more tedious to get large amounts of specific items, but you get exactly what you want if you are willing to put in the time. I know the OP is pushing for a replacement of the existing enchanting system but I really think they could work best in conjunction with each other.
Want some advice on how to thrive in the Suggestions section? Check this handy list of guidelines and tips for posting your ideas and responding to the ideas of others!
http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-discussion/suggestions/2775557-guidelines-for-the-suggestions-forum
Maybe some type of imbuing gem from villagers would work better?
Watch out for the crabocalypse. Some say the day will never come. But it will.
Feel free to drop by for a chat whenever.
If you'd like to talk with me about other games, here are a few I play.
Team Fortress 2
Borderlands series (Borderlands 2 is my favorite game, ever. TPS combat is a lot of fun and makes up for the lower-quality story, in my opinion)
Elder Scrolls series
Warframe (IGN is something like That_One_Flesh_Atronach)
Pokémon series (HGSS forever)
Rocket League
Fallout series
Left 4 Dead 2 (Boomer files always corrupt though)
SUPERHOT (SUPERHOT is the most innovative shooter I've played in years!)
Dead Rising series (Dead Rising 2 is one of my favorite games, and the 3rd was a lot of fun. 1st has poor survivor AI and the 4th is bad)
Just Cause series
Come to think of it, I mainly play fighting-based games.
That's basically what my original suggestion was about: 15 different types of gem dropped from one ore or bought from villagers. Problem: It adds 15 useless items. Which is why I came up with this one instead.
My suggestions: Enhancements - Throwable Fire Charges - On Phantoms and Elytra. Also check out The Minecraftian Language. This signature is not here to waste your space.
Y'know it's funny... I was actually thinking of making a similar enchantment overhaul renaming Enchantments to Enhancements in the spirit of renaming Achievements to Advancements. Part of it adds new items and new enhancements such as the ability to completely suppress fire damage, albeit not being able to apply any additional protections on the armor.
Okay to be fair I think you may have written this one before I came up with my idea. I seem to remember reading that post.
A lot of people complain about the chance in enchantments but I'm not exactly sure why this feature gets so much flak since IMO it's supposed to be a bit of a gamble. I think it's because enchantments like Sharpness or Power act as entirely new tiers, whereas enchantments like Bane of Arthropods are complete trash.
I'm not sure if you were planning to upload these later or not but I don't see any attachments. Also, why the change to 3 paper?
Mmkay
Right away I'm not sure about this one since I generally consider Unbreaking, especially levels 1-3, to be a cheap early-game enchantment. I also find Unbreaking especially useful since I tend to use iron tools long into the mid-game because of how cheap they are.
This sounds okay, albeit I'm not sure about "Swing Faster". While I'm not as much of a defender of 1.9 combat as I was back in the day, I don't think upsetting the balance like this should be done on its own. If you're going to make a combat overhaul, I would do it and get it over with.
I like the use of blaze powder but I think this is a bit cheap for a specialized enchantment.
Okay
While this ender pearl cost makes sense for the new Tool and Weapon uses, I feel like it's a bit much to enchant a fishing rod. Ender Pearls are kinda expensive before you reach the end IMO since endermen spawn semi-infrequently, are somewhat dangerous to fight and even when you win against one, there's a chance it won't drop one. I definitely wouldn't want to put ender pearls on my fishing rods early-game.
Hmmmmmm
I'm not sure about this since it kinda makes the Turtle Helmet completely redundant.
It's kinda hard to judge this one since Nether Quartz gets progressively more expensive on servers, Nether Quartz gets more and more difficult to find near spawn. On the other hand, Nether Quartz is incredibly cheap in singleplayer, just as much as redstone or lapis.
I feel like diamonds would be a better resource for luck even if Tinkers' Construct uses lapis.
Ok.
This is way too cheap.
Please no. Poison thrown by witches is already OP enough. Also, why reduce wither damage on its own when you could have an enchantment er... enhancement that reduces all magic attacks?
Okay
Ehhhhh okay
Should Silk Touch really be that rare? It's probably less useful practically than something like Fortune or Sharpness, and is only really useful for getting some aesthetic blocks, or for saving coal when you want to build a giant castle out of stone bricks.
Okay well... If Silk Touch was expensive, Mending is really cheap.
Mending is an enchantment that makes your tools practically indestructible, and considering how some of these enhancements can cost barely anything at all like the Shocking enhancement, that means a lot of these are one-time payments.
Uhhhh... so Unbreaking costs... 104 Diamonds? Is that really balanced? Also... what exactly do you mean by the cost tripling, because 1*(3^(5-1)) does not equal 104? I'm not really sure what else "triples for each additional level" could possibly mean.
Also, as a writing note, could you have disclosed this before you mentioned which items you're paying for each enhancement?
Eehhhhh... I don't know that Golden Tools will have that much more purpose.
Least-needed is a subjective measurement. Some people might consider the Flame on that bow to be useful, for example.
I would say I disagree with this but I've never really tossed around the idea before. That being said, if your argument is that XP is too grindy, I would argue this enhancement system is far more grindy considering that while XP can be gained passively throughout your playtime, these items need to be actively mined or crafted.
Again with the writing tips, I don't understand why this question isn't answered immediately. This is the initial argument you need to make before you can suggest me you have a better idea and you chose to answer it in two sentences at the end of your post.
Also, I feel like it's a moot point saying you'll waste a lot of lapis and leather on the enchantments you want since you'll waste far more resources on these new enhancements. Seriously...
81104 Diamonds for... Unbreaking V? Unbreaking V? And meanwhile Luck V only requires81104 Lapis, which I can get far easier.Lastly, while you say enchanting is a lottery... I will again restate that I think that's the point. Before Mending, you would have to either repair or replace your tools semi-frequently even if you used diamond tools. This means each time you enchant a tool, you're hoping for good stuff. I'm not convinced that the goal of enchanting was ever "I'm specifically looking for these enchantments, and will grind to get them until I find them."
Now granted, this lottery system on its own needs improvement such as making enchantments like Bane of Arthropods worth getting, but I don't think RNG on its own is entirely an evil in game design.
No Support.
My avatar is a texture from a small block game I made in Python. It's not very good and it probably won't work if you install it.
I'm very alone in my Minecraft worlds as I don't have a very good internet connection to run a server. If you're like me, you might be interested in my Posse mod suggestion.
I'll take those into account. (Sorry for long quote - deletion doesn't work as well on mobile.)
My suggestions: Enhancements - Throwable Fire Charges - On Phantoms and Elytra. Also check out The Minecraftian Language. This signature is not here to waste your space.
Fun fact: This was only true for 1.8 - before then you could simply rename your gear and the prior work penalty would always remain fixed at 2 levels; I've literally mined millions of blocks with the same pickaxe thanks to this, which is also why I don't see any issues with enchanting myself - the only things I enchant after the early-mid game are iron pickaxes I find in mineshafts for 1 level, which I use to mine out tunnels for railways (even though I could just use my Efficiency V, Unbreaking III diamond pickaxe, much as in my first world I trade with villagers for diamond gear used for repairing when I could easily use mined diamonds):
Likewise, this was from a modded world, where I replaced renaming with Mending (exactly the same as renaming but harder to get) and used much more expensive modded items - I only ever made a single pickaxe as these items can only be repaired with single units (I used a couple unenchanted shovels for terraforming, combining them for a "3rd" item crafted. Armor is not shown but I also only made one chestplate, leggings, and boots):
Also, as mentioned before, I think that if Mending worked like renaming and the old repair system was in place it would be much more balanced as you are limited to what you can put on your gear (it costs 33 levels to repair the aforementioned pickaxe with a sacrifice, 31 if it is optimally damaged (88% combined durability, which results in 100% after a 12% bonus); if you add Fortune III you are now restricted to repairing it with single diamonds for 37 levels each. Even then, it is entirely sustainable to use, at least when caving). I actually did this in TMCW, where my version of Mending works exactly the same, with some cost adjustments so Mending items cost about the same as before (I made Mending cost 8 levels, instead of the 4 in 1.9's version, this also means that non-Mending items are cheaper).
Such limitations would also make people less likely to grind for "god" items (e.g. swords with Sharpness V, Unbreaking III, Knockback II, Fire Aspect II, Sweeping Edge III, Looting III, Mending), greatly reducing the cost of making them in the first place (in other words, I believe that part of the problem is that players feel compelled to make "perfect" gear with every enchantment possible). I did see that the OP wants a similar system, where diamond items can only get 4 "enchancments" but the old system let you make better items at the cost of being unable to repair them (also, gold items do already get better enchantments, just that their other properties make them mostly useless; a Sharpness V gold sword (7 attack damage) is only as strong as an unenchanted diamond sword (prior to 1.9 it was better as Sharpness added 1.25 damage per level, but the durability makes it worthless when I've used up 1/4 of an Unbreaking III diamond sword in a single play session of caving).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
Fair enough, I'll concede I'm practically illiterate on the anvil system.
My avatar is a texture from a small block game I made in Python. It's not very good and it probably won't work if you install it.
I'm very alone in my Minecraft worlds as I don't have a very good internet connection to run a server. If you're like me, you might be interested in my Posse mod suggestion.
All the item quantities need to be rebalanced, but that's not a terribly important issue.
The overall idea is similar to what I've been thinking, but I don't quite agree on the general allocation of items to enchantment effects. It's too focused on trying to give an item a thematically appropriate effect, and not enough on whether the actual effects are nice or if the final pool of possible enchantments looks good as a big picture.
Rather than sockets, how about this:
Placing enhancements reduces the max durability of an item. The value scales up with more/harder enhancements, but it is a fixed number rather than a percentage of total durability. This inherently makes diamond the best material for enhancements, although I never really thought about how to make gold tools useful.