The Meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything.
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Paladinluke
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While 1.10 is in the works, I since 1.7 have wanted an update that expands villagers to more than just the cheapskate "HRR"ing mobs they are. I thought of a few ideas back then and I am here to revise those ideas and spread them with the world.
NEW VILLAGERS:
-Merchant: These fellows sell random but exotic items that even clergymen don't have (i.e.: Ender Eyes, Chainmail) for cheap prices. However, Merchants are hard to spot because they rarely spawn and move from village to village. You won't see the same merchant twice!
-Builder: They make buildings for the village. Buildings that are small (Farm, House) may only take around one minecraft day to build, while larger constructions (Church) take more time. Builders can make new projects after six days from completing the last, but around 3-4 builders will be in a village at any given moment. They also trade building supplies (Cobblestone, Wooden Planks) for emeralds. NEW: Builders will build according to how much population a village has, e.g.: 10 villagers = 4 small houses, 2 large houses, a blacksmith, a butcher's, and two farms.
NEW CONCEPTS:
Building construction - it is as the name suggests. Villages become dynamic by having buildings being built while the game goes on.
So, what do you guys think? Have any suggestions? Leave some feedback.
I think you would love the Milianaire mod. Although outdated (1.710) it provides the closest real village you can get to. It allows you learn languages of the local inhabitants, declare warm build new buildings and more.
As for your ideas I think its not fit for the game. I never have seen a dynamic feature be added into the game and I dont think I ever will with mine craft. The world is static and nothing changes it except for you (and a few creatures but thats not dynamic.) The world itself is incredibly stale and refusing to change. Players have to change it. This would be literally the first thing that actively changes the environment dynamically without player input.
Also I don't think building random buildings for no reason is an approach to do. What they need is an overhaul. I've always felt that villagers never came in the way that the developers intended for them to be but rather a feature they got halfway through and droped.
Partial support - Villages and villagers need an overhaul. I like the Merchant though.
I think you would love the Milianaire mod. Although outdated (1.710) it provides the closest real village you can get to. It allows you learn languages of the local inhabitants, declare warm build new buildings and more.
I love the Millênaire mod. I was actually playing a game with the Japanese faction before I posted this. I wish they would update it to at least 1.8. But times come and times go.
As for your ideas I think its not fit for the game. I never have seen a dynamic feature be added into the game and I don't think I ever will with mine craft. The world is static and nothing changes it except for you (and a few creatures but that's not dynamic.) The world itself is incredibly stale and refusing to change. Players have to change it. This would be literally the first thing that actively changes the environment dynamically without player input.
That's why I want the villages. I want the static minecraft world to slowly evolve, much like how humanity has. I want the villagers and villages they live in to be dynamic, but it would also be fueled with player interaction (i.e.; selling building materials, making friendships) so the world could stay static if the player does not interact.
Also I don't think building random buildings for no reason is an approach to do. What they need is an overhaul. I've always felt that villagers never came in the way that the developers intended for them to be but rather a feature they got halfway through and dropped.
I wasn't thinking they would be random. They would be built around the amount of villagers that populate the village.
Example:
10 villagers - 4 small houses, 2 large houses, a blacksmith, a butcher's, and two farms.
20 villagers - 8 small houses, 4 large, 2 blacksmiths, 2 butcher's, 3 farms, and a library.
30 - 12 small, 6 large, 3 smiths, 4 butcher's, 5 farms, 2 libraries, and a church.
I am not sure what the math would be, I am just thinking of random numbers.
Uhh these two things don't warrant it's own update. Why do we need a merchant villager if ALL villagers sell/buy things? A builder villager is one of the most hated ideas on here, because players can just manipulate him to build stuff for us and it requires some mad, mad AI refining. It's just not worth it.
A builder villager is one of the most hated ideas on here, because players can just manipulate him to build stuff for us and it requires some mad, mad AI refining. It's just not worth it.
If you want something built, build it yourself.
The villagers do not take requests. They just sell building materials and buy materials. That's all they do for the player.
I could see people manipulating the villagers with spawners but mind you that they would only build accordingly to the villager population. Sure, you could manipulate the builder to construct a large house, but expect to be neighbors with 5-10 villagers. If you wanted them to build neighborhoods the size of manhattan, you would need the population of manhattan.
The whole idea is great but coding a merchant to travel from one village to another could cause many problems. And what if there was only one village? Thank a bit more.
The whole idea is great but coding a merchant to travel from one village to another could cause many problems. And what if there was only one village? Thank a bit more.
75% Support
I could see the coding being a problem, I can't deny that. But a world with only one village is very unlikely. If that does happen, I assume the merchant would just stay in the village he is currently in.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
I see your point. But would about the deal of the builders? That could also develop problems. How about if you are too far away from the village, it will not grow.
The Meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything.
Join Date:
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Posts:
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Minecraft:
Paladinluke
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Member Details
@Skull
That is kind of like what I said to Shadow:
Quote from Paladinluke»
That's why I want the villages. I want the static minecraft world to slowly evolve, much like how humanity has. I want the villagers and villages they live in to be dynamic, but it would also be fueled with player interaction (i.e.; selling building materials, making friendships) so the world could stay static if the player does not interact.
I think I'll start adding what I said in the comments to the main thread
They would sell exotics, like ender eyes and chainmail. Stuff you wouldn't ordinarily find in a normal game.
That would be terrible. The "armorer" villager already sells chainmail, and a villager should never sell Ender Eyes... All it takes is for a player to camp an easy trade, bank up on emeralds, then get easy access to the Ender Eyes. There's a reason why some of the rare stuff in the game is never sold.
The villagers do not take requests. They just sell building materials and buy materials. That's all they do for the player.
The problem is not the reason for them building. The problem is them building.
I could see people manipulating the villagers with spawners but mind you that they would only build accordingly to the villager population. Sure, you could manipulate the builder to construct a large house, but expect to be neighbors with 5-10 villagers. If you wanted them to build neighborhoods the size of manhattan, you would need the population of manhattan.
I don't see how this justifies the idea. Again, some insane AI programming is needed for this. I know it's not valid criticism to claim what Mojang has to go through, but in a game with infinite possibilities of terrain, it's too much work for something a player can do much faster.
That would be terrible. The "armorer" villager already sells chainmail, and a villager should never sell Ender Eyes... All it takes is for a player to camp an easy trade, bank up on emeralds, then get easy access to the Ender Eyes. There's a reason why some of the rare stuff in the game is never sold.
But the merchants would be extremely rare as well. Ender eyes would be fairly expensive and you wouldn't be able to buy 64 in one session (limited supply perhaps). I was just giving that as an example of a hard to get item. Can you name something else off the top of your head?
So you went from saying "It would be too easy for the player to make them work for you" to "It would be too hard for the player to make them work for you". Again, the builders are not made to be player slaves. They do not take requests. They only build for the village to make the world dynamic.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
Hopefully this all makes sense and is comprehensible. No personal hate to you at all I just think as with every new update your one of the players that would be upset by the change, we can't please everyone.
That would be terrible. The "armorer" villager already sells chainmail, and a villager should never sell Ender Eyes... All it takes is for a player to camp an easy trade, bank up on emeralds, then get easy access to the Ender Eyes. There's a reason why some of the rare stuff in the game is never sold.
The problem is not the reason for them building. The problem is them building.
I don't see how this justifies the idea. Again, some insane AI programming is needed for this. I know it's not valid criticism to claim what Mojang has to go through, but in a game with infinite possibilities of terrain, it's too much work for something a player can do much faster.
I believe all of your problems to be unfounded. I would bet money that if the spawner blocks were never added than any suggestion to would be horribly put down. People would just sit there and complain (I would use another word but its a family friendly place) that it can be used to set up farms for mobs and a way to get infinite amount of items. Not to mention its an extremely easy way to get a lot of xp fast and make the enchantment system even more worthless.
I think it would be fine to allow villagers to sell these items. We're not playing a grind fest here but a game. Not to mention I can already abuse villagers to buy sharpness 1 books or any enchanted book, combine many of them in anvils and then have the best enchanted gear possible. Even have many spares.
The villagers do not take requests. They just sell building materials and buy materials. That's all they do for the player.
The problem is not the reason for them building. The problem is them building.
Arguement 2
Oh boy you get some free materials in the form of glass, wood and cobblestone. It's like they can't all be easily farmed faster than actually stealing them from the building. It's not like I can chop wood and get 4 a piece from trees compared to 1 from a plank. It's not like I can't already nick off some wood at a farm currently in game or make a very compact cobblestone generator.
I could see people manipulating the villagers with spawners but mind you that they would only build accordingly to the villager population. Sure, you could manipulate the builder to construct a large house, but expect to be neighbors with 5-10 villagers. If you wanted them to build neighborhoods the size of manhattan, you would need the population of manhattan.
I don't see how this justifies the idea. Again, some insane AI programming is needed for this. I know it's not valid criticism to claim what Mojang has to go through, but in a game with infinite possibilities of terrain, it's too much work for something a player can do much faster.
I don't think you've even coded before. It's not this easy but I feel like these would be the steps to actually make it work.
Tell the builder AI once a day to check village population and available buildings that can be build
If a building is available choose it, if more are than build at random or in order.
Check distance between player built objects and already completed houses
Don't mark a plot within the distance of these blocks (Wood planks, cobblestone, beds, torches ect)
Pick the plot
Tell the worker to fill up these areas with the correct material
When completed run a test to make sure the entire building has been built
Find nearest gravel
Dig out a path to the newly created object
Fill in the area just dug
Victory
You could even tell the worker to check buildings occasionally for damage, and when it's damaged to repair it.
The reason why I suggested an overhaul is because its very easy to not make this op (Even though you can get more resources in the time waiting for it to be rebuilt.) Perhaps one day we can see the resources a village has through the Villager and if they don't have enough then don't build it. Perhaps the players can donate. Until then, there is really no point for these things to be in the game but to give you bad deals and add some buildings.
Yes the player can do it but they're not, its the environment around them thats doing it. The game right now is to static as is, with this change the world would actually feel more alive. This is more of an opinion you're trying to make fact, do we want the world to feel more alive or do we want the player to be the only force to ever change something in this world?
To sum everything I said up the game is already op as is and if all of these ideas were presented to us now before they were implemented we would never have anything like Mob Spawners, op village traders, gold farms, iron farms and more. Any way that this can be abused is no different than how the game already is.
But the merchants would be extremely rare as well. Ender eyes would be fairly expensive and you wouldn't be able to buy 64 in one session (limited supply perhaps). I was just giving that as an example of a hard to get item. Can you name something else off the top of your head?
So you went from saying "It would be too easy for the player to make them work for you" to "It would be too hard for the player to make them work for you". Again, the builders are not made to be player slaves. They do not take requests. They only build for the village to make the world dynamic.
Sorry if I derailed your topic here with that arguement, but it needed to be said. I mean who honestly thinks that they would build personal buildings for you if you have not stated it. Harvest resources from something they've built? I don't think so. It would be much easier to get 8 saplings and plant them then to actually wait for this worker to build something. I think the problem here is that a lot of players here are younger and still need to learn some critical thinking skills. That and they expect things to be handed out to them. I would really love a mature minecraft forums than a kiddy friendly one where the rainbow shines over everything thats said.
Just here's the trick: Talk to people before making suggestions. That way, you learn the problems before you send it to the public. My chair idea went through many stages before it was actually a thread.
Just here's the trick: Talk to people before making suggestions. That way, you learn the problems before you send it to the public. My chair idea went through many stages before it was actually a thread.
Sorry if I derailed your topic here with that arguement, but it needed to be said. I mean who honestly thinks that they would build personal buildings for you if you have not stated it. Harvest resources from something they've built? I don't think so. It would be much easier to get 8 saplings and plant them then to actually wait for this worker to build something. I think the problem here is that a lot of players here are younger and still need to learn some critical thinking skills. That and they expect things to be handed out to them. I would really love a mature minecraft forums than a kiddy friendly one where the rainbow shines over everything thats said.
I never thought of the builders making stuff for the player, Acknid was the one who raised the question in the air. And I will admit, it is a question that needed to be asked.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
While 1.10 is in the works, I since 1.7 have wanted an update that expands villagers to more than just the cheapskate "HRR"ing mobs they are. I thought of a few ideas back then and I am here to revise those ideas and spread them with the world.
NEW VILLAGERS:
-Merchant: These fellows sell random but exotic items that even clergymen don't have (i.e.: Ender Eyes, Chainmail) for cheap prices. However, Merchants are hard to spot because they rarely spawn and move from village to village. You won't see the same merchant twice!
-Builder: They make buildings for the village. Buildings that are small (Farm, House) may only take around one minecraft day to build, while larger constructions (Church) take more time. Builders can make new projects after six days from completing the last, but around 3-4 builders will be in a village at any given moment. They also trade building supplies (Cobblestone, Wooden Planks) for emeralds. NEW: Builders will build according to how much population a village has, e.g.: 10 villagers = 4 small houses, 2 large houses, a blacksmith, a butcher's, and two farms.
NEW CONCEPTS:
Building construction - it is as the name suggests. Villages become dynamic by having buildings being built while the game goes on.
So, what do you guys think? Have any suggestions? Leave some feedback.
NOTABLE SUGGESTED IDEAS:
-Merchants have guard dogs.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
EDIT: 1.11. I am not that up to date with minecraft recently.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
I think you would love the Milianaire mod. Although outdated (1.710) it provides the closest real village you can get to. It allows you learn languages of the local inhabitants, declare warm build new buildings and more.
As for your ideas I think its not fit for the game. I never have seen a dynamic feature be added into the game and I dont think I ever will with mine craft. The world is static and nothing changes it except for you (and a few creatures but thats not dynamic.) The world itself is incredibly stale and refusing to change. Players have to change it. This would be literally the first thing that actively changes the environment dynamically without player input.
Also I don't think building random buildings for no reason is an approach to do. What they need is an overhaul. I've always felt that villagers never came in the way that the developers intended for them to be but rather a feature they got halfway through and droped.
Partial support - Villages and villagers need an overhaul. I like the Merchant though.
I love the Millênaire mod. I was actually playing a game with the Japanese faction before I posted this. I wish they would update it to at least 1.8. But times come and times go.
That's why I want the villages. I want the static minecraft world to slowly evolve, much like how humanity has. I want the villagers and villages they live in to be dynamic, but it would also be fueled with player interaction (i.e.; selling building materials, making friendships) so the world could stay static if the player does not interact.
I wasn't thinking they would be random. They would be built around the amount of villagers that populate the village.
Example:
10 villagers - 4 small houses, 2 large houses, a blacksmith, a butcher's, and two farms.
20 villagers - 8 small houses, 4 large, 2 blacksmiths, 2 butcher's, 3 farms, and a library.
30 - 12 small, 6 large, 3 smiths, 4 butcher's, 5 farms, 2 libraries, and a church.
I am not sure what the math would be, I am just thinking of random numbers.
Glad to hear it!
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
Uhh these two things don't warrant it's own update. Why do we need a merchant villager if ALL villagers sell/buy things? A builder villager is one of the most hated ideas on here, because players can just manipulate him to build stuff for us and it requires some mad, mad AI refining. It's just not worth it.
If you want something built, build it yourself.
They would sell exotics, like ender eyes and chainmail. Stuff you wouldn't ordinarily find in a normal game.
The villagers do not take requests. They just sell building materials and buy materials. That's all they do for the player.
I could see people manipulating the villagers with spawners but mind you that they would only build accordingly to the villager population. Sure, you could manipulate the builder to construct a large house, but expect to be neighbors with 5-10 villagers. If you wanted them to build neighborhoods the size of manhattan, you would need the population of manhattan.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
The whole idea is great but coding a merchant to travel from one village to another could cause many problems. And what if there was only one village? Thank a bit more.
75% Support
I could see the coding being a problem, I can't deny that. But a world with only one village is very unlikely. If that does happen, I assume the merchant would just stay in the village he is currently in.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
I see your point. But would about the deal of the builders? That could also develop problems. How about if you are too far away from the village, it will not grow.
@Skull
That is kind of like what I said to Shadow:
That's why I want the villages. I want the static minecraft world to slowly evolve, much like how humanity has. I want the villagers and villages they live in to be dynamic, but it would also be fueled with player interaction (i.e.; selling building materials, making friendships) so the world could stay static if the player does not interact.
I think I'll start adding what I said in the comments to the main thread
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
I see your point.
SUPPORT
The Merchant is cool, but the Builder could grief houses if you build one in a village?
Half Support
I would think there would be hitbox tracking or something to prevent builders from building on other buildings (which would require more coding).
This looks more complex than I thought.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
That would be terrible. The "armorer" villager already sells chainmail, and a villager should never sell Ender Eyes... All it takes is for a player to camp an easy trade, bank up on emeralds, then get easy access to the Ender Eyes. There's a reason why some of the rare stuff in the game is never sold.
The problem is not the reason for them building. The problem is them building.
I don't see how this justifies the idea. Again, some insane AI programming is needed for this. I know it's not valid criticism to claim what Mojang has to go through, but in a game with infinite possibilities of terrain, it's too much work for something a player can do much faster.
But the merchants would be extremely rare as well. Ender eyes would be fairly expensive and you wouldn't be able to buy 64 in one session (limited supply perhaps). I was just giving that as an example of a hard to get item. Can you name something else off the top of your head?
So you went from saying "It would be too easy for the player to make them work for you" to "It would be too hard for the player to make them work for you". Again, the builders are not made to be player slaves. They do not take requests. They only build for the village to make the world dynamic.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.
Hopefully this all makes sense and is comprehensible. No personal hate to you at all I just think as with every new update your one of the players that would be upset by the change, we can't please everyone.
I believe all of your problems to be unfounded. I would bet money that if the spawner blocks were never added than any suggestion to would be horribly put down. People would just sit there and complain (I would use another word but its a family friendly place) that it can be used to set up farms for mobs and a way to get infinite amount of items. Not to mention its an extremely easy way to get a lot of xp fast and make the enchantment system even more worthless.
I think it would be fine to allow villagers to sell these items. We're not playing a grind fest here but a game. Not to mention I can already abuse villagers to buy sharpness 1 books or any enchanted book, combine many of them in anvils and then have the best enchanted gear possible. Even have many spares.
Arguement 2
Oh boy you get some free materials in the form of glass, wood and cobblestone. It's like they can't all be easily farmed faster than actually stealing them from the building. It's not like I can chop wood and get 4 a piece from trees compared to 1 from a plank. It's not like I can't already nick off some wood at a farm currently in game or make a very compact cobblestone generator.
I don't think you've even coded before. It's not this easy but I feel like these would be the steps to actually make it work.
You could even tell the worker to check buildings occasionally for damage, and when it's damaged to repair it.
The reason why I suggested an overhaul is because its very easy to not make this op (Even though you can get more resources in the time waiting for it to be rebuilt.) Perhaps one day we can see the resources a village has through the Villager and if they don't have enough then don't build it. Perhaps the players can donate. Until then, there is really no point for these things to be in the game but to give you bad deals and add some buildings.
Yes the player can do it but they're not, its the environment around them thats doing it. The game right now is to static as is, with this change the world would actually feel more alive. This is more of an opinion you're trying to make fact, do we want the world to feel more alive or do we want the player to be the only force to ever change something in this world?
To sum everything I said up the game is already op as is and if all of these ideas were presented to us now before they were implemented we would never have anything like Mob Spawners, op village traders, gold farms, iron farms and more. Any way that this can be abused is no different than how the game already is.
Sorry if I derailed your topic here with that arguement, but it needed to be said. I mean who honestly thinks that they would build personal buildings for you if you have not stated it. Harvest resources from something they've built? I don't think so. It would be much easier to get 8 saplings and plant them then to actually wait for this worker to build something. I think the problem here is that a lot of players here are younger and still need to learn some critical thinking skills. That and they expect things to be handed out to them. I would really love a mature minecraft forums than a kiddy friendly one where the rainbow shines over everything thats said.
Just here's the trick: Talk to people before making suggestions. That way, you learn the problems before you send it to the public. My chair idea went through many stages before it was actually a thread.
Chairs
The merchant is cool. The builder would be tough to put in the game, but also sounds pretty cool.
Support.
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The village idea was originally just to add the builder; I discussed much more with people years back but sadly this was all I could remember.
I never thought of the builders making stuff for the player, Acknid was the one who raised the question in the air. And I will admit, it is a question that needed to be asked.
There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.