My whole goal right now near the start of my game has been to make a simple bucket to transfer lava to my smeltery. This has, for some reason, been gated behind quite a bit of tech because it requires steel plates. No problem, lets make some steel plates... Hours and hours later, still no steel plates. Here's where I started having problems..
Steel apparently requires gunpowder, iron, and ACTUAL coal. I'm a little lost as to why these ores are so rare to find in this pack, considering the astronomical amounts you need to build stuff here. Yes, the ore veins are large, but finding one is a huge game of chance, and can sometimes take hours of searching. It took me a good 4 hours to find an iron vein, and I still have yet to find ANY coal in my game, which considering how common coal SHOULD be (and is in real life), seems a little silly. I imagine that once you are able to set up some form of quarry or auto-miner, the ores will come in mass quantities, but don't neglect the early game by making them hard to find when those machines aren't available yet.
For now I'm heading to bed after a long night of mining. Hopefully I will have my bucket tomorrow. (I shouldn't have to say that)
Ok so you made a mistake, steel doesn't require gunpowder, sand, or coal, HSLA steel needs those. What steel needs is a blast furnace, Railcraft or Immersive Engineering will work, they're nearly identical anyway, you put iron and charcoal in there to make steel, then you just need a rolling machine which is just iron and redstone, a hobbyist steam engine is really cheap as well. The main catch to all that is needing nether resources for the blast furnace, blaze powder being the big one.
Also the clay bucket is recommended for a reason, it allows you to move lava and water before getting an actual bucket, if you move lava it breaks though so you can only do that once per bucket. Just grab yourself a ton of clay though and you'll be fine.
On a different note, a request for Haggle, can you please add flake smelting recipes to the smeltery? Because it's kinda annoying that I have this giant smeltery just sitting there because flakes can only be smelted with a normal furnace recipe for some reason.
My whole goal right now near the start of my game has been to make a simple bucket to transfer lava to my smeltery. This has, for some reason, been gated behind quite a bit of tech because it requires steel plates. No problem, lets make some steel plates... Hours and hours later, still no steel plates. Here's where I started having problems..
Steel apparently requires gunpowder, iron, and ACTUAL coal. I'm a little lost as to why these ores are so rare to find in this pack, considering the astronomical amounts you need to build stuff here. Yes, the ore veins are large, but finding one is a huge game of chance, and can sometimes take hours of searching. It took me a good 4 hours to find an iron vein, and I still have yet to find ANY coal in my game, which considering how common coal SHOULD be (and is in real life), seems a little silly. I imagine that once you are able to set up some form of quarry or auto-miner, the ores will come in mass quantities, but don't neglect the early game by making them hard to find when those machines aren't available yet.
For now I'm heading to bed after a long night of mining. Hopefully I will have my bucket tomorrow. (I shouldn't have to say that)
I hope you discovered clay buckets in the short term.
Coal is found at y-levels greater than 95 and is very common at that height. Gunpowder can be found either on creepers or by locating a Wolf's Foot Clubmoss. Four in a crafting grid will yield 1 gunpowder. PMP plants (including the clubmoss) can be repeatedly broken and replanted quickly to gain more.
I'm not sure which recipe you're using for steel -- none of them use gunpowder (except for RotaryCraft's HSLA steel -- but that's not used to make buckets, though you will need some for easy early RF power). The easiest steel to make is either through Mekanism (Metallurgic Infuser and a Heat Henerator) or Immersive Engineering's blast furnace. The former requires a couple osmium, iron, copper and wood. The latter requires bricks, nether bricks, and blaze powder.
On a different note, a request for Haggle, can you please add flake smelting recipes to the smeltery? Because it's kinda annoying that I have this giant smeltery just sitting there because flakes can only be smelted with a normal furnace recipe for some reason.
I'll add it to the list -- most players move quickly to a furnace/friction heater after getting their grinder, so the need doesn't often come up.
Ok so you made a mistake, steel doesn't require gunpowder, sand, or coal, HSLA steel needs those. What steel needs is a blast furnace, Railcraft or Immersive Engineering will work, they're nearly identical anyway, you put iron and charcoal in there to make steel, then you just need a rolling machine which is just iron and redstone, a hobbyist steam engine is really cheap as well. The main catch to all that is needing nether resources for the blast furnace, blaze powder being the big one.
Also the clay bucket is recommended for a reason, it allows you to move lava and water before getting an actual bucket, if you move lava it breaks though so you can only do that once per bucket. Just grab yourself a ton of clay though and you'll be fine.
On a different note, a request for Haggle, can you please add flake smelting recipes to the smeltery? Because it's kinda annoying that I have this giant smeltery just sitting there because flakes can only be smelted with a normal furnace recipe for some reason.
I hope you discovered clay buckets in the short term.
Coal is found at y-levels greater than 95 and is very common at that height. Gunpowder can be found either on creepers or by locating a Wolf's Foot Clubmoss. Four in a crafting grid will yield 1 gunpowder. PMP plants (including the clubmoss) can be repeatedly broken and replanted quickly to gain more.
I'm not sure which recipe you're using for steel -- none of them use gunpowder (except for RotaryCraft's HSLA steel -- but that's not used to make buckets, though you will need some for easy early RF power). The easiest steel to make is either through Mekanism (Metallurgic Infuser and a Heat Henerator) or Immersive Engineering's blast furnace. The former requires a couple osmium, iron, copper and wood. The latter requires bricks, nether bricks, and blaze powder.
Yes, I've used clay buckets alot in the past, but they simply aren't made for transporting larger quantities of lava. As for other ways to make steel starting out, perhaps you should revise your starting guide to reflect this, as that is what I was following:
Most machines in this pack require steel (ingot or plates), HSLA Steel, or both. Start with the RotaryCraft blast furnace once you find (and can mine) iron and redstone. Mekanism or Immersive Engineering are good starts for getting your steel production up and going. Once you’ve got steel going, you’re going to need a RailCraft Rolling Mill to get plate production going. The easiest source of RF power for your Rolling Machine will be a RotaryCraft Rotational Dynamo hooked up to a RotaryCraft DC Engine. It will be slow, but it will get you your first steel plates necessary for expanding your power base.
Also, I think maybe you should outline these changes you've made to oregen either in the starting guide or somewhere. How was I (or anyone) supposed to know coal is only above y 95? Especially after you suggested we settle in a location that doesn't have any elevation above like 80 for safety reasons. Now I have to go looking for a mountain to mine coal from. Are there any other quirky oregen things changed that I should know about, like changing where diamonds spawn or something else? Don't make your pack a guessing game. That's not strategy.
Any thoughts on adding metallurgy 4? Disable it's machines of course... if that is possible
It would add a great deal of variety to armor and weapons. ExtraTic is already part of the pack so alloy creation in the smeltery should be covered.
I could be blind but I haven't seen many armor options. I have no idea what balance something like this would need but I thought I would ask.
It would certainly change up the progression of the pack. I've had a few requests for mods that change the world generation; however, I just made major changes to ore gen in 0.8. In the interest of keeping the pack consistent for existing users, I won't be making any ore changes again until sometime after the 1.0 release. I'll add metallurgy to the list of mods to consider when I get to that point.
I think the better sleep mod is a little unrealistic and starts to become tedious. Unless I am jumping around constantly during the day, I don't end up using enough energy to be able to sleep at night, thus costing me quite a bit of hunger just to be able to sleep. That's a little silly if you ask me. I don't understand why hunger doesn't tick off slowly while you are awake, or maybe it does and it's just not fast enough, but it's impossible to go to bed at dark every night without doing a bunch of extra stuff to expend energy. I understand keeping the mod for the adverse effect of causing debuffs if you don't sleep, but I think the limiter preventing you from sleeping should be taken out. It just doesn't work right.
It would certainly change up the progression of the pack. I've had a few requests for mods that change the world generation; however, I just made major changes to ore gen in 0.8. In the interest of keeping the pack consistent for existing users, I won't be making any ore changes again until sometime after the 1.0 release. I'll add metallurgy to the list of mods to consider when I get to that point.
Sounds good.
Just curious, how would it change the pack progression? It would add new tinkers tools and new armor. Is exploration progression gated by technical advances? IE, can't wonder too far or too deep if you don't have the right tech? That would be cool... it would also explain the removal of gold, diamond and iron armor.
It fits nicely with ATG because of this:
- Rain clouds build up moisture from water and moist biomes
- Stormfront system uses biome temperature differences to create nasty storms!
A post apocalyptic setting should have severe storms
It fits nicely with ATG because of this:
- Rain clouds build up moisture from water and moist biomes
- Stormfront system uses biome temperature differences to create nasty storms!
A post apocalyptic setting should have severe storms
I experimented with Weather2 in the pack not too long ago. The biggest challenge I face is keeping the pack friendly for both multiplayer and singleplayer -- the more 'active' mods like Weather, Zombie Awareness, etc, the worse the pack performs on servers. Minecraft is particularly notorious for handling multiplayer poorly.
That said, I have some ideas up my sleeve. Stay tuned. <insert evil grin here>
I think the better sleep mod is a little unrealistic and starts to become tedious. Unless I am jumping around constantly during the day, I don't end up using enough energy to be able to sleep at night, thus costing me quite a bit of hunger just to be able to sleep. That's a little silly if you ask me. I don't understand why hunger doesn't tick off slowly while you are awake, or maybe it does and it's just not fast enough, but it's impossible to go to bed at dark every night without doing a bunch of extra stuff to expend energy. I understand keeping the mod for the adverse effect of causing debuffs if you don't sleep, but I think the limiter preventing you from sleeping should be taken out. It just doesn't work right.
Better Sleeping is getting a slight buff in the upcoming version so that you get tired more consistently with doing things (I've run into the same problem where I've been running, jumping, etc., and I'm not tired. And the opposite, I've been staring at an SFM script for 15 minutes and suddenly I'm going blind).
The way I handle it in the pack today is to not sleep until I'm completely rested (you can build/set an alarm clock). You'll notice you don't always refill your sleep bar in the morning, particularly if you were very tired to start. Just go about your day -- you'll be plenty tired at night.
Just curious, how would it change the pack progression? It would add new tinkers tools and new armor. Is exploration progression gated by technical advances? IE, can't wonder too far or too deep if you don't have the right tech? That would be cool... it would also explain the removal of gold, diamond and iron armor.
Metallurgy expands the mining level progression significantly, with a bajillion (approximately) more ores to mine that you must mine before you can mine the next tier of metal. The last time I played with Metallurgy, Manyullen-equivalent metals were like the 5th tier, and metallurgy goes to like tier 21 (probably an over-exaggeration). I would either need to buff monsters to be challenging for tier 21 or nerf all the tiers so that 21 matches the difficulty of the monsters. Also, the materials in metallurgy would need to properly gate access to mods (so you don't skip waaaay ahead in the tech tree).
On the other hand, I could see expanding the metal progression as an interesting way to gate the pack content in general. So, not a 'no'.
Metallurgy expands the mining level progression significantly, with a bajillion (approximately) more ores to mine that you must mine before you can mine the next tier of metal. The last time I played with Metallurgy, Manyullen-equivalent metals were like the 5th tier, and metallurgy goes to like tier 21 (probably an over-exaggeration). I would either need to buff monsters to be challenging for tier 21 or nerf all the tiers so that 21 matches the difficulty of the monsters. Also, the materials in metallurgy would need to properly gate access to mods (so you don't skip waaaay ahead in the tech tree).
On the other hand, I could see expanding the metal progression as an interesting way to gate the pack content in general. So, not a 'no'.
Could gate some metals in different dimensions... Some on the moon, some on mars, some in the deep dark and nether and some very powerful ones in the end. Entrance to those places is gated already so access to those metals would be gated too. I think the FTB Blood-n-Bones pack did this.
I am not sure mixing those metals into the crafting recipes of machines would be a good idea though. IMHO, leaving those metals for gear and weapons only would gate there usefulness and quantities required so that the above could work. Making them very rare would also be an option if they are not linked to crafting recipes.
Do you have the ability to change the difficulty of mobs per dimension? Access to higher tiered ores necessitates battling stronger enemies.
Metallurgy just adds too much unneeded filler that does very little to add to the substance of the game. There's already plenty of ore types in the world, and adding metallurgy ores would just add unneeded complication, and to be frank, annoyance carrying all of that around. Not to mention this pack is very slow to build, and I would rather not have more resets to put the ores into worldgen, especially for how little actual content it would add.
So I meant to mentioned it before but forgot, can HSLA tinker tools be buffed so that they're at least somewhat as good as the actual tools? Currently they're rather pathetic and one of the worst available materials there is.
Ok so you made a mistake, steel doesn't require gunpowder, sand, or coal, HSLA steel needs those. What steel needs is a blast furnace, Railcraft or Immersive Engineering will work, they're nearly identical anyway, you put iron and charcoal in there to make steel, then you just need a rolling machine which is just iron and redstone, a hobbyist steam engine is really cheap as well. The main catch to all that is needing nether resources for the blast furnace, blaze powder being the big one.
Also the clay bucket is recommended for a reason, it allows you to move lava and water before getting an actual bucket, if you move lava it breaks though so you can only do that once per bucket. Just grab yourself a ton of clay though and you'll be fine.
On a different note, a request for Haggle, can you please add flake smelting recipes to the smeltery? Because it's kinda annoying that I have this giant smeltery just sitting there because flakes can only be smelted with a normal furnace recipe for some reason.
I'm stuck even with your starting instructions. The hobbyist steam engine requires copper plate, which requires the rolling machine, which requires power. There's no way to actually make this without already having everything you describe built. With everything seperated and gated, what power do I actually start with?
Haggle1996, no offense, but you have things changed in such a way that it's really hard to know where to get started. You really should contemplate using HQM, simply to give us a direction through the maze of alternate recipes you have created.
I'm stuck even with your starting instructions. The hobbyist steam engine requires copper plate, which requires the rolling machine, which requires power. There's no way to actually make this without already having everything you describe built. With everything seperated and gated, what power do I actually start with?
Haggle1996, no offense, but you have things changed in such a way that it's really hard to know where to get started. You really should contemplate using HQM, simply to give us a direction through the maze of alternate recipes you have created.
As the getting started guide suggests, make a rotational dynamo connected to dc engine (both from rotarycraft). The hobbyist steam engine hasn't been a viable starting engine for several releases of the pack.
As the getting started guide suggests, make a rotational dynamo connected to dc engine (both from rotarycraft). The hobbyist steam engine hasn't been a viable starting engine for several releases of the pack.
...which requires coal to make HSLA steel. We've gone in full circle here. So while the bucket itself may only require steel plates to make and not HSLA steel, it is still gated behind the ability to make HSLA steel to make a power source to power the rolling machine, which is what I was commenting on in the first place. We're back to my initial complaint that it takes FAR too much work to be able to make a simple bucket, and the suggestions given to me have not changed this.
My whole goal right now near the start of my game has been to make a simple bucket to transfer lava to my smeltery. This has, for some reason, been gated behind quite a bit of tech because it requires steel plates. No problem, lets make some steel plates... Hours and hours later, still no steel plates. Here's where I started having problems..
Steel apparently requires gunpowder, iron, and ACTUAL coal. I'm a little lost as to why these ores are so rare to find in this pack, considering the astronomical amounts you need to build stuff here. Yes, the ore veins are large, but finding one is a huge game of chance, and can sometimes take hours of searching. It took me a good 4 hours to find an iron vein, and I still have yet to find ANY coal in my game, which considering how common coal SHOULD be (and is in real life), seems a little silly. I imagine that once you are able to set up some form of quarry or auto-miner, the ores will come in mass quantities, but don't neglect the early game by making them hard to find when those machines aren't available yet.
For now I'm heading to bed after a long night of mining. Hopefully I will have my bucket tomorrow. (I shouldn't have to say that)
Ok so you made a mistake, steel doesn't require gunpowder, sand, or coal, HSLA steel needs those. What steel needs is a blast furnace, Railcraft or Immersive Engineering will work, they're nearly identical anyway, you put iron and charcoal in there to make steel, then you just need a rolling machine which is just iron and redstone, a hobbyist steam engine is really cheap as well. The main catch to all that is needing nether resources for the blast furnace, blaze powder being the big one.
Also the clay bucket is recommended for a reason, it allows you to move lava and water before getting an actual bucket, if you move lava it breaks though so you can only do that once per bucket. Just grab yourself a ton of clay though and you'll be fine.
On a different note, a request for Haggle, can you please add flake smelting recipes to the smeltery? Because it's kinda annoying that I have this giant smeltery just sitting there because flakes can only be smelted with a normal furnace recipe for some reason.
I hope you discovered clay buckets in the short term.
Coal is found at y-levels greater than 95 and is very common at that height. Gunpowder can be found either on creepers or by locating a Wolf's Foot Clubmoss. Four in a crafting grid will yield 1 gunpowder. PMP plants (including the clubmoss) can be repeatedly broken and replanted quickly to gain more.
I'm not sure which recipe you're using for steel -- none of them use gunpowder (except for RotaryCraft's HSLA steel -- but that's not used to make buckets, though you will need some for easy early RF power). The easiest steel to make is either through Mekanism (Metallurgic Infuser and a Heat Henerator) or Immersive Engineering's blast furnace. The former requires a couple osmium, iron, copper and wood. The latter requires bricks, nether bricks, and blaze powder.
I'll add it to the list -- most players move quickly to a furnace/friction heater after getting their grinder, so the need doesn't often come up.
Any thoughts on adding metallurgy 4? Disable it's machines of course... if that is possible
It would add a great deal of variety to armor and weapons. ExtraTic is already part of the pack so alloy creation in the smeltery should be covered.
I could be blind but I haven't seen many armor options. I have no idea what balance something like this would need but I thought I would ask.
Yes, I've used clay buckets alot in the past, but they simply aren't made for transporting larger quantities of lava. As for other ways to make steel starting out, perhaps you should revise your starting guide to reflect this, as that is what I was following:
Also, I think maybe you should outline these changes you've made to oregen either in the starting guide or somewhere. How was I (or anyone) supposed to know coal is only above y 95? Especially after you suggested we settle in a location that doesn't have any elevation above like 80 for safety reasons. Now I have to go looking for a mountain to mine coal from. Are there any other quirky oregen things changed that I should know about, like changing where diamonds spawn or something else? Don't make your pack a guessing game. That's not strategy.
Yeah, I should make that paragraph a little clearer as to which things go with what.
Right next to the First Day guide on the website is the Game Changes page:
http://haggle1996.github.io/RevolutionPack/articles/game-changes/
This describes in detail all the changes the pack makes, including where ore spawns.
It would certainly change up the progression of the pack. I've had a few requests for mods that change the world generation; however, I just made major changes to ore gen in 0.8. In the interest of keeping the pack consistent for existing users, I won't be making any ore changes again until sometime after the 1.0 release. I'll add metallurgy to the list of mods to consider when I get to that point.
I think the better sleep mod is a little unrealistic and starts to become tedious. Unless I am jumping around constantly during the day, I don't end up using enough energy to be able to sleep at night, thus costing me quite a bit of hunger just to be able to sleep. That's a little silly if you ask me. I don't understand why hunger doesn't tick off slowly while you are awake, or maybe it does and it's just not fast enough, but it's impossible to go to bed at dark every night without doing a bunch of extra stuff to expend energy. I understand keeping the mod for the adverse effect of causing debuffs if you don't sleep, but I think the limiter preventing you from sleeping should be taken out. It just doesn't work right.
Sounds good.
Just curious, how would it change the pack progression? It would add new tinkers tools and new armor. Is exploration progression gated by technical advances? IE, can't wonder too far or too deep if you don't have the right tech? That would be cool... it would also explain the removal of gold, diamond and iron armor.
One other thing that I like to include in my custom packs; weather2. Seams like it would fit really nicely into this pack with ATG.
http://www.coros.us/mods/weather2
It fits nicely with ATG because of this:
- Rain clouds build up moisture from water and moist biomes
- Stormfront system uses biome temperature differences to create nasty storms!
A post apocalyptic setting should have severe storms
I experimented with Weather2 in the pack not too long ago. The biggest challenge I face is keeping the pack friendly for both multiplayer and singleplayer -- the more 'active' mods like Weather, Zombie Awareness, etc, the worse the pack performs on servers. Minecraft is particularly notorious for handling multiplayer poorly.
That said, I have some ideas up my sleeve. Stay tuned. <insert evil grin here>
Better Sleeping is getting a slight buff in the upcoming version so that you get tired more consistently with doing things (I've run into the same problem where I've been running, jumping, etc., and I'm not tired. And the opposite, I've been staring at an SFM script for 15 minutes and suddenly I'm going blind).
The way I handle it in the pack today is to not sleep until I'm completely rested (you can build/set an alarm clock). You'll notice you don't always refill your sleep bar in the morning, particularly if you were very tired to start. Just go about your day -- you'll be plenty tired at night.
Metallurgy expands the mining level progression significantly, with a bajillion (approximately) more ores to mine that you must mine before you can mine the next tier of metal. The last time I played with Metallurgy, Manyullen-equivalent metals were like the 5th tier, and metallurgy goes to like tier 21 (probably an over-exaggeration). I would either need to buff monsters to be challenging for tier 21 or nerf all the tiers so that 21 matches the difficulty of the monsters. Also, the materials in metallurgy would need to properly gate access to mods (so you don't skip waaaay ahead in the tech tree).
On the other hand, I could see expanding the metal progression as an interesting way to gate the pack content in general. So, not a 'no'.
Could gate some metals in different dimensions... Some on the moon, some on mars, some in the deep dark and nether and some very powerful ones in the end. Entrance to those places is gated already so access to those metals would be gated too. I think the FTB Blood-n-Bones pack did this.
I am not sure mixing those metals into the crafting recipes of machines would be a good idea though. IMHO, leaving those metals for gear and weapons only would gate there usefulness and quantities required so that the above could work. Making them very rare would also be an option if they are not linked to crafting recipes.
Do you have the ability to change the difficulty of mobs per dimension? Access to higher tiered ores necessitates battling stronger enemies.
Metallurgy just adds too much unneeded filler that does very little to add to the substance of the game. There's already plenty of ore types in the world, and adding metallurgy ores would just add unneeded complication, and to be frank, annoyance carrying all of that around. Not to mention this pack is very slow to build, and I would rather not have more resets to put the ores into worldgen, especially for how little actual content it would add.
So I meant to mentioned it before but forgot, can HSLA tinker tools be buffed so that they're at least somewhat as good as the actual tools? Currently they're rather pathetic and one of the worst available materials there is.
Also v7 is out now for any who care.
I'm stuck even with your starting instructions. The hobbyist steam engine requires copper plate, which requires the rolling machine, which requires power. There's no way to actually make this without already having everything you describe built. With everything seperated and gated, what power do I actually start with?
Haggle1996, no offense, but you have things changed in such a way that it's really hard to know where to get started. You really should contemplate using HQM, simply to give us a direction through the maze of alternate recipes you have created.
As the getting started guide suggests, make a rotational dynamo connected to dc engine (both from rotarycraft). The hobbyist steam engine hasn't been a viable starting engine for several releases of the pack.
...which requires coal to make HSLA steel. We've gone in full circle here. So while the bucket itself may only require steel plates to make and not HSLA steel, it is still gated behind the ability to make HSLA steel to make a power source to power the rolling machine, which is what I was commenting on in the first place. We're back to my initial complaint that it takes FAR too much work to be able to make a simple bucket, and the suggestions given to me have not changed this.