Hey Eloraam, any ideas how to see error logs as a logged in user? There's a script for us windows users called minecrafterrortest.bat, but it only works if you're not logged in. Reason I ask is I got a total lockup once on the test server (not doing anything, just standing around) and once on my main server (with a bunch of other mods). If I could read the error report I might be able to figure out what is going on. (total lockup means minecraft froze, my computer was fine)
Hey Eloraam, any ideas how to see error logs as a logged in user? There's a script for us windows users called minecrafterrortest.bat, but it only works if you're not logged in.
You might have success running the launcher JAR (not the EXE) in the same way that that batch file does. I can't say it doesn't close the console output when it launches the main JAR, as I've never tried that approach.
Alternatively, you can run the server in offline mode so you don't need to log in.
I have another question for you, Eloraam. Can you tell me what the maximum number of blocks I can be, away from a Redstone timer that is running one of my machines, and still have it safely continue to work, without the chunk being unloaded?
I've built a number of machines now, which I had intended to allow me to do other things while they were running, but I've still tended to babysit them because I've worried about them getting unloaded if I go off and do other things. Is the distance around 3-4 chunks?
If you play SSP, you need to visit your machines only once per entering world, because chunks don't dynamically unload in singleplayer. Once loaded, they stay that way until you exit the world.
If you play SSP, you need to visit your machines only once per entering world, because chunks don't dynamically unload in singleplayer. Once loaded, they stay that way until you exit the world.
Hello all, just uploading a video of something I built on the server to practice RedPower.
I forgot to mention a couple things. For one, pressing the submit button resets the Counters afterward, so there's no need to do that manually. But, more importantly, the design has a major flaw; aside from the RS Latch connected the the Blue block, every other input can simply be spammed to it's maximum (and correct) state. I already know how to fix this so that it rolls over, but I didn't feel the need to tear up a large amount of wiring to make room. Will fix it if I build it again.
As I said in the video, I'll probably make a "RedPower 101" type video, but I'm still a novice redstone user in general, and obviously completely new to RedPower, so I want to play around for a day or two more before I do that.
Source, which is this forum, mentions that ServerChunkCache in F3 info is amount of chunks loaded, and Drop is amount of chunks unloaded. Drop is always 0. Go figure.
EDIT: Well, it can be tested relatively easily. Set up a Buildcraft Quarry with timer, go for several minutes in one direction, wait half an hour, go back. If chunk was loaded, quarry will dig some ground at this time.
I am simply amazed with what you have done to humble redstone m'lady. I've been downloading your mods since it was called redstone timers (and refusing to update each new version of minecraft until your updates were ready).
This post is going to be odd as
1) I've actually read and understand all 82 (as of when I write this) pages of this topic
and
2) I have no bugs, requests, off topic comments to add.
What I do have is my sincere thanks for the countless hours of work you've done on this. It's truly a work of genius.
Also, I have before and after photos of my multi-piston submersible bridge I made (60+ sticky pistons on bottom 60+ regular pistons on top of that then 2 layers of sand on top of that.
Before Redpower, it was 7 blocks wide and 9 blocks deep. After it's 3 blocks wide and 5 layers deep and responds faster. :smile.gif:
Old school redstone way.
Cool school Redpower way!
Note these were taken on land on a test world. Kind of hard to see under water.
I'm honoured too, you are using my banners! yaaay! xD. Well, since i'm 2 lazy to do this sort o' things (ultra-complex circuitry xD, i'm just too focused on my simple, ole school station xD) i've pic-napped your work (a huge work, congratulations!), since is all about the mod, it was fine.
glad 'cause you appreciate my work!
I have another question for you, Eloraam. Can you tell me what the maximum number of blocks I can be, away from a Redstone timer that is running one of my machines, and still have it safely continue to work, without the chunk being unloaded?
In SSP, you just have to load it once, and then it'll stay around forever, because chunks don't unload in SSP.
Sure do. Me! :smile.gif: I've extensively studied the code responsible for doing chunk unloading, and the candidate list for unloading is never added to in SSP, so no chunks ever unload. I was planning to add a feature to my mod to keep timer-bearing chunks loaded, but at least in SSP, I never needed to.
I'm honoured too, you are using my banners! yaaay! xD. Well, since i'm 2 lazy to do this sort o' things (ultra-complex circuitry xD, i'm just too focused on my simple, ole school station xD) i've pic-napped your work (a huge work, congratulations!), since is all about the mod, it was fine.
glad 'cause you appreciate my work!
Hello all, just uploading a video of something I built on the server to practice RedPower.
That's great :smile.gif: I built the simpler piston door that you walked by briefly in your video (basically a clone of the one I demoed before the mod was even released). Fun was had on that server.
Short question: The cable connects to the repeater in this scenario, but does not seem to transmit power. Is that as it should be?
PS.: Ignore the chicken.
Wait, what? How the heck did you get the cable to connect like that? It's trying to form an external corner connection, but the rules totally don't allow it in that case. When I tried to build what you show in the screenshot, I couldn't even get it to look like it's connecting to the repeater. Are those all actual wood blocks, or do you have some cover plates in there?
Well, I think that is called "not enough bundled cable types". That, and "horrible, HORRIBLE lack of optimization".
And it's not yet finished. I wonder how much space actual hour-signal-to-binary-for-decoders circuit will take.
EDIT: That's 12 towers, 3 for each 300-second sequencer output. Each tower has 8 outputs that will lead to "binary switcher".
Nice! I can't wait to get through the bug list though, I've got an upcoming mod that will make a few people very happy. It only adds a couple blocks, and on the surface they seem silly, almost trivial, but I think they'll change the way we wire things.
So what do you mean by "not enough bundled cable types", anyhow? Not enough insulated colors, or you actually mean you wish there were multiple bundle types that didn't connect to each other?
So what do you mean by "not enough bundled cable types", anyhow? Not enough insulated colors, or you actually mean you wish there were multiple bundle types that didn't connect to each other?
The latter. Imagine wiring THAT to separate structure. Even with full cable usage, that's whopping 6 cables. I think I'll need to use the ceiling to place them all...
P.S. Also, some kind of repeater that is placed on cable itself and allows visual control of what signals pass and in what direction would be nice. Like "cable signal blocker" suggested before, but with more functions.
P.P.S. On second thought, really large part of these towers is erroneous duplicates. I'll do some pruning now.
P.P.P.S. Heh. RedPower cables are close-to-immune to WorldEdit. Only way to remove them via WE is to remove block they're placed at.
Well, they WERE erroneous duplicates. I still don't understand why my brain thought that there should be 4 duplicates for each wire configuration. Towers look a lot less enormous now, and I think now there will be enough place for "binary switcher".
I can't help myself, I've been sitting here for the past hour designing the art style for the new RP+IR add-on mod. Watching people trying ever more ambitious systems using RedPower, I'm just inspired to complete my vision for it.
And no, I'm not forgetting about the bug list I have to fix. This isn't coding time (I'm unwinding a bit), and I'm not coding. I'm game designing. It might not be obvious how much care I've put into making sure the IR blocks make sense, but I don't just stick a label on a cube and call it done. I have to come up with plausible almost-physics that fit the Minecraft theme and then design the circuit that is used for each new block.
I can't help myself, I've been sitting here for the past hour designing the art style for the new RP+IR add-on mod. Watching people trying ever more ambitious systems using RedPower, I'm just inspired to complete my vision for it.
And no, I'm not forgetting about the bug list I have to fix. This isn't coding time (I'm unwinding a bit), and I'm not coding. I'm game designing. It might not be obvious how much care I've put into making sure the IR blocks make sense, but I don't just stick a label on a cube and call it done. I have to come up with plausible almost-physics that fit the Minecraft theme and then design the circuit that is used for each new block.
Any hints at what it would be?
It is obvious. Your mods have supreme quality compared to other mods, and even to Minecraft itself. Yes, they may be buggy, but your approach to modding is entirely different than approach of other modders ("Let's design a feature, then carefully implement it caring about quality, terrain overrides and stuff" and "HAYO lets make maximum amounts of stuff and throw it all in game using modloader functions!", respectively).
It is obvious. Your mods have supreme quality compared to other mods, and even to Minecraft itself. Yes, they may be buggy, but your approach to modding is entirely different than approach of other modders ("Let's design a feature, then carefully implement it caring about quality, terrain overrides and stuff" and "HAYO lets make maximum amounts of stuff and throw it all in game using modloader functions!", respectively).
Sure, I can give a hint. Three of the blocks are IR-style circuits but with two wires crossing, but not coming into electrical contact, at right angles to each other. Those three blocks have zero, one, and two torches in them, respectively.
And thanks. I try to keep the bugs down. I put a lot of work into testing before even 1.5.0, and I thought I had them figured out, but bugs are a fact of life. Out of the serious bugs that remained, one was a bad obfuscation (loss of color on SMP), one was Java's documentation claiming one thing while the code did something else (the IOExceptions on SMP, which also does not appear when running client and server on the same computer), one was trusting Notch code (a whole mess of indirect power bugs caused by incomplete neighbor updates), and one was just Notch changing the rules on me after I'd tested things (the repeater bugs). And all of those are fixed in 1.5.1, most of the remainder are simply rendering bugs in obscure cases (like wires underwater).
As much as it might not appear this way, RedPower is half as big a mod as IndustrialCraft in terms of raw code volume. And because RP is carefully factored code with virtually no repetition, the density difference makes it fair for me to say that it's as big a mod. That makes for a large bug surface. A few are bound to slip in the first try.
Upon further investigation, I think you're off the hook :wink.gif:. However, IC and MineFactory do not appear to be the culprit! I did a fresh install: did the hackish install for modloader/modloadermp and put all the other mods on my list into the mods folder (and copied the config files I used to make IDs play well with one another), and it only opens in a bad state when I enable - in the modloader config file - BuildCraft's transport package (obviously I don't enable redstone pipe or the extra pipes since I assumed they depend on the BC transport package)! All the other packages were fine. This of course destroys a bunch of placed items in the saved world, but at least I found a state that will open with some mods enabled and not with others. I'm going to repost on the BC thread (and see if there are similar issues).
I find it puzzling that I haven't encountered the problem before. My hunch is that I have too many quarries (5) at work and there is just too much stuff in my pipes. For the time being I'm going to go back to a backup that isn't too far back and turn all but 2 off at a time and see if the error ever pops back up. Seeings as you didn't seem to think that BC would be the problem, and you yourself wrote a BC-compatible mod, am I right in deducing that you've plugged through the BC code yourself a reasonable amount? If you would like to try to deduce what is going on yourself, I can send you saved folders and/or config files and/or the downloaded packages (the list, or the actual zip files if it's easier) I have installed and/or the whole /.minecraft folder.
update: just noticed that buildcraft has a new version that I'm going to test to see if it fixes the issue straight up!
reupdate: nope, that didn't fix it. Keeping transport disabled makes it ok.
New development tracking this bug down: I've managed to track down the specific scenario when this bug occurs and it's an interaction between RedPower and IndustrialCraft that's causing the problem. It occurs at the *switch from day to night* when two IC tesla coils are attached to the same redstone wire (i.e. to turn them both on at the same time a la a mob trap). However, if they are connected via just redstone dust, it does not cause the bug. The two tesla coils were 14 spaces away from one another (i.e. 13 wires/dusts in the middle). From trial and error, it appears that as long as there is a redstone connection of any kind between two tesla coils where the connection comprises at least one of your redstone wires directly next to one of the coils, then a memory leak occurs.
Let me know if you want any saves or configs from me to figure it out.
New development tracking this bug down: I've managed to track down the specific scenario when this bug occurs and it's an interaction between RedPower and IndustrialCraft that's causing the problem. It occurs at the *switch from day to night* when two IC tesla coils are attached to the same redstone wire (i.e. to turn them both on at the same time a la a mob trap). However, if they are connected via just redstone dust, it does not cause the bug. The two tesla coils were 14 spaces away from one another (i.e. 13 wires/dusts in the middle). From trial and error, it appears that as long as there is a redstone connection of any kind between two tesla coils where the connection comprises at least one of your redstone components directly next to one of the coils, then a memory leak occurs.
Let me know if you want any saves or configs from me to figure it out.
Wow, that's obscure. How easy to reproduce is it? Does it happen every time?
I have my suspicions about the cause there, but I'll have to get myself a new copy of IC. What version are you running, 8.50?
You might have success running the launcher JAR (not the EXE) in the same way that that batch file does. I can't say it doesn't close the console output when it launches the main JAR, as I've never tried that approach.
Alternatively, you can run the server in offline mode so you don't need to log in.
If you play SSP, you need to visit your machines only once per entering world, because chunks don't dynamically unload in singleplayer. Once loaded, they stay that way until you exit the world.
Whaaat?
Do you have a source on that?
I forgot to mention a couple things. For one, pressing the submit button resets the Counters afterward, so there's no need to do that manually. But, more importantly, the design has a major flaw; aside from the RS Latch connected the the Blue block, every other input can simply be spammed to it's maximum (and correct) state. I already know how to fix this so that it rolls over, but I didn't feel the need to tear up a large amount of wiring to make room. Will fix it if I build it again.
As I said in the video, I'll probably make a "RedPower 101" type video, but I'm still a novice redstone user in general, and obviously completely new to RedPower, so I want to play around for a day or two more before I do that.
Source, which is this forum, mentions that ServerChunkCache in F3 info is amount of chunks loaded, and Drop is amount of chunks unloaded. Drop is always 0. Go figure.
EDIT: Well, it can be tested relatively easily. Set up a Buildcraft Quarry with timer, go for several minutes in one direction, wait half an hour, go back. If chunk was loaded, quarry will dig some ground at this time.
This post is going to be odd as
1) I've actually read and understand all 82 (as of when I write this) pages of this topic
and
2) I have no bugs, requests, off topic comments to add.
What I do have is my sincere thanks for the countless hours of work you've done on this. It's truly a work of genius.
Also, I have before and after photos of my multi-piston submersible bridge I made (60+ sticky pistons on bottom 60+ regular pistons on top of that then 2 layers of sand on top of that.
Before Redpower, it was 7 blocks wide and 9 blocks deep. After it's 3 blocks wide and 5 layers deep and responds faster. :smile.gif:
Old school redstone way.
Cool school Redpower way!
Note these were taken on land on a test world. Kind of hard to see under water.
I'm honoured too, you are using my banners! yaaay! xD. Well, since i'm 2 lazy to do this sort o' things (ultra-complex circuitry xD, i'm just too focused on my simple, ole school station xD) i've pic-napped your work (a huge work, congratulations!), since is all about the mod, it was fine.
glad 'cause you appreciate my work!
BTW, heres another one
and the previous one (it has Unresolved's approval)
EDIT: Zomg! my grammar is going from bad to worse, just noticed i've written "Haves" instead of "Has" T-T
In SSP, you just have to load it once, and then it'll stay around forever, because chunks don't unload in SSP.
Sure do. Me! :smile.gif: I've extensively studied the code responsible for doing chunk unloading, and the candidate list for unloading is never added to in SSP, so no chunks ever unload. I was planning to add a feature to my mod to keep timer-bearing chunks loaded, but at least in SSP, I never needed to.
You're very welcome. And that's some nice work you have there, it's that sort of thing that makes it all worth it :smile.gif:
Woot, new banners :smile.gif:
That's great :smile.gif: I built the simpler piston door that you walked by briefly in your video (basically a clone of the one I demoed before the mod was even released). Fun was had on that server.
EDIT: That's 12 towers, 3 for each 300-second sequencer output. Each tower has 8 outputs that will lead to "binary switcher".
Wait, what? How the heck did you get the cable to connect like that? It's trying to form an external corner connection, but the rules totally don't allow it in that case. When I tried to build what you show in the screenshot, I couldn't even get it to look like it's connecting to the repeater. Are those all actual wood blocks, or do you have some cover plates in there?
Nice! I can't wait to get through the bug list though, I've got an upcoming mod that will make a few people very happy. It only adds a couple blocks, and on the surface they seem silly, almost trivial, but I think they'll change the way we wire things.
So what do you mean by "not enough bundled cable types", anyhow? Not enough insulated colors, or you actually mean you wish there were multiple bundle types that didn't connect to each other?
The latter. Imagine wiring THAT to separate structure. Even with full cable usage, that's whopping 6 cables. I think I'll need to use the ceiling to place them all...
P.S. Also, some kind of repeater that is placed on cable itself and allows visual control of what signals pass and in what direction would be nice. Like "cable signal blocker" suggested before, but with more functions.
P.P.S. On second thought, really large part of these towers is erroneous duplicates. I'll do some pruning now.
P.P.P.S. Heh. RedPower cables are close-to-immune to WorldEdit. Only way to remove them via WE is to remove block they're placed at.
And no, I'm not forgetting about the bug list I have to fix. This isn't coding time (I'm unwinding a bit), and I'm not coding. I'm game designing. It might not be obvious how much care I've put into making sure the IR blocks make sense, but I don't just stick a label on a cube and call it done. I have to come up with plausible almost-physics that fit the Minecraft theme and then design the circuit that is used for each new block.
Any hints at what it would be?
It is obvious. Your mods have supreme quality compared to other mods, and even to Minecraft itself. Yes, they may be buggy, but your approach to modding is entirely different than approach of other modders ("Let's design a feature, then carefully implement it caring about quality, terrain overrides and stuff" and "HAYO lets make maximum amounts of stuff and throw it all in game using modloader functions!", respectively).
Sure, I can give a hint. Three of the blocks are IR-style circuits but with two wires crossing, but not coming into electrical contact, at right angles to each other. Those three blocks have zero, one, and two torches in them, respectively.
And thanks. I try to keep the bugs down. I put a lot of work into testing before even 1.5.0, and I thought I had them figured out, but bugs are a fact of life. Out of the serious bugs that remained, one was a bad obfuscation (loss of color on SMP), one was Java's documentation claiming one thing while the code did something else (the IOExceptions on SMP, which also does not appear when running client and server on the same computer), one was trusting Notch code (a whole mess of indirect power bugs caused by incomplete neighbor updates), and one was just Notch changing the rules on me after I'd tested things (the repeater bugs). And all of those are fixed in 1.5.1, most of the remainder are simply rendering bugs in obscure cases (like wires underwater).
As much as it might not appear this way, RedPower is half as big a mod as IndustrialCraft in terms of raw code volume. And because RP is carefully factored code with virtually no repetition, the density difference makes it fair for me to say that it's as big a mod. That makes for a large bug surface. A few are bound to slip in the first try.
New development tracking this bug down: I've managed to track down the specific scenario when this bug occurs and it's an interaction between RedPower and IndustrialCraft that's causing the problem. It occurs at the *switch from day to night* when two IC tesla coils are attached to the same redstone wire (i.e. to turn them both on at the same time a la a mob trap). However, if they are connected via just redstone dust, it does not cause the bug. The two tesla coils were 14 spaces away from one another (i.e. 13 wires/dusts in the middle). From trial and error, it appears that as long as there is a redstone connection of any kind between two tesla coils where the connection comprises at least one of your redstone wires directly next to one of the coils, then a memory leak occurs.
Let me know if you want any saves or configs from me to figure it out.
Wow, that's obscure. How easy to reproduce is it? Does it happen every time?
I have my suspicions about the cause there, but I'll have to get myself a new copy of IC. What version are you running, 8.50?