Well I'm stupid enough for finding a 1.7.10 Forge Version of Better Than wolves...
Btw is there a download link for newer versions? Seems that people actually don't care about the download of newer versions now days...
Nope. The mod is for Minecraft 1.5.2. The reason why has been explained pretty much on every page for the past few months.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I swear to god I must be the only true optimist left on the planet.
Quote from FlowerChild »
See...I kept telling everyone that wolves are evil despicable creatures, but would anyone listen? No, of course not, and now you're all ******, so "haha...told you so".
Well I'm stupid enough for finding a 1.7.10 Forge Version of Better Than wolves...
Btw is there a download link for newer versions? Seems that people actually don't care about the download of newer versions now days...
Well that first one shouldn't physically exist. Anywhere. Its either someone reposting the mod illegally- with the wrong information, or something a lot worse- such as login-stealers/account hijacking code. You might want to drop a line in the StopModReposts thread.
The latest and newest version of Better Than Wolves (for MC 1.5.2) can be found in the OP, and in the official forum.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
A mighty machine built within the wake
Of a long dead dream, little demon awake
The citizens sleep, never quite knowing when
The device will reawaken, hungry again.
Ah man, I was just checking out my desktop and I have some rather old versions of BTW still on it xD Just to Minecraft 1.3, but going on three years, that's pretty old for software. It makes me want to make, I dunno, a "Better Than Wolves Through the Ages" or a "Then and Now" vid or something hahaha. But really it makes me think I should clean out my desktop more often
I think BTW was my first 'real' mod (besides Rei's Minimap, oh how I relied on that thing) I really like current BTW, have never considered playing an earlier version or turning off hardcore features when there was a config. I only wish we could have gotten horses lol man I love horses! (just in general hehe)
I only wish we could have gotten horses lol man I love horses! (just in general hehe)
The idea of horses as a transportation alternative is nice. However, I think the way it was implemented didn't fit vanilla... even less Better than Wolves, where you're encouraged to build infra-structure as roads, minecart systems, etc.
The idea of horses as a transportation alternative is nice. However, I think the way it was implemented didn't fit vanilla... even less Better than Wolves, where you're encouraged to build infra-structure as roads, minecart systems, etc.
Well they make minecart systems essentially worthless. Considering how interesting those can be, and how much they drive construction (the most interesting part of minecraft) they're a gameplay ruiner.
Well they make minecart systems essentially worthless. Considering how interesting those can be, and how much they drive construction (the most interesting part of minecraft) they're a gameplay ruiner.
Yeah.
Sad part is: the horses make sense in the way they are in Mo' Creatures. However, when adapting them to vanilla, the progression was completely removed, there are no other mobs with the same design (horses fit just right in Mo' Creatures... but they are quite different from vanilla mobs), their speed was [I think] even buffed a bit.
Even sadder part: if well-implemented, riding mobs wouldn't detract from minecarts, but be an ingame alternative to them. You would eventually want to build track systems between your bases, and only use the horses for exploring.
Back on-topic, I remember reading somewhere this was pretty much the reason FlowerChild didn't bother with the horses, a bit before he decided to stay in 1.5.x.
Back on-topic, I remember reading somewhere this was pretty much the reason FlowerChild didn't bother with the horses, a bit before he decided to stay in 1.5.x.
Yeah, that's pretty much correct. I was already on the verge as the update to 1.5 involved me ripping out pretty much everything that had been added to vanilla, which essentially made it a big waste of time. By that point, the balance of BTW was already so different from vanilla, that just including random new features wasn't really a reasonable option anymore, and I didn't feel the quality of the new features being added was sufficient to go through the work of trying to adapt them to work well with BTW.
Horses were just the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak, as they clashed so heavily with everything in the mod that it convinced me it was time to go my own way and stick with 1.5. If I remember right, I had a number of ideas about how I might adapt them for BTW, but the precise thing that made up my mind about it was the way they looked and how visually inconsistent they were with the rest of the game.
Given I'm not an artist, the thought of trying to remodel and retexture them to correct that, when they weren't even a feature I was really interested in to begin with was not a particularly pleasant one
There's only been one feature added to vanilla since that I've had mild regrets over not having in BTW, which is the slime blocks, but overall I think it was the right move.
There's only been one feature added to vanilla since that I've had mild regrets over not having in BTW, which is the slime blocks, but overall I think it was the right move.
Well. To be honest, they're quite fun to play with, both as "sticky platforms" and for their entity throwing abilities... but they're like, one thing with long-term value in a sea of "five minutes gameplay" things, at least for me.
(Like the new biomes. Or the moss stone crafting recipe - something that BTW has for a really long time but with a more interesting gameplay.)
There's only been one feature added to vanilla since that I've had mild regrets over not having in BTW, which is the slime blocks, but overall I think it was the right move.
This topic has a pretty negative atmosphere, doesn't it now? It's all well and good that you don't like Mojang's latest features, but you seem to be bashing them a bit now. Anyway, I might try this at some point. Might not. Looking at the features I'm not sure its something I'll be looking to when I want to play vanilla-style modded Minecraft. There's an awful lot of random mechanical stuff here, and when I look for a new vanilla experience, I'm thinking more general than yet another industrial revolution, but this time with wood and fire.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Formerly Gamelord. Pixelmon Server Owner. Server IP: pixelmonprisma.mc-server.net | Server Discord:https://discord.gg/HkK855b
I think it's more a harsh atmosphere than negative proper... both FlowerChild and us BtW players are kinda skeptic on the later additions, including me.
I'll warn you: BtW doesn't play "vanilla-like", it's harder. Really harder, due to a bunch of deeper gameplay changes (the "Hardcore Things") besides the new blocks added. However, if you're going to try, the best advice I can give you is: play smart and learn with your mistakes. Then the game becomes rewarding and addictive.
The mechanical stuff is actually quite simple... produce mechanical power, transmit mech power, use power in the saws/turntables/etc. with it. That's it. It resembles far more redstone than the actual power systems from other mods (Redstone Flux, MJoules, Blutricity...).
And the blocks added might look random if you pick them one by one, but together, they make sense. You're going to need them to build stuff. And they're quite simple too, they usually do just one thing... (cauldron boils stuff, saw cuts stuff, block dispenser dispenses blocks...).
It's not that my vanilla loving brain can't comprehend any complex mechanisms that I expect to find in this mod, it just doesn't seem like it fits into vanilla as the topic creator claims (and fits even more so than the latest additions, apparently). By vanilla style, I didn't mean easy, I meant that I was hoping it would have general features that would fit into Minecraft, but it seems to be another industrial mod. Just my opinion, you don't have to think the same way, but I don't think that makes my opinion any less valid.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Formerly Gamelord. Pixelmon Server Owner. Server IP: pixelmonprisma.mc-server.net | Server Discord:https://discord.gg/HkK855b
It's not that my vanilla loving brain can't comprehend any complex mechanisms that I expect to find in this mod, it just doesn't seem like it fits into vanilla as the topic creator claims (and fits even more so than the latest additions, apparently). By vanilla style, I didn't mean easy, I meant that I was hoping it would have general features that would fit into Minecraft, but it seems to be another industrial mod. Just my opinion, you don't have to think the same way, but I don't think that makes my opinion any less valid.
Someone who hadn't looked deeply into something has a less valid opinion about it. It's like if I were to give my opinions about france. Sure I've seen pictures but I'm hardly equipped to talk about what it's really like since I've never been there.
If you don't want to try a mod then don't try it, I'm sure you aren't going to go into every thread on this forum to let people know you don't plan to use their mod right? It's silly to think you really get what something is about without trying it. If you want to know what BTW is about play it, if you don't then don't, but nothing useful comes from pretending you understand something with such a shallow look.
Someone who hadn't looked deeply into something has a less valid opinion about it. It's like if I were to give my opinions about france. Sure I've seen pictures but I'm hardly equipped to talk about what it's really like since I've never been there.
If you don't want to try a mod then don't try it, I'm sure you aren't going to go into every thread on this forum to let people know you don't plan to use their mod right? It's silly to think you really get what something is about without trying it. If you want to know what BTW is about play it, if you don't then don't, but nothing useful comes from pretending you understand something with such a shallow look.
Isn't it a bit silly to assume that I won't know the content of a mod before I play it? I've given it a good look, and the opening post does a very good job on explaining what the mod is about. And after reading it, I decided I didn't want to play it. And because of that, you're here to tell me that I have no right to bear that opinion because I've never played it. I'm not going to tell you to play every mod you ever look at just in case it ends up being awesome. That would be silly. If you don't think a mod looks like your cup of tea, you don't have to play it.
I didn't come here simply to say "lol terrible mod not gonna play", that would be rude and an inaccurate portrayal of my opinion, which is what you seem to be hearing right now. I was simply stating my opinion on the features described, and how I didn't find that those matched with the idea that these features fit into vanilla better than, say, horses. That's my opinion on the subject, and playing the mod won't change that. It might become my favorite mod in the world, but it won't make me want it to become vanilla, for reasons already explained. I have a right to an opinion whether I've actually played the mod or not, because that opinion has nothing to do with my opinion on the mod. Whether the mod fits into vanilla MC or not has no affect on how enjoyable I will find it, I was just giving my opinion on the idea that it does fit. That doesn't require me to try all of the things for myself if I already know exactly what they are.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Formerly Gamelord. Pixelmon Server Owner. Server IP: pixelmonprisma.mc-server.net | Server Discord:https://discord.gg/HkK855b
Mason didn't tell you you "have no right to bear that opinion"
I believe he merely inferred that your opinion was worthless as you have yet to experience the mod.
"giving it a good look" will not give you any indication of the content.
The OP has gotten out of date and no matter how good the OP is, could not substitute the experience that the mod gives.
You call it "just another industrial mod" but as many, I doubt you would even survive the first night let alone progress to the content enough to get near mechanical power.
Never said I didn't think it would be good. Said I didn't think it would fit into vanilla. Don't mistake that for me saying it's average or bad. You're all reading too deeply into this while I'm trying to be quite blunt here.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Formerly Gamelord. Pixelmon Server Owner. Server IP: pixelmonprisma.mc-server.net | Server Discord:https://discord.gg/HkK855b
It's not that my vanilla loving brain can't comprehend any complex mechanisms that I expect to find in this mod, it just doesn't seem like it fits into vanilla as the topic creator claims (and fits even more so than the latest additions, apparently). By vanilla style, I didn't mean easy, I meant that I was hoping it would have general features that would fit into Minecraft, but it seems to be another industrial mod. Just my opinion, you don't have to think the same way, but I don't think that makes my opinion any less valid.
I didn't mean "2complex4u", I meant the blocks are simple, in the sense of "not industrial". They look like quick and simple hacks Steve made to help him with his stay in the world. The mod has some focus in automation indeed, but you won't find stuff like Igneous Extruders or quarries or pipes. And even for those simple blocks, you get access to them only after you managed to survive and progress a lot - there is a huge survival focus in BtW.
I mentioned it being harder because it's one of the most obvious differences from vanilla that I could mention without spoiling stuff, and because industrial mods rarely mess with the difficulty of the game (notable exception: GregTech).
About fitting or not vanilla more than the recent additions: as you said, it's a matter of opinion... I personally do think most late additions in vanilla are extraneous.
This topic has a pretty negative atmosphere, doesn't it now? It's all well and good that you don't like Mojang's latest features, but you seem to be bashing them a bit now.
That's what you get when you have hopes,, only to watch them being crushed every time like a game of whack-a-mole, and any and all communication you attempt only causes the whacking to be harder, not softer.
Having played other industrial mods... no this is not "just another industrial mod". It also maintains the feeling of Vanilla unlike most industrial mods. I would suggest you just play it rather than try and discern the contents of a book by it's cover.
Never said I didn't think it would be good. Said I didn't think it would fit into vanilla. Don't mistake that for me saying it's average or bad. You're all reading too deeply into this while I'm trying to be quite blunt here.
K, to be blunt, no one at all cares about your opinion about a mod you've never played. What drives someone to think their ignorance-based words are so important that we would benefit from hearing them?
The OP has gotten out of date and no matter how good the OP is, could not substitute the experience that the mod gives.
I think this is the most relevant point here. The OP *is* horribly out of date and doesn't at all represent what the mod is like in its current incarnation.
Nothing more really needs to be said beyond that point. Guy read the OP, didn't like what he saw...oh well. Only one to blame for that is me for having let it get so far out of date
Nope. The mod is for Minecraft 1.5.2. The reason why has been explained pretty much on every page for the past few months.
Well that first one shouldn't physically exist. Anywhere. Its either someone reposting the mod illegally- with the wrong information, or something a lot worse- such as login-stealers/account hijacking code. You might want to drop a line in the StopModReposts thread.
The latest and newest version of Better Than Wolves (for MC 1.5.2) can be found in the OP, and in the official forum.
A mighty machine built within the wake
Of a long dead dream, little demon awake
The citizens sleep, never quite knowing when
The device will reawaken, hungry again.
I think BTW was my first 'real' mod (besides Rei's Minimap, oh how I relied on that thing) I really like current BTW, have never considered playing an earlier version or turning off hardcore features when there was a config. I only wish we could have gotten horses lol man I love horses! (just in general hehe)
The idea of horses as a transportation alternative is nice. However, I think the way it was implemented didn't fit vanilla... even less Better than Wolves, where you're encouraged to build infra-structure as roads, minecart systems, etc.
Well they make minecart systems essentially worthless. Considering how interesting those can be, and how much they drive construction (the most interesting part of minecraft) they're a gameplay ruiner.
Yeah.
Sad part is: the horses make sense in the way they are in Mo' Creatures. However, when adapting them to vanilla, the progression was completely removed, there are no other mobs with the same design (horses fit just right in Mo' Creatures... but they are quite different from vanilla mobs), their speed was [I think] even buffed a bit.
Even sadder part: if well-implemented, riding mobs wouldn't detract from minecarts, but be an ingame alternative to them. You would eventually want to build track systems between your bases, and only use the horses for exploring.
Back on-topic, I remember reading somewhere this was pretty much the reason FlowerChild didn't bother with the horses, a bit before he decided to stay in 1.5.x.
Yeah, that's pretty much correct. I was already on the verge as the update to 1.5 involved me ripping out pretty much everything that had been added to vanilla, which essentially made it a big waste of time. By that point, the balance of BTW was already so different from vanilla, that just including random new features wasn't really a reasonable option anymore, and I didn't feel the quality of the new features being added was sufficient to go through the work of trying to adapt them to work well with BTW.
Horses were just the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak, as they clashed so heavily with everything in the mod that it convinced me it was time to go my own way and stick with 1.5. If I remember right, I had a number of ideas about how I might adapt them for BTW, but the precise thing that made up my mind about it was the way they looked and how visually inconsistent they were with the rest of the game.
Given I'm not an artist, the thought of trying to remodel and retexture them to correct that, when they weren't even a feature I was really interested in to begin with was not a particularly pleasant one
There's only been one feature added to vanilla since that I've had mild regrets over not having in BTW, which is the slime blocks, but overall I think it was the right move.
Well. To be honest, they're quite fun to play with, both as "sticky platforms" and for their entity throwing abilities... but they're like, one thing with long-term value in a sea of "five minutes gameplay" things, at least for me.
(Like the new biomes. Or the moss stone crafting recipe - something that BTW has for a really long time but with a more interesting gameplay.)
Why wouldn't you import/remake it?
This topic has a pretty negative atmosphere, doesn't it now? It's all well and good that you don't like Mojang's latest features, but you seem to be bashing them a bit now. Anyway, I might try this at some point. Might not. Looking at the features I'm not sure its something I'll be looking to when I want to play vanilla-style modded Minecraft. There's an awful lot of random mechanical stuff here, and when I look for a new vanilla experience, I'm thinking more general than yet another industrial revolution, but this time with wood and fire.
I think it's more a harsh atmosphere than negative proper... both FlowerChild and us BtW players are kinda skeptic on the later additions, including me.
I'll warn you: BtW doesn't play "vanilla-like", it's harder. Really harder, due to a bunch of deeper gameplay changes (the "Hardcore Things") besides the new blocks added. However, if you're going to try, the best advice I can give you is: play smart and learn with your mistakes. Then the game becomes rewarding and addictive.
The mechanical stuff is actually quite simple... produce mechanical power, transmit mech power, use power in the saws/turntables/etc. with it. That's it. It resembles far more redstone than the actual power systems from other mods (Redstone Flux, MJoules, Blutricity...).
And the blocks added might look random if you pick them one by one, but together, they make sense. You're going to need them to build stuff. And they're quite simple too, they usually do just one thing... (cauldron boils stuff, saw cuts stuff, block dispenser dispenses blocks...).
It's not that my vanilla loving brain can't comprehend any complex mechanisms that I expect to find in this mod, it just doesn't seem like it fits into vanilla as the topic creator claims (and fits even more so than the latest additions, apparently). By vanilla style, I didn't mean easy, I meant that I was hoping it would have general features that would fit into Minecraft, but it seems to be another industrial mod. Just my opinion, you don't have to think the same way, but I don't think that makes my opinion any less valid.
Someone who hadn't looked deeply into something has a less valid opinion about it. It's like if I were to give my opinions about france. Sure I've seen pictures but I'm hardly equipped to talk about what it's really like since I've never been there.
If you don't want to try a mod then don't try it, I'm sure you aren't going to go into every thread on this forum to let people know you don't plan to use their mod right? It's silly to think you really get what something is about without trying it. If you want to know what BTW is about play it, if you don't then don't, but nothing useful comes from pretending you understand something with such a shallow look.
Isn't it a bit silly to assume that I won't know the content of a mod before I play it? I've given it a good look, and the opening post does a very good job on explaining what the mod is about. And after reading it, I decided I didn't want to play it. And because of that, you're here to tell me that I have no right to bear that opinion because I've never played it. I'm not going to tell you to play every mod you ever look at just in case it ends up being awesome. That would be silly. If you don't think a mod looks like your cup of tea, you don't have to play it.
I didn't come here simply to say "lol terrible mod not gonna play", that would be rude and an inaccurate portrayal of my opinion, which is what you seem to be hearing right now. I was simply stating my opinion on the features described, and how I didn't find that those matched with the idea that these features fit into vanilla better than, say, horses. That's my opinion on the subject, and playing the mod won't change that. It might become my favorite mod in the world, but it won't make me want it to become vanilla, for reasons already explained. I have a right to an opinion whether I've actually played the mod or not, because that opinion has nothing to do with my opinion on the mod. Whether the mod fits into vanilla MC or not has no affect on how enjoyable I will find it, I was just giving my opinion on the idea that it does fit. That doesn't require me to try all of the things for myself if I already know exactly what they are.
Mason didn't tell you you "have no right to bear that opinion"
I believe he merely inferred that your opinion was worthless as you have yet to experience the mod.
"giving it a good look" will not give you any indication of the content.
The OP has gotten out of date and no matter how good the OP is, could not substitute the experience that the mod gives.
You call it "just another industrial mod" but as many, I doubt you would even survive the first night let alone progress to the content enough to get near mechanical power.
Never said I didn't think it would be good. Said I didn't think it would fit into vanilla. Don't mistake that for me saying it's average or bad. You're all reading too deeply into this while I'm trying to be quite blunt here.
I didn't mean "2complex4u", I meant the blocks are simple, in the sense of "not industrial". They look like quick and simple hacks Steve made to help him with his stay in the world. The mod has some focus in automation indeed, but you won't find stuff like Igneous Extruders or quarries or pipes. And even for those simple blocks, you get access to them only after you managed to survive and progress a lot - there is a huge survival focus in BtW.
I mentioned it being harder because it's one of the most obvious differences from vanilla that I could mention without spoiling stuff, and because industrial mods rarely mess with the difficulty of the game (notable exception: GregTech).
About fitting or not vanilla more than the recent additions: as you said, it's a matter of opinion... I personally do think most late additions in vanilla are extraneous.
That's what you get when you have hopes,, only to watch them being crushed every time like a game of whack-a-mole, and any and all communication you attempt only causes the whacking to be harder, not softer.
Having played other industrial mods... no this is not "just another industrial mod". It also maintains the feeling of Vanilla unlike most industrial mods. I would suggest you just play it rather than try and discern the contents of a book by it's cover.
K, to be blunt, no one at all cares about your opinion about a mod you've never played. What drives someone to think their ignorance-based words are so important that we would benefit from hearing them?
I think this is the most relevant point here. The OP *is* horribly out of date and doesn't at all represent what the mod is like in its current incarnation.
Nothing more really needs to be said beyond that point. Guy read the OP, didn't like what he saw...oh well. Only one to blame for that is me for having let it get so far out of date