wow. i dont particularly like the new changes. apparently im so terrified of some slight darkness that i start bleeding internally? lame
Strange. Every time I've arrived in a reality comprised entirely of cubes and been surrounded by monsters, that's precisely what's happened. I've just been basing the mod on past experience and thus trying to making it as realistic as possible.
If you could post a screenshot of the precise runes/sigils/herbs and a copy of the various incantations you used to translocate, I'd be much obliged. Only thing I can think of is that there's some discrepancy between our methods that's to blame.
Someone should REALLY just remake this into a new mod, updated to 1.7.10 or 1.8.1 just like Redpower was remade into Project Red. I really really like the idea of this mod but I just want to play this with other mods and to the most recent version
You should REALLY just use MC 1.5.2 if you like the mod that much.
Making it work with the latest MC would be a walk in the park for Flowerchild.
However reworking and rebalancing the entire game to use the newer content would take a lot of time to get right; with a lot of the new content getting ripped out- to the point where its still effectively 1.4.7 (Remember nearly all the 1.5 content is ripped).
The end result would play no different to the version we have now; so there is absolutely zero point in porting forward.
Likewise as the entire game has been redesigned and rebuilt- with a lot of vanilla features axed- playing it with other mods is fundamentally impossible at a conceptual design level. Asking for this to work is like asking Grand Theft Auto to be playable with Farm Simulator and Super Mario.
Essentially Better Than Wolves in a unique game in its own right.
A mighty machine built within the wake
Of a long dead dream, little demon awake
The citizens sleep, never quite knowing when
The device will reawaken, hungry again.
Someone should REALLY just remake this into a new mod, updated to 1.7.10 or 1.8.1 just like Redpower was remade into Project Red. I really really like the idea of this mod but I just want to play this with other mods and to the most recent version
Nothing stops you from creating a profile for Better than Wolves and another for 1.7.10 Forge mods, like I do.
And agreeing with celestialphoenix, playing BTW with other mods is weird; BTW isn't about "moar contentz" like most mods, but every single thing having purpose in the game, and being all connected into just one thing.
Strange. Every time I've arrived in a reality comprised entirely of cubes and been surrounded by monsters, that's precisely what's happened. I've just been basing the mod on past experience and thus trying to making it as realistic as possible.
If you could post a screenshot of the precise runes/sigils/herbs and a copy of the various incantations you used to translocate, I'd be much obliged. Only thing I can think of is that there's some discrepancy between our methods that's to blame.
ah yes that must be it. I took the northern ice portal to get there. clearly you entered from somewhere in the southern regions.
I do like the mod btw. just didn't like that when i started chopping a tree it got slightly to dark and everything went black, I quickly went insane and started hearing scary sounds then the sun went down the rest of the way and it must have been a moonless night cause I never got any amount of night-vision and simply pissed myself and died. I mean, if I kept hearing zombie moans all night i'm sure my sanity would have waned. But it just seemed to happen kinda fast. that's all.
it was just easier to turn off more of the features in the older versions.
ah yes that must be it. I took the northern ice portal to get there. clearly you entered from somewhere in the southern regions.
I do like the mod btw. just didn't like that when i started chopping a tree it got slightly to dark and everything went black, I quickly went insane and started hearing scary sounds then the sun went down the rest of the way and it must have been a moonless night cause I never got any amount of night-vision and simply pissed myself and died. I mean, if I kept hearing zombie moans all night i'm sure my sanity would have waned. But it just seemed to happen kinda fast. that's all.
it was just easier to turn off more of the features in the older versions.
You have plenty of time to punch chop wood, get a bit of food, get a couple tools, and dig into the earth before the first nightfall. If night is happening when you start punching a tree you're not prioritizing properly or you're spawning unusually far from a forest. The world is dangerous, you have to get down to business quickly, that's one of the central themes of BTW, you can't just take your time.
Hardcore hunger and hardcore of darkness never were options in BTW. Only a couple features in BTW were ever options and aren't options today.
I do like the mod btw. just didn't like that when i started chopping a tree it got slightly to dark and everything went black, I quickly went insane and started hearing scary sounds then the sun went down the rest of the way and it must have been a moonless night cause I never got any amount of night-vision and simply pissed myself and died. I mean, if I kept hearing zombie moans all night i'm sure my sanity would have waned. But it just seemed to happen kinda fast. that's all.
I think if you stop and consider why that's the case though, you'll understand the benefits it has on the overall experience.
It's part of what gives shelter meaning, and given one of the key gameplay strengths of Minecraft is digging, building, and generally manipulating your environment, that's a good thing. It puts additional survival pressure on the player in the early game, effectively putting a time limit on your initial activities and giving reason to think about prioritizing them.
It helps to close loopholes in the overall survival mechanics such as just noob-towering, walling yourself in entirely, or climbing a tree when night comes. It gives added value to having a light source, and finding coal, where it's no longer just a matter of preventing monster spawns, but a matter of survival to keep yourself lit.
Keep playing with it and I strongly suspect you'll begin to see the beneficial impact it has on gameplay overall. Dying to it on one single occasion before realizing that night is actually dangerous in BTW and that it must be prepared for, is far too small a sample set to judge it on IMO.
I think if you stop and consider why that's the case though, you'll understand the benefits it has on the overall experience.
It's part of what gives shelter meaning, and given one of the key gameplay strengths of Minecraft is digging, building, and generally manipulating your environment, that's a good thing. It puts additional survival pressure on the player in the early game, effectively putting a time limit on your initial activities and giving reason to think about prioritizing them.
It helps to close loopholes in the overall survival mechanics such as just noob-towering, walling yourself in entirely, or climbing a tree when night comes. It gives added value to having a light source, and finding coal, where it's no longer just a matter of preventing monster spawns, but a matter of survival to keep yourself lit.
Keep playing with it and I strongly suspect you'll begin to see the beneficial impact it has on gameplay overall. Dying to it on one single occasion before realizing that night is actually dangerous in BTW and that it must be prepared for, is far too small a sample set to judge it on IMO.
you points are valid and appreciated though my friend and i played on multiple worlds for many hours not just one time; i haven't played your mod in some time myself though so i was unprepared for so many changes; we did respawn and get a torch but not before barely surviving a night on burning sawdust and bark . while everything you say is true, & i think yours is the best 'make things harder' mod out there, i really think : 1 steve must be a giant wuss with 0 bravery. 2. climbing a tree to survive a night is completely logical and reasonable(waking up to a skeleton shooting you is also logical). 3 oh no, steve didnt get a torch in time before dark:
oh, he didn't make it... shame.
just seems a little to forced. (don't get me wrong)i like the idea of the emotional status and think it should be kept. its a very cool idea and very applicable to minecraft as its technically a horror setting.
it just feels hard for the sake of being hard instead of hard to impose 'reality'. if it were softened or maybe cumulative: meaning the first night you get scared and lose abilities and such but make it though a night. but then daybreak makes you mostly better; but the next night things get worse, and you don't get as better with daybreak. that kinda thing would feel more real.(it does break your time limit/priority setup though)
I also like having effects happen to the player because of emotional state but most peoples eye go wide and they get great night vision though maybe tunnel vision when scared, they don't just instantly black everything out. I do like the idea, I just think the application is overly strong.
I think copying the thrist mod and dying within 3 days w/o water makes way more sense than terror death in one night. that's all i'm getting at. i suppose getting light before 1 nightfall isnt too much to ask and if thats the main purpose is pressure on time then ill have to deal with it. obviously after getting only a couple torches then entire problem is solved.
i promise i'm not trying to start a flame or anything. thanks for maintaining such a good mod for so darn long. I have only made a random structure from file spawning mod, wandering traders, and stone golems for the nether(drops cobble so survival in nether is more achievable) myself. I doubt I could reach anything as complex as what you've accomplished here. also thanks for still being active on your forum page this long, i couldn't believe how quickly you yourself responded to an unimportant complaint.
just seems a little to forced. (don't get me wrong)i like the idea of the emotional status and think it should be kept.
Who says it's emotional?
I think you're making a lot of assumptions about what's actually happening to Steve in the dark there. Heck, I think you're making a lot of assumptions about the nature of the Minecraft world in BTW as well, which has been the subject of much speculation in the past, but let's just start with the emotional state stuff
This was actually the underlying meaning behind my first joking reply to your objections. There were a lot of assumptions in that first post about how everything worked rather than approaching it from the angle of asking yourself what was really going on there. Hence why I was essentially asking how things behaved the last time you were in such a reality which is so obviously different from our own.
Also, this seems to essentially boil down to a realism argument for you, and sorry, but I don't do realism, especially where alternate cubic realities are concerned
I tried re-exploring with the first map, but it refused to update or show anything other than the two green dots. Crafting the map up to the next size fixed it, and the second map had no issues.
1. When you break snow beneath a flower you can see through the block under the snow. (like with a cave finder mod)
2. When you use up a shear harvesting Creeper Oysters, the shear becomes a bugged item. it becomes undamaged, if you use it, it disappears. if you drop it you get an unlimited amount of these shears by trying to pick it up.
I'm sorry, if this is the wrong place to post bugs.
I'd ask for confirmation from someone I know before investigating either of those. The first is possible, but unlikely given it's never been reported before and would likely come up fairly frequently for anyone in a snow biome.
I know the second simply isn't the case unless there's a very specific set of circumstances that have caused it which aren't in your description.
I would think the most likely cause is an install error or that you have other mods installed which are causing the issues.
I'd ask for confirmation from someone I know before investigating either of those. The first is possible, but unlikely given it's never been reported before and would likely come up fairly frequently for anyone in a snow biome.
I know the second simply isn't the case unless there's a very specific set of circumstances that have caused it which aren't in your description.
I would think the most likely cause is an install error or that you have other mods installed which are causing the issues.
I've seen both of these before but never reported them since they are easily avoided, but I also run CraftGuide along with my install of BTW so I can't rule out the possibility of that somehow causing the issue.
The snow issue doesn't seem to occur often (at least I only encountered it once) and the shear thing occurred with my first pair of shears. I haven't used much on my second pair of shears nor do I carry them around with me since my base is secured against all mobs. (Except Endermen)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I swear to god I must be the only true optimist left on the planet.
Quote from FlowerChild »
See...I kept telling everyone that wolves are evil despicable creatures, but would anyone listen? No, of course not, and now you're all ******, so "haha...told you so".
just try the fist one, it will happen. (nearly always).
for the second one, jut make a creative world, give yourself some creeper spawn eggs and a shear and shear creepers till the shear should break. You will get the bugged item.
I don't support creative mode, so whatever on that one.
I've also done both of the above many times in survival and never run into issues with either, so no, I'd say they're not as easy to reproduce as you may assume.
I'll take a look the next time I'm in game at the snow thing since ItchyFlea confirmed it. Otherwise I don't tend to look at suspicious sounding bugs if I don't know someone, as it's far too easy to lead me on a wild goose chase and waste a ton of time.
Nothing personal in any of that. These are just methods that I use to preserve my own sanity
After doing a few deaths and restarts particularly lately, I've noticed just how powerful the chest is as an item.
The chest can be made pretty much right as you're working your way through the first night, essentially letting you save your item progress at will.This is all fine and dandy, but, with storage being as inexpensive as it is, I feel there's a missed opportunity for resource management.At present, there's the decision between leaving an item in your inventory where it can both be used or get lost, and your chests where it remains safe.
I'd like to see a possible tweak to storage to make prioritizing what items you save for your next life becoming a more meaningful process. Along with this perhaps a more significant investment being needed before producing large storage facilities in the mid to late game.
I had been thinking along somewhat different lines than those above. I'd been more thinking along the lines of the chest as the means of persistence and progress in a roguelike. In your first night you can cram all the wood and stone you mine for the next week, all the food you find, and all if your tools you aren't using at that time. If you happen to die, pretty much everything you ever have ends up being safe at very minimal resource investment (as wood is the least expensive material in game).
My thoughts more toward implementation would be to have a stone/wood box as a more expensive and smaller slotted chest to stop the initial ability to just pour everything into storage right at the start (alternatively, a furnace may be used as storage in a pinch), then require an iron ingot as hinges for a regular chest to push real storage back to a time when you really start to need it most. (I'd initially refrained from posting this to avoid making implementation suggestions, as I do know FC dislikes those). The more expensive early game chest more intended as a "here's a basic couple items to start you back up again when you get back here" as opposed to "alright, so I died here before but I've still got everything from that run to get right back up again and finish whatever I happened to be doing in this area".
The mindset you get from this mod persists into vanilla play, at least it does for me.
I'm still wary of dark caves, and just yesterday I scared the .... out of myself when I turned around while underwater and there was a squid next to me.
Still, this mod gives so much more meaning to building anything compared to vanilla.
Vanilla: Day 1: Everythings' Done for perpetual survival. Challenge Gone.
BTW: Day 20: Scraping by. Challenge still very much there.
I swear to god I must be the only true optimist left on the planet.
Quote from FlowerChild »
See...I kept telling everyone that wolves are evil despicable creatures, but would anyone listen? No, of course not, and now you're all ******, so "haha...told you so".
Does the server.properties setting of difficulty=3 have any effect on a BTW server? I'm using this setting for the first time and maybe its my imagination but it feels like I'm getting hungry faster than on difficulty=2 or single player.
Does the server.properties setting of difficulty=3 have any effect on a BTW server? I'm using this setting for the first time and maybe its my imagination but it feels like I'm getting hungry faster than on difficulty=2 or single player.
Strange. Every time I've arrived in a reality comprised entirely of cubes and been surrounded by monsters, that's precisely what's happened. I've just been basing the mod on past experience and thus trying to making it as realistic as possible.
If you could post a screenshot of the precise runes/sigils/herbs and a copy of the various incantations you used to translocate, I'd be much obliged. Only thing I can think of is that there's some discrepancy between our methods that's to blame.
You should REALLY just use MC 1.5.2 if you like the mod that much.
Making it work with the latest MC would be a walk in the park for Flowerchild.
However reworking and rebalancing the entire game to use the newer content would take a lot of time to get right; with a lot of the new content getting ripped out- to the point where its still effectively 1.4.7 (Remember nearly all the 1.5 content is ripped).
The end result would play no different to the version we have now; so there is absolutely zero point in porting forward.
Likewise as the entire game has been redesigned and rebuilt- with a lot of vanilla features axed- playing it with other mods is fundamentally impossible at a conceptual design level. Asking for this to work is like asking Grand Theft Auto to be playable with Farm Simulator and Super Mario.
Essentially Better Than Wolves in a unique game in its own right.
A mighty machine built within the wake
Of a long dead dream, little demon awake
The citizens sleep, never quite knowing when
The device will reawaken, hungry again.
Nothing stops you from creating a profile for Better than Wolves and another for 1.7.10 Forge mods, like I do.
And agreeing with celestialphoenix, playing BTW with other mods is weird; BTW isn't about "moar contentz" like most mods, but every single thing having purpose in the game, and being all connected into just one thing.
ah yes that must be it. I took the northern ice portal to get there. clearly you entered from somewhere in the southern regions.
I do like the mod btw. just didn't like that when i started chopping a tree it got slightly to dark and everything went black, I quickly went insane and started hearing scary sounds then the sun went down the rest of the way and it must have been a moonless night cause I never got any amount of night-vision and simply pissed myself and died. I mean, if I kept hearing zombie moans all night i'm sure my sanity would have waned. But it just seemed to happen kinda fast. that's all.
it was just easier to turn off more of the features in the older versions.
You have plenty of time to punch chop wood, get a bit of food, get a couple tools, and dig into the earth before the first nightfall. If night is happening when you start punching a tree you're not prioritizing properly or you're spawning unusually far from a forest. The world is dangerous, you have to get down to business quickly, that's one of the central themes of BTW, you can't just take your time.
Hardcore hunger and hardcore of darkness never were options in BTW. Only a couple features in BTW were ever options and aren't options today.
I think if you stop and consider why that's the case though, you'll understand the benefits it has on the overall experience.
It's part of what gives shelter meaning, and given one of the key gameplay strengths of Minecraft is digging, building, and generally manipulating your environment, that's a good thing. It puts additional survival pressure on the player in the early game, effectively putting a time limit on your initial activities and giving reason to think about prioritizing them.
It helps to close loopholes in the overall survival mechanics such as just noob-towering, walling yourself in entirely, or climbing a tree when night comes. It gives added value to having a light source, and finding coal, where it's no longer just a matter of preventing monster spawns, but a matter of survival to keep yourself lit.
Keep playing with it and I strongly suspect you'll begin to see the beneficial impact it has on gameplay overall. Dying to it on one single occasion before realizing that night is actually dangerous in BTW and that it must be prepared for, is far too small a sample set to judge it on IMO.
you points are valid and appreciated though my friend and i played on multiple worlds for many hours not just one time; i haven't played your mod in some time myself though so i was unprepared for so many changes; we did respawn and get a torch but not before barely surviving a night on burning sawdust and bark
just seems a little to forced. (don't get me wrong)i like the idea of the emotional status and think it should be kept. its a very cool idea and very applicable to minecraft as its technically a horror setting.
it just feels hard for the sake of being hard instead of hard to impose 'reality'. if it were softened or maybe cumulative: meaning the first night you get scared and lose abilities and such but make it though a night. but then daybreak makes you mostly better; but the next night things get worse, and you don't get as better with daybreak. that kinda thing would feel more real.(it does break your time limit/priority setup though)
I also like having effects happen to the player because of emotional state but most peoples eye go wide and they get great night vision though maybe tunnel vision when scared, they don't just instantly black everything out. I do like the idea, I just think the application is overly strong.
I think copying the thrist mod and dying within 3 days w/o water makes way more sense than terror death in one night. that's all i'm getting at. i suppose getting light before 1 nightfall isnt too much to ask and if thats the main purpose is pressure on time then ill have to deal with it. obviously after getting only a couple torches then entire problem is solved.
i promise i'm not trying to start a flame or anything. thanks for maintaining such a good mod for so darn long. I have only made a random structure from file spawning mod, wandering traders, and stone golems for the nether(drops cobble so survival in nether is more achievable) myself. I doubt I could reach anything as complex as what you've accomplished here. also thanks for still being active on your forum page this long, i couldn't believe how quickly you yourself responded to an unimportant complaint.
Who says it's emotional?
I think you're making a lot of assumptions about what's actually happening to Steve in the dark there. Heck, I think you're making a lot of assumptions about the nature of the Minecraft world in BTW as well, which has been the subject of much speculation in the past, but let's just start with the emotional state stuff
This was actually the underlying meaning behind my first joking reply to your objections. There were a lot of assumptions in that first post about how everything worked rather than approaching it from the angle of asking yourself what was really going on there. Hence why I was essentially asking how things behaved the last time you were in such a reality which is so obviously different from our own.
Also, this seems to essentially boil down to a realism argument for you, and sorry, but I don't do realism, especially where alternate cubic realities are concerned
cool cool cool. i guess ill just have to play with it some more.
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Curse PremiumDid you craft any map with Shift-clicking? Because that's a vanilla bug. Other than that, I don't know. I haven't encountered other issues in my play.
I'd ask for confirmation from someone I know before investigating either of those. The first is possible, but unlikely given it's never been reported before and would likely come up fairly frequently for anyone in a snow biome.
I know the second simply isn't the case unless there's a very specific set of circumstances that have caused it which aren't in your description.
I would think the most likely cause is an install error or that you have other mods installed which are causing the issues.
I've seen both of these before but never reported them since they are easily avoided, but I also run CraftGuide along with my install of BTW so I can't rule out the possibility of that somehow causing the issue.
The snow issue doesn't seem to occur often (at least I only encountered it once) and the shear thing occurred with my first pair of shears. I haven't used much on my second pair of shears nor do I carry them around with me since my base is secured against all mobs. (Except Endermen)
I don't support creative mode, so whatever on that one.
I've also done both of the above many times in survival and never run into issues with either, so no, I'd say they're not as easy to reproduce as you may assume.
I'll take a look the next time I'm in game at the snow thing since ItchyFlea confirmed it. Otherwise I don't tend to look at suspicious sounding bugs if I don't know someone, as it's far too easy to lead me on a wild goose chase and waste a ton of time.
Nothing personal in any of that. These are just methods that I use to preserve my own sanity
That assumption would be correct
And no worries man. I'm wrapped up in other stuff right now with another mod, but I'll be sure to take note to look at these soon as I have a chance.
The chest can be made pretty much right as you're working your way through the first night, essentially letting you save your item progress at will.This is all fine and dandy, but, with storage being as inexpensive as it is, I feel there's a missed opportunity for resource management.At present, there's the decision between leaving an item in your inventory where it can both be used or get lost, and your chests where it remains safe.
I'd like to see a possible tweak to storage to make prioritizing what items you save for your next life becoming a more meaningful process. Along with this perhaps a more significant investment being needed before producing large storage facilities in the mid to late game.
My thoughts more toward implementation would be to have a stone/wood box as a more expensive and smaller slotted chest to stop the initial ability to just pour everything into storage right at the start (alternatively, a furnace may be used as storage in a pinch), then require an iron ingot as hinges for a regular chest to push real storage back to a time when you really start to need it most. (I'd initially refrained from posting this to avoid making implementation suggestions, as I do know FC dislikes those). The more expensive early game chest more intended as a "here's a basic couple items to start you back up again when you get back here" as opposed to "alright, so I died here before but I've still got everything from that run to get right back up again and finish whatever I happened to be doing in this area".
I'm still wary of dark caves, and just yesterday I scared the .... out of myself when I turned around while underwater and there was a squid next to me.
Still, this mod gives so much more meaning to building anything compared to vanilla.
Vanilla: Day 1: Everythings' Done for perpetual survival. Challenge Gone.
BTW: Day 20: Scraping by. Challenge still very much there.
Appreciate all your hard work on BTW and BTSM
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Retired Staffi don't think difficulty affects hunger rate.
don't quote me on that though.
Btw is there a download link for newer versions? Seems that people actually don't care about the download of newer versions now days...
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