Let's put it short - A subsection for pictures is not worth it. If nobody but you reads the picture thread, why would they read the subforum for it? It makes no sense. Be constuctive nextime, and maybe try being nice if you want people to do things for you.
you still fail to comprehend my post. whether you understand why or not doesn't change the fact that you don't understand the underlying logic of my post
I felt like his response was completely on topic with what you said, obviously it is not just him misunderstanding your 'logic'. To me it just feels like you are in a sour mood because of whatever beef it is you have with the moderators and when someone actually tries to respond to your post you reply with all of the drama of a hurt teenager: 'YOU DONT EVEN UNDERSTAND ME!!11!'.
Welcome to the forums =)
I prefer this system for thread locking. It is more fair on others for locking to be a team effort rather than the opinion of just one person. However, I would just make it so that just one moderator vote would re-open a thread.
Thanks. The only reason I say three would be if there were two enemys on the moderator team the one could keep unlocking threads the other one locks.
If a moderator's decision is questionable, it is brought up among the other mods in an appropriate manner. I can only recall one instance of this. Why? Because moderators make the same decisions another moderator would make in that situation. There are no rogue moderators on the team- every moderator is supported by every other moderator, because we make decisions that benefit the forum as a whole.
Some threads I wish could stay open, but we can't make exceptions. As for the advPNG thread you mentioned, I've never heard of that, and it may very well be out of my sectional power. If it's not, then share a link with me.
The reason my name is showing up on most of these locks is because I've had more time to moderate recently than some of our seasoned moderators. If you have a problem with one of us because of our decision, then keep in mind that you would have the same problem with any other staff member, because they would have made the same call in that situation.
Quote from H3xer1n »
easy solution: a subforum for picture threads, and a subforum for video threads. would solve all the issues
but alas, everything needs to be overcomplicated because of laziness and inability to see long-term benefits/problems
Subforums would solve a lot of issues, but there are far more important things going on right now than tending to video and picture threads. We are currently trying to make the move to another forum software, and a lot of our administration's attention is focused on that. Expect better organization after the move.
Guys, take the bickering out of this thread now before things escalate and warnings are issued.
Subforums would solve a lot of issues, but there are far more important things going on right now than tending to video and picture threads. We are currently trying to make the move to another forum software, and a lot of our administration's attention is focused on that. Expect better organization after the move.
so there's not 60 seconds to spare to just pop those two subforums in? organization can wait until later, but here, i'll help you guys out with a little piece of wisdom
creating those two subforums, which would take at most 1-2 minutes, would cut a shitload of the time you guys have to spend locking all those picture/video threads
less time spent locking threads = more time spent doing other more important things
If it's simple and straightforward it's not underlying. I just wrote out everything you just said. If you're to lazy to contribute to your own thread then don't.
Honestly Bro, His point was quite clear. I hate to fuel the flame here, but go back and read his post. He Clearly states that it is easier and Less cumbersome to sift through a sub forum than a thread. In a sub Forum you can quickly scroll through scanning heading for stuff you want to see, and post comments on that particular creation within it's own environment.
However, in the Picture thread, you have to scroll through everyone Else's BS, instead of just the stuff you want to see. Also, the thread just gets more unmanageable when you have 120 pages of spam and people comments, and having to quote the user just to give him props. So disorganized and ridiculously unnecessary.
I completely agree with H3xer1n here, and think he makes a valid point to the sub forum side. Now granted I am sure I extrapolated a good bit more from his post than you did, but still you should be able to get at least part of that.
The best suggestion we've had so far as toward the stopping of unfair bannings is to let mods re-open locked threads if they disagree with each other.
Another option I can think of is similar to this, as it involves the same 'team effort' part of it. Maybe it would have to take two mods to lock a thread? That way, if they disagree, there isn't a period when the thread is locked and people won't be able to contribute.
EDIT: I don't think I phrased that very well. I mean it would take the first mod to 'request' a lock, and a second to confirm it.
Mods can unlock each others threads already, but in nearly every case, there's no reason to. We also don't ban people for posting outside of the designated threads- we just lock things.
Quote from H3xer1n »
Quote from trunksbomb »
Subforums would solve a lot of issues, but there are far more important things going on right now than tending to video and picture threads. We are currently trying to make the move to another forum software, and a lot of our administration's attention is focused on that. Expect better organization after the move.
so there's not 60 seconds to spare to just pop those two subforums in? organization can wait until later, but here, i'll help you guys out with a little piece of wisdom
creating those two subforums, which would take at most 1-2 minutes, would cut a shitload of the time you guys have to spend locking all those picture/video threads
less time spent locking threads = more time spent doing other more important things
just sayin'
I have no control over what the administrators do, and what they do in their time is subject to their priorities. There is more diplomacy to adding and removing forums, though, than just "popping in" some subforums.
I think it may be useful to have something that allows the community to "vote" to unlock the thread. If enough people agree, (the number would not be set, but would be determined by how many posts were in the thread in the first place, so that a party of 10 can't vote to unlock a thirty page flamewar to get one more word in) the thread in question shall be reconsidered by the moderators. If they accept, the thread is unlocked. If they reject it, the thread is permanently locked, and no more voting can be done.
I think it may be useful to have something that allows the community to "vote" to unlock the thread. If enough people agree, (the number would not be set, but would be determined by how many posts were in the thread in the first place, so that a party of 10 can't vote to unlock a thirty page flamewar to get one more word in) the thread in question shall be reconsidered by the moderators. If they accept, the thread is unlocked. If they reject it, the thread is permanently locked, and no more voting can be done.
Just a reminder, this forum is a private forum. Everyone can join and contribute, but that doesn't mean everyone should be given the right to unlock a thread (with enough votes) The decision of* locking should be in the hands of the staff.
I think it may be useful to have something that allows the community to "vote" to unlock the thread. If enough people agree, (the number would not be set, but would be determined by how many posts were in the thread in the first place, so that a party of 10 can't vote to unlock a thirty page flamewar to get one more word in) the thread in question shall be reconsidered by the moderators. If they accept, the thread is unlocked. If they reject it, the thread is permanently locked, and no more voting can be done.
Just a reminder, this forum is a private forum. Everyone can join and contribute, but that doesn't mean everyone should be given the right to unlock a thread (with enough votes) The decision locking should be in the hands of the staff.
I think it may be useful to have something that allows the community to "vote" to unlock the thread. If enough people agree, (the number would not be set, but would be determined by how many posts were in the thread in the first place, so that a party of 10 can't vote to unlock a thirty page flamewar to get one more word in) the thread in question shall be reconsidered by the moderators. If they accept, the thread is unlocked. If they reject it, the thread is permanently locked, and no more voting can be done.
Just a reminder, this forum is a private forum. Everyone can join and contribute, but that doesn't mean everyone should be given the right to unlock a thread (with enough votes) The decision locking should be in the hands of the staff.
So, maybe if enough people wanted it open again, the moderator could be asked to make a second desicion? That way, threads people really don't want locked will be unlocked and moderators always get to make the final desicion?
If you don't agree with a lock, PM the moderator that locked it. Or you can PM another mod/admin.
Wow, I feel honored that my Pacman thread contributed to the creation of this discussion!
First off, I would like to commend the mods (specifically trunksbomb) for prompt and helpful replies to my PM about this subject.
Now, as you can see, I've only just joined the forum, so I have no idea what kind of existing politics or policies have contributed to the actions currently being taken by the mods. That being said, I would like to make a few comments.
Every creative forum that I have ever participated in (which is about 5-6) have had sub forums for different types of creations (images, movies, works in progress, etc). Some have used stickied threads to highlight the best of the best, but those threads are always maintained and updated by the mods. Usually, the mods just repost topics that have high page counts. This is NOT a necessary feature though, and often those threads are ignored.
The reason for this is extremely simple. If you lump all creative posts into a single topic, it is impossible for the creators to get feedback on their works. By allowing creators to have individual topics for their creations, it allows for discussion of ideas, improvements, criticisms, etc.
From what I understand, the mods are concerned that topics that are great will get lost in the torrent of new posts. That does not happen. People do not only look at the first page. Besides, as soon as someone replies to a topic it is returned to the first page anyway.
Forums like this are inherently designed to filter good posts and bad posts. Bad topics will get no replies and fade into the page depths, while good topics will repeatedly be brought into the spotlight. No mod intervention required!
The biggest issue with the route the mods are taking (by locking topics), is that it reinforces the impression of mod favoritism. Mods cannot read through every post of on every topic to see if a person has posted a pic or video so they have to lock the topic. It's just way too much work.
For example: I've counted at least 20 topics that have both pics and video in the first post that have not been locked by the mods. This one even has "(video)" in the title!
TL;DR: Subforums are a staple of well managed forums, and mods cannot lock useful topics without looking like they are playing favorites.
The problem with the idea of threads being weeded out is that in this community, users feel the need to spam and flame the OP if his creation is bad or in the wrong section or what have you. I've been apart of other communities where bad threads got weeded out simply because nobody posted in them, because the creations weren't all that good.
If it worked that way here, then sure, we'd leave them all unlocked. But as it stands, users can't seem to resist posting memes, spam, or flaming in a thread that needs reporting. So until that day, we will continue to lock the threads instead of letting them die out.
Quote from Insanitydevil »
Seems like a good enough idea to me. Although what I meant by that post is that it wouldn't just be one guy PM'ing a mod, it would be several requests by the community in the form of some kind of voting system. To me, I would be reluctant to unlock a thread on the request of one person (I have pride in my desicion, kinda thing), but I would see that I may have misjudged if i see that '19 people requested that this thread be unlocked' (no offence to any mods, of course).
Love to see how the management of this forum goes after the software switch =)
Also keep in mind that this is not a democracy. This is a generous authoritarian regime. Whatever the admins say goes. That doesn't mean that we'll be unfair or unjust, but that you should keep in mind that nobody is guaranteed a right to post here.
My Opinion:
I completely support the idea of the subforums. It's just way better than this giant confusing picture thread, the arguments are all mentioned before, but I have to add one: all theese pictures are so big and collected in one place. It just takes so much energy to load all that. I mean if you're using W-Lan for example everyone else using it, too, will have massive lagging. Well, atleast here, my brother always complains about lagging.
The examples in the first post really suprised me, it's just mean to lock someone's post searching for some opinions and suggestions about their stuff. Imagine it took 1 weekend to create a note block song video with all the technique of creating, creating, the screen recorder, the youtube channel and the post in the forums. You really put efford into this and you want to know what others think about it.
But no, a mod comes and just locks it, advising to throw that into that collection thread there, where less people will notice it. It's just mean, dear mods. It has nothing to do with some system or something, it's also a bit impolite and disrespectful.
I think the whole user <-> mod <-> admin relationship is just too distanced. What happened the last days is a good example for a symptom of such a relationship. As mentioned here:
Quote from trunksbomb »
I have no control over what the administrators do, and what they do in their time is subject to their priorities.
I'm happy that this thread exist and isn't locked ... yet, hopefully some of those very busy admins read this, too. This thread should change something.
So mods, please think about the person that created the thread before you lock it.
Don't be too distanced, we're all the same.
So... Does this mean if we have a project, and the best way we have of actually showing a project is an image or video, we should post the images and videos in the appropriate threads and then create a new thread with a link to those posts to serve as a discussion area?
Example:
---
I made this great new device for launching pigs. A demonstration video can be seen here: <linky to post in video thread>
If anyone has any feedback or questions feel free to ask them in this thread rather than cluttering the video thread.
---
That seems a bit silly if you ask me and I'm fairly sure that would be seen as violating the spirit of the rules by some.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Tis far better to be a witty fool than a foolish wit.
My Opinion:
I completely support the idea of the subforums. It's just way better than this giant confusing picture thread, the arguments are all mentioned before, but I have to add one: all theese pictures are so big and collected in one place. It just takes so much energy to load all that. I mean if you're using W-Lan for example everyone else using it, too, will have massive lagging. Well, atleast here, my brother always complains about lagging.
The examples in the first post really suprised me, it's just mean to lock someone's post searching for some opinions and suggestions about their stuff. Imagine it took 1 weekend to create a note block song video with all the technique of creating, creating, the screen recorder, the youtube channel and the post in the forums. You really put efford into this and you want to know what others think about it.
But no, a mod comes and just locks it, advising to throw that into that collection thread there, where less people will notice it. It's just mean, dear mods. It has nothing to do with some system or something, it's also a bit impolite and disrespectful.
I think the whole user <-> mod <-> admin relationship is just too distanced. What happened the last days is a good example for a symptom of such a relationship. As mentioned here:
Quote from trunksbomb »
I have no control over what the administrators do, and what they do in their time is subject to their priorities.
I'm happy that this thread exist and isn't locked ... yet, hopefully some of those very busy admins read this, too. This thread should change something.
So mods, please think about the person that created the thread before you lock it.
Don't be too distanced, we're all the same.
The admins are aware of this thread.
But if we take every user's hard work and dedication under consideration, no threads would be locked, and we'd have a spam fest. It takes a certain amount of distancing to lock threads that are well-intentioned and thought out.
For the record, in case anyone was confused, I am also in support of subforums.
Quote from The_Fool76 »
So... Does this mean if we have a project, and the best way we have of actually showing a project is an image or video, we should post the images and videos in the appropriate threads and then create a new thread with a link to those posts to serve as a discussion area?
Example:
---
I made this great new device for launching pigs. A demonstration video can be seen here: <linky to post in video thread>
If anyone has any feedback or questions feel free to ask them in this thread rather than cluttering the video thread.
---
That seems a bit silly if you ask me and I'm fairly sure that would be seen as violating the spirit of the rules by some.
No, that's not what we're aiming to do. The situation is being discussed currently, though.
Quote from Robosprog »
Isn't it funny how the mod commends the person who wrote good things about him?
Anyway, a vote system would fail, as often it just comes down to whether you like the guy who wants it open or who wants it closed more. It wouldn't work.
Take notice that I also commended H3x for his OP. It's nice to read well-written, non-flaming posts, don't you think?
I understand where you're coming from, but I think you are going about it the wrong way. Many of the communities I've been a part of have the same spam / flame problem. The way that they handled it was if a thread was being spammed / flamed, or if the thread itself was spam, they would lock it. The mods didn't even have to go looking through the threads, cause part of the stickied forum rules were that if you see a topic that is spam or a flame war, you report it!
it's good to see that things have calmed down and everyone is discussing things calmly and respectfully
also, i apologize for my hostility earlier, i tend to let my passion get the better of me and it's one of my major character flaws
Quote from riddler251 »
Quote from Insanitydevil »
If it's simple and straightforward it's not underlying. I just wrote out everything you just said. If you're to lazy to contribute to your own thread then don't.
Honestly Bro, His point was quite clear. I hate to fuel the flame here, but go back and read his post. He Clearly states that it is easier and Less cumbersome to sift through a sub forum than a thread. In a sub Forum you can quickly scroll through scanning heading for stuff you want to see, and post comments on that particular creation within it's own environment.
However, in the Picture thread, you have to scroll through everyone Else's BS, instead of just the stuff you want to see. Also, the thread just gets more unmanageable when you have 120 pages of spam and people comments, and having to quote the user just to give him props. So disorganized and ridiculously unnecessary.
I completely agree with H3xer1n here, and think he makes a valid point to the sub forum side. Now granted I am sure I extrapolated a good bit more from his post than you did, but still you should be able to get at least part of that.
yea, you took quite a bit more from it than i originally intended lol
Insanitydevil: I do understand that there is a difference, but the difference is arbitrary. And if you don't think that my topic sparked discussion, you obviously didn't read the replies. :smile.gif:
I feel it was unfairly locked because he wasn't posting a video he made, he was discussing it, and it was going find until it was locked. I think that you should at least allow threads on pics/videos that have a lively discussion going (such as the pacman one). Because to be honest, I really don't know who reads the pic/video threads aside from people posting their own content.
No, that's not what we're aiming to do. The situation is being discussed currently, though.
Glad to hear it. If it helps, breaking out the texture packs and mods into their own sub-forums worked wonders for that part of the community and I think moving projects into it's own area would have a similar impact.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Tis far better to be a witty fool than a foolish wit.
I felt like his response was completely on topic with what you said, obviously it is not just him misunderstanding your 'logic'. To me it just feels like you are in a sour mood because of whatever beef it is you have with the moderators and when someone actually tries to respond to your post you reply with all of the drama of a hurt teenager: 'YOU DONT EVEN UNDERSTAND ME!!11!'.
There is no charge for awesomeness.
If a moderator's decision is questionable, it is brought up among the other mods in an appropriate manner. I can only recall one instance of this. Why? Because moderators make the same decisions another moderator would make in that situation. There are no rogue moderators on the team- every moderator is supported by every other moderator, because we make decisions that benefit the forum as a whole.
Some threads I wish could stay open, but we can't make exceptions. As for the advPNG thread you mentioned, I've never heard of that, and it may very well be out of my sectional power. If it's not, then share a link with me.
The reason my name is showing up on most of these locks is because I've had more time to moderate recently than some of our seasoned moderators. If you have a problem with one of us because of our decision, then keep in mind that you would have the same problem with any other staff member, because they would have made the same call in that situation.
Subforums would solve a lot of issues, but there are far more important things going on right now than tending to video and picture threads. We are currently trying to make the move to another forum software, and a lot of our administration's attention is focused on that. Expect better organization after the move.
Guys, take the bickering out of this thread now before things escalate and warnings are issued.
so there's not 60 seconds to spare to just pop those two subforums in? organization can wait until later, but here, i'll help you guys out with a little piece of wisdom
creating those two subforums, which would take at most 1-2 minutes, would cut a shitload of the time you guys have to spend locking all those picture/video threads
less time spent locking threads = more time spent doing other more important things
just sayin'
Honestly Bro, His point was quite clear. I hate to fuel the flame here, but go back and read his post. He Clearly states that it is easier and Less cumbersome to sift through a sub forum than a thread. In a sub Forum you can quickly scroll through scanning heading for stuff you want to see, and post comments on that particular creation within it's own environment.
However, in the Picture thread, you have to scroll through everyone Else's BS, instead of just the stuff you want to see. Also, the thread just gets more unmanageable when you have 120 pages of spam and people comments, and having to quote the user just to give him props. So disorganized and ridiculously unnecessary.
I completely agree with H3xer1n here, and think he makes a valid point to the sub forum side. Now granted I am sure I extrapolated a good bit more from his post than you did, but still you should be able to get at least part of that.
Mods can unlock each others threads already, but in nearly every case, there's no reason to. We also don't ban people for posting outside of the designated threads- we just lock things.
I have no control over what the administrators do, and what they do in their time is subject to their priorities. There is more diplomacy to adding and removing forums, though, than just "popping in" some subforums.
Just a reminder, this forum is a private forum. Everyone can join and contribute, but that doesn't mean everyone should be given the right to unlock a thread (with enough votes) The decision of* locking should be in the hands of the staff.
I shall keep that in mind.
First off, I would like to commend the mods (specifically trunksbomb) for prompt and helpful replies to my PM about this subject.
Now, as you can see, I've only just joined the forum, so I have no idea what kind of existing politics or policies have contributed to the actions currently being taken by the mods. That being said, I would like to make a few comments.
Every creative forum that I have ever participated in (which is about 5-6) have had sub forums for different types of creations (images, movies, works in progress, etc). Some have used stickied threads to highlight the best of the best, but those threads are always maintained and updated by the mods. Usually, the mods just repost topics that have high page counts. This is NOT a necessary feature though, and often those threads are ignored.
The reason for this is extremely simple. If you lump all creative posts into a single topic, it is impossible for the creators to get feedback on their works. By allowing creators to have individual topics for their creations, it allows for discussion of ideas, improvements, criticisms, etc.
From what I understand, the mods are concerned that topics that are great will get lost in the torrent of new posts. That does not happen. People do not only look at the first page. Besides, as soon as someone replies to a topic it is returned to the first page anyway.
Forums like this are inherently designed to filter good posts and bad posts. Bad topics will get no replies and fade into the page depths, while good topics will repeatedly be brought into the spotlight. No mod intervention required!
The biggest issue with the route the mods are taking (by locking topics), is that it reinforces the impression of mod favoritism. Mods cannot read through every post of on every topic to see if a person has posted a pic or video so they have to lock the topic. It's just way too much work.
For example: I've counted at least 20 topics that have both pics and video in the first post that have not been locked by the mods. This one even has "(video)" in the title!
TL;DR: Subforums are a staple of well managed forums, and mods cannot lock useful topics without looking like they are playing favorites.
The problem with the idea of threads being weeded out is that in this community, users feel the need to spam and flame the OP if his creation is bad or in the wrong section or what have you. I've been apart of other communities where bad threads got weeded out simply because nobody posted in them, because the creations weren't all that good.
If it worked that way here, then sure, we'd leave them all unlocked. But as it stands, users can't seem to resist posting memes, spam, or flaming in a thread that needs reporting. So until that day, we will continue to lock the threads instead of letting them die out.
Also keep in mind that this is not a democracy. This is a generous authoritarian regime. Whatever the admins say goes. That doesn't mean that we'll be unfair or unjust, but that you should keep in mind that nobody is guaranteed a right to post here.
My Opinion:
I completely support the idea of the subforums. It's just way better than this giant confusing picture thread, the arguments are all mentioned before, but I have to add one: all theese pictures are so big and collected in one place. It just takes so much energy to load all that. I mean if you're using W-Lan for example everyone else using it, too, will have massive lagging. Well, atleast here, my brother always complains about lagging.
The examples in the first post really suprised me, it's just mean to lock someone's post searching for some opinions and suggestions about their stuff. Imagine it took 1 weekend to create a note block song video with all the technique of creating, creating, the screen recorder, the youtube channel and the post in the forums. You really put efford into this and you want to know what others think about it.
But no, a mod comes and just locks it, advising to throw that into that collection thread there, where less people will notice it. It's just mean, dear mods. It has nothing to do with some system or something, it's also a bit impolite and disrespectful.
I think the whole user <-> mod <-> admin relationship is just too distanced. What happened the last days is a good example for a symptom of such a relationship. As mentioned here:
I'm happy that this thread exist and isn't locked ... yet, hopefully some of those very busy admins read this, too. This thread should change something.
So mods, please think about the person that created the thread before you lock it.
Don't be too distanced, we're all the same.
The submitted avatar is 150 pixels wide and 151 pixels high. Avatars must be at least 32 pixels wide and 32 pixels high, but no larger than 150 pixels wide and 150 pixels high.
Example:
---
I made this great new device for launching pigs. A demonstration video can be seen here: <linky to post in video thread>
If anyone has any feedback or questions feel free to ask them in this thread rather than cluttering the video thread.
---
That seems a bit silly if you ask me and I'm fairly sure that would be seen as violating the spirit of the rules by some.
The admins are aware of this thread.
But if we take every user's hard work and dedication under consideration, no threads would be locked, and we'd have a spam fest. It takes a certain amount of distancing to lock threads that are well-intentioned and thought out.
For the record, in case anyone was confused, I am also in support of subforums.
No, that's not what we're aiming to do. The situation is being discussed currently, though.
Take notice that I also commended H3x for his OP. It's nice to read well-written, non-flaming posts, don't you think?
I understand where you're coming from, but I think you are going about it the wrong way. Many of the communities I've been a part of have the same spam / flame problem. The way that they handled it was if a thread was being spammed / flamed, or if the thread itself was spam, they would lock it. The mods didn't even have to go looking through the threads, cause part of the stickied forum rules were that if you see a topic that is spam or a flame war, you report it!
also, i apologize for my hostility earlier, i tend to let my passion get the better of me and it's one of my major character flaws
yea, you took quite a bit more from it than i originally intended lol
Thanks for the welcome!
I feel it was unfairly locked because he wasn't posting a video he made, he was discussing it, and it was going find until it was locked. I think that you should at least allow threads on pics/videos that have a lively discussion going (such as the pacman one). Because to be honest, I really don't know who reads the pic/video threads aside from people posting their own content.
Glad to hear it. If it helps, breaking out the texture packs and mods into their own sub-forums worked wonders for that part of the community and I think moving projects into it's own area would have a similar impact.