This seems the most reasonable to me. I'm not a lawyer, but from what I've gathered on trademark laws, "scroll" refers to the brand, not the word itself. The reason it's in so many media types is because if notch wants to advertise in these mediums or produce brand merchandise, he can without people piggy backing on the project he put the work into.
Notch does strike me as a humble guy. He's been forgiving of piracy (even though, as a developer, he has the most to lose because of it) and has given away copies of his games, something a smaller company doesn't usually do and he's been very open to listening to the player base. I don't know Notch personally, but to think he would all the sudden turn into some greedy scammer seems highly unlikely.
Money changes everyone, not saying it has to him but it can turn the honest of men into ravaging lunatics.
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Quote from NoodleUK »
Quote from Axoren »
Notch = Guy on horse
Lag = All the dead bodies and the burning village in the background
Woman = Us, the consumers
Money changes everyone, not saying it has to him but it can turn the honest of men into ravaging lunatics.
But that's the thing, Notch doesn't have THAT much money and there's no indication he ever tried to weasel his way into Zenimax's pockets. All we have is a one page article off Kotaku by someone who knows as much about the situation (and trademark law) as the rest of us (i.e. none). The idea that a game called "Scrolls" might be confused with "The Elder Scrolls" is a little ridiculous, especially when the two are (from what we've heard) entirely different types of games. Even people who have had their head in the sand for the last 20 years have enough to go on to say "there's a definite chance these are two different things".
I think Some Zenimax lawyers somewhere decided that the system would allow there to be a brand dispute, went to enforce their brand, Notch responded in an unprofessional way (which is not exactly a bad thing, considering the frivolous nature of the claim) and some Kotaku writer blew things out of proportion.
if and when Mahjong wins this lawsuit with Bethesda they should get the rights with Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim. the Reason bethedsa is making such claims is very ignorant an childesh so a game is named scrolls how many things do you know with te word scrolls in it? the dead sea scrolls for instance could make a lawsuit against bethesda for using the word Scroll in there name but Mahjong and other companies are smarter than that. I beleive that Christopher Weaver is upset that another company is making money the word "Scrolls" is so widly used that this lawsuit is a stupid choice for bethesda, i would have taken the settlement agreement aleast then they will have the ability to lose with dignity instead of being publicly humiliated. If Mahjong wins Skyrim will not be the game everyone wants anymore.... ive looked at the reports on both sides carefully. Mahjong has a higher rate of sucess against Bethesda due to its a smaller company and the name is "scrolls" not "elder scrolls" the logos look so much different from each other.
Have you folks not been paying attention? Zenimax HAD to attack Mojang. Trademark law demands you go to bat anytime you think your brand's being infringed upon or more vultures will come in and attack it. Though Mojang withdrew the trademark app, Zeni's gonna keep attacking until Mojang caves. Because the statutes say they MUST.
Wow, there's so much hyperbole and talking without knowing all the facts here. I read the kotaku post and all it gave me was a snippet of the alleged trademark and a lot of unnecessary vitriol toward notch. These things are easy to take out of context and I would really like to be able to see the whole thing before making any judgments on it.
However, for my own biased opinion, I prefer Mojang. I played Morrowwind and it kinda sucked. I also played Oblivion and it was sort of better, I guess. The Bethesda games I've played are nothing to write home about. I would choose Minecraft over Skyrim any day simply for the fact I'll get a lot more mileage out of it.
The excuse that Bethesda "has" to protect its own ass due to enforcing its own branding seems more of an argument against the trademark system than Mojang. Words...sheesh.
Protip: get the whole story before claiming anathema on anyone.
On one hand you have research and on the other you have statements made by one person--who is probably not giving the whole story.
As for your opinion. Oblivion is nothing compared to Morrowind--Oblivion is like morrowind lite that was ported over from console.
Protip: Practice reading comprehension and "get the whole story before claiming anathema on anyone."
but you have to type "ELDER" scrolls to find thier games,and regular people just type skyrim anyway
so how come bethesda haven't gone after 'Runes of Magic' publisher Runewaker? They are using the subtitle 'The Elder Kingdoms', which sounds almost exactly the same thing as The Elder Scrolls.
if and when Mahjong wins this lawsuit with Bethesda they should get the rights with Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim. the Reason bethedsa is making such claims is very ignorant an childesh so a game is named scrolls how many things do you know with te word scrolls in it? the dead sea scrolls for instance could make a lawsuit against bethesda for using the word Scroll in there name but Mahjong and other companies are smarter than that. I beleive that Christopher Weaver is upset that another company is making money the word "Scrolls" is so widly used that this lawsuit is a stupid choice for bethesda, i would have taken the settlement agreement aleast then they will have the ability to lose with dignity instead of being publicly humiliated. If Mahjong wins Skyrim will not be the game everyone wants anymore.... ive looked at the reports on both sides carefully. Mahjong has a higher rate of sucess against Bethesda due to its a smaller company and the name is "scrolls" not "elder scrolls" the logos look so much different from each other.
Mojang would have loosed anyways, Bethesda is better at playing Quake
How would you know that? Anyways, I think a lot of you guys are don't understand that Bethesda Softworks and Bethesda Game Studios are completely different.
[b]Notch has confirmed
...Some time into the proceedings, Notch offered to settle the dispute with a friendly [b]game of Quake 3[/b], a challenge which was not answered. The proposed solution was intended to ease any potential PR incidents, and provide an amicable solution to the dispute. The challenge went unanswered, and legal proceedings continued unabated.
Why does everyone focus on the the Quake 3 idea? Granted, this looks a little immature, but (as I've expressed before) was actually one of the only adult and proactive suggestions in the entire process. What I find ironic is that Mojang had previously offered to withdraw their application for a copyright on the word "Scrolls", which Zenimax/Bethesda refused to accept, but many people fail to remember or mention this part. Mojang's hands were already tied when Notch suggested the Quake 3 match.
Regardless, I stand by my orginal prognosis. The court will decide:
--that no infringement was made against Zenimax's/Bethesda's existing copyright.
--that it is not legal to copyright a non-coined word for use as a media title.
--that Mojang is free to use the word "Scrolls" for its upcoming title without copyright.
Then, I think Mojang will simply copyright a different title, like "Mojang's SCROLLS" to secure their market title.
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"To be. NO!--not to be! What was the question?" -Shakespeare for Teenagers
Whats funny is people think that the company that designed the game which is different then the company that sued mojang are dicks when really Tod Howard and Notch are friends thats why they put Notch's pick axe in the game...
Whats funny is people think that the company that designed the game which is different then the company that sued mojang are dicks when really Tod Howard and Notch are friends thats why they put Notch's pick axe in the game...
Absolutely true. I wouldn't doubt that somewhere in the mix, Bethesda expressed that they had no worries about the use of the title or desire to sue Mojang. That's probably why Mojang never got a direct answer when asked Zenimax why they were being sued. Kind of hard to explain in non-legal or non-legislative terms: "Well, our clients don't want to sue you, but we have total executive control of legal matters for their company. So, we're forcing them to sue you anyway."
And this is why lawyers are not issued firearms.
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"To be. NO!--not to be! What was the question?" -Shakespeare for Teenagers
Money changes everyone, not saying it has to him but it can turn the honest of men into ravaging lunatics.
But that's the thing, Notch doesn't have THAT much money and there's no indication he ever tried to weasel his way into Zenimax's pockets. All we have is a one page article off Kotaku by someone who knows as much about the situation (and trademark law) as the rest of us (i.e. none). The idea that a game called "Scrolls" might be confused with "The Elder Scrolls" is a little ridiculous, especially when the two are (from what we've heard) entirely different types of games. Even people who have had their head in the sand for the last 20 years have enough to go on to say "there's a definite chance these are two different things".
I think Some Zenimax lawyers somewhere decided that the system would allow there to be a brand dispute, went to enforce their brand, Notch responded in an unprofessional way (which is not exactly a bad thing, considering the frivolous nature of the claim) and some Kotaku writer blew things out of proportion.
On one hand you have research and on the other you have statements made by one person--who is probably not giving the whole story.
As for your opinion. Oblivion is nothing compared to Morrowind--Oblivion is like morrowind lite that was ported over from console.
Protip: Practice reading comprehension and "get the whole story before claiming anathema on anyone."
so how come bethesda haven't gone after 'Runes of Magic' publisher Runewaker? They are using the subtitle 'The Elder Kingdoms', which sounds almost exactly the same thing as The Elder Scrolls.
I think Mojang are an 'easy target'.
When I went to the PAX event, I checked out Skyrim its pretty good.
Obviously this is just a way to spotlight Skyrim. They wont have anything on Notch. Elders scrolls will always be different from Scrolls.
Its like saying, "Hey, nobody use the word: Of. That will make ppl get confused with World Of Warcraft "
its mojang D:
Why does everyone focus on the the Quake 3 idea? Granted, this looks a little immature, but (as I've expressed before) was actually one of the only adult and proactive suggestions in the entire process. What I find ironic is that Mojang had previously offered to withdraw their application for a copyright on the word "Scrolls", which Zenimax/Bethesda refused to accept, but many people fail to remember or mention this part. Mojang's hands were already tied when Notch suggested the Quake 3 match.
Regardless, I stand by my orginal prognosis. The court will decide:
--that no infringement was made against Zenimax's/Bethesda's existing copyright.
--that it is not legal to copyright a non-coined word for use as a media title.
--that Mojang is free to use the word "Scrolls" for its upcoming title without copyright.
Then, I think Mojang will simply copyright a different title, like "Mojang's SCROLLS" to secure their market title.
-Shakespeare for Teenagers
Venit, quessit, induravit.
Splitting hairs. Trademark is nothing more than copyright as it applies to a franchise instead of a single item. It's all the same copyright law.
Absolutely true. I wouldn't doubt that somewhere in the mix, Bethesda expressed that they had no worries about the use of the title or desire to sue Mojang. That's probably why Mojang never got a direct answer when asked Zenimax why they were being sued. Kind of hard to explain in non-legal or non-legislative terms: "Well, our clients don't want to sue you, but we have total executive control of legal matters for their company. So, we're forcing them to sue you anyway."
And this is why lawyers are not issued firearms.
-Shakespeare for Teenagers
what's the point? 2 games can have the same name. ( i still mope mojang wins though.)