that's very good, but when i use mods or anything that affects original minecraft, i feel uncomfortable for some reason. (except for optifine, of course.) includes what we are discussing right now. looks like the only thing i can do is hoping they will remove the temperature system.
Well, all we can do is pray that this will be added in a later version. I need bigger caves like the one in that screenshot.
Unfortunately, those aren't "real" caves, and based on this screenshot you can only enable/disable "real" caves, not change their size/frequency/etc, as any real world customizer should have; it is really extremely easy to change how many caves there are, and the size of cave systems; that is to say, I want settings that can do this:
Pre-1.7 cave generation; check out those cave systems!
1.7.x cave generation (same seed and location as above); I could probably explore every cave here in one day of playing:
(and again, what is up with the option to change the number of dungeons and lakes, but no other features? Hopefully they just didn't add controls for other stuff yet; also, you don't really need a separate on/off button cluttering the GUI; for example, cave frequency: (disabled)-1-100).
The most common, general complaint of the terrain is: "Everything looks the same! The world needs more variety Seen one world, you've seen them all!" Here is one of the treads discussing this topic: Terrain Seeds are Useless
Unless that problem is addressed, the complaints aren't going anywhere. This is basically a set of tools to customize the world how you want it. That doesn't address that one problem. Variety. Ever wonder why a lot of people liked old beta/alpha terrain better?
We all have different opinions on the terrain and why why think the way we do. Many of you might agree that isn't the only issue, whatever issues you might have with the current generation. Sure, if you want to turn a certain structure off or change the rarity, change the way a biome generates or something along those lines; this fixes that problem. But there is a handful of things some sliders can't change.
There will always be haters, no matter what you change or what kind of sliders we get, 100% of the community isn't going to be pleased.
It could fix nearly all the complaints if they add another pair of sliders:
Amplified Patches
Amplified Strips
Amplified as a world mode is a lot of what most people who miss the old stuff want back, but it has the issue that it's everywhere and thus there's no uniqueness to finding it. It has the further issue that it's not particularly processor-friendly. If, on the other hand, you could set Amplified terrain to happen to maybe every 100th chasm/cavern/'hill'/'mountain', you'd get relatively-normal terrain with an occasional super-canyon, mega-crater, or 'real' mountain - and since the bulk of the world is not amped up, it's actually an interesting find and the whole of it is more accessible to less 'beefy' machines.
This has somewhat been hinted at as a possibility with the new rare biome-variants, which can sometimes reach the top of the world. The key is to make it happen enough to be interesting, but not too much for computers to comfortably handle, nor so much that players see them enough to get bored of the national-park-worthy landmarks. Making it sliders would allow you to control all those elements so that it hits just the right spot for each player.
It could fix nearly all the complaints if they add another pair of sliders:
Amplified Patches
Amplified Strips
Amplified as a world mode is a lot of what most people who miss the old stuff want back, but it has the issue that it's everywhere and thus there's no uniqueness to finding it. It has the further issue that it's not particularly processor-friendly. If, on the other hand, you could set Amplified terrain to happen to maybe every 100th chasm/cavern/'hill'/'mountain', you'd get relatively-normal terrain with an occasional super-canyon, mega-crater, or 'real' mountain - and since the bulk of the world is not amped up, it's actually an interesting find and the whole of it is more accessible to less 'beefy' machines.
1) That completely misses the more nuance-y problems people had and have with the terrain generator. Admittedly, those would be somewhat livable if the main problem (lack of variety) were fixed.
2) That doesn't fix the variety issue. Everything would either be identical to normal terrain (which barely varies) or OMGWTFSUPERCRAZYMOUNTAINS. That's basically like what it was like back in r1.6 (where everything was either flat, a small hill created by x-hills, or a mountain if the biome is EH, Jungle Hills, or Ice Mountains) but slightly better since there's a somewhat better middle ground.
The key is to make it happen enough to be interesting, but not too much for computers to comfortably handle, nor so much that players see them enough to get bored of the national-park-worthy landmarks. Making it sliders would allow you to control all those elements so that it hits just the right spot for each player.
Yes, sliders will allow an individual player to customize their worlds to their liking. However, sliders fail quite a bit in two areas:
1) Sliders fail in SMP. I doubt I need to explain that.
2) Sliders fail if the person wants variety (though if someone wants variety, they're already screwed). Sliders would (almost certainly) force something to be universal across a world, which obviously isn't variety.
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Did something happen to you in your childhood to give you this unreasonable fear of rutabaga?
that is drool worthy... I hope to see this in for more customisable terrain types.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Yes, right. You're one of...those, Never understood why any self respecting Decepticon would choose automobile as his vehical mode when he could have flight." -Starscream
1) That completely misses the more nuance-y problems people had and have with the terrain generator. Admittedly, those would be somewhat livable if the main problem (lack of variety) were fixed.
You'll note I said the addition of these. I didn't mean to withdraw any of the existing ideas from that menu, and I think they address a number of the other details.
2) That doesn't fix the variety issue. Everything would either be identical to normal terrain (which barely varies) or OMGWTFSUPERCRAZYMOUNTAINS. That's basically like what it was like back in r1.6 (where everything was either flat, a small hill created by x-hills, or a mountain if the biome is EH, Jungle Hills, or Ice Mountains) but slightly better since there's a somewhat better middle ground.
There's a certain point where we wonder about the feasibility of getting a computer to randomly do cool stuff. If you want variety, reconsider how Amped works so that instead of frequency you're setting potential range - essentially your amped setting changes the maximum number generated for the height/depth/width of terrain features. Then you'd get variety - though it would truly still only be around 4 types of terrain generating in various sizes and shapes, sometimes overlapping each other.
1) Sliders fail in SMP. I doubt I need to explain that.
Perhaps. But if the person setting up the server can use those same sliders, it's not like (s)he can't use them to create an interesting world for everybody.
2) Sliders fail if the person wants variety (though if someone wants variety, they're already screwed). Sliders would (almost certainly) force something to be universal across a world, which obviously isn't variety.
Ultimately, a computer can't do variety.
All these programs do is run through the same routine over and over, and it can only create whatever somebody personally can set up instructions for and takes the time to imbed - and the more instructions, the longer it takes to create.
A lot of the coolest stuff in Minecraft over various versions (and even from the Worldpainter tool) comes from cranking up the caves/cavern routines and watching them tear chunks out of the normal landscape. If you want a cool, strange land with floating chunks of land, amazing cliffs, crazy waterfalls, and a lot of rough landscape to struggle over, it doesn't have to be hard to design. But, ultimately, even that will become familiar - because the computer is really doing the same thing many, many times.
Don't worry about the exact computer-lingo, but consider how you'd tell somebody to make the map you want. You can't use any comparisons to things out of game, nor subjective descriptors, and need to give them a set of instructions that will place every block in your world, and every world you'll ever play on. How many pages do you need to write to make it so that you'll never get bored, never feel like you're looking at the same old stuff, and be happy with every world? It's no easy thing. The sliders are the same as starting the instructions with, "Let me set a bunch of numbers each time. Then..."
that's very good, but when i use mods or anything that affects original minecraft, i feel uncomfortable for some reason. (except for optifine, of course.) includes what we are discussing right now. looks like the only thing i can do is hoping they will remove the temperature system.
Miner's nightmare preset
Miner's nightmare preset (original terrain)
Killing the Ender Dragon, no damage (no armor/potions/enchantments/pumpkin)
Unfortunately, those aren't "real" caves, and based on this screenshot you can only enable/disable "real" caves, not change their size/frequency/etc, as any real world customizer should have; it is really extremely easy to change how many caves there are, and the size of cave systems; that is to say, I want settings that can do this:
1.7.x cave generation (same seed and location as above); I could probably explore every cave here in one day of playing:
(and again, what is up with the option to change the number of dungeons and lakes, but no other features? Hopefully they just didn't add controls for other stuff yet; also, you don't really need a separate on/off button cluttering the GUI; for example, cave frequency: (disabled)-1-100).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
But that is AWESOME Cool.
And for that random thing, maybe have a slider for that to determine how random it actually is?
Play minecraft.
NOW
Unless that problem is addressed, the complaints aren't going anywhere. This is basically a set of tools to customize the world how you want it. That doesn't address that one problem. Variety. Ever wonder why a lot of people liked old beta/alpha terrain better?
We all have different opinions on the terrain and why why think the way we do. Many of you might agree that isn't the only issue, whatever issues you might have with the current generation. Sure, if you want to turn a certain structure off or change the rarity, change the way a biome generates or something along those lines; this fixes that problem. But there is a handful of things some sliders can't change.
There will always be haters, no matter what you change or what kind of sliders we get, 100% of the community isn't going to be pleased.
Amplified Patches
Amplified Strips
Amplified as a world mode is a lot of what most people who miss the old stuff want back, but it has the issue that it's everywhere and thus there's no uniqueness to finding it. It has the further issue that it's not particularly processor-friendly. If, on the other hand, you could set Amplified terrain to happen to maybe every 100th chasm/cavern/'hill'/'mountain', you'd get relatively-normal terrain with an occasional super-canyon, mega-crater, or 'real' mountain - and since the bulk of the world is not amped up, it's actually an interesting find and the whole of it is more accessible to less 'beefy' machines.
This has somewhat been hinted at as a possibility with the new rare biome-variants, which can sometimes reach the top of the world. The key is to make it happen enough to be interesting, but not too much for computers to comfortably handle, nor so much that players see them enough to get bored of the national-park-worthy landmarks. Making it sliders would allow you to control all those elements so that it hits just the right spot for each player.
1) That completely misses the more nuance-y problems people had and have with the terrain generator. Admittedly, those would be somewhat livable if the main problem (lack of variety) were fixed.
2) That doesn't fix the variety issue. Everything would either be identical to normal terrain (which barely varies) or OMGWTFSUPERCRAZYMOUNTAINS. That's basically like what it was like back in r1.6 (where everything was either flat, a small hill created by x-hills, or a mountain if the biome is EH, Jungle Hills, or Ice Mountains) but slightly better since there's a somewhat better middle ground.
Yes, sliders will allow an individual player to customize their worlds to their liking. However, sliders fail quite a bit in two areas:
1) Sliders fail in SMP. I doubt I need to explain that.
2) Sliders fail if the person wants variety (though if someone wants variety, they're already screwed). Sliders would (almost certainly) force something to be universal across a world, which obviously isn't variety.
You'll note I said the addition of these. I didn't mean to withdraw any of the existing ideas from that menu, and I think they address a number of the other details.
There's a certain point where we wonder about the feasibility of getting a computer to randomly do cool stuff. If you want variety, reconsider how Amped works so that instead of frequency you're setting potential range - essentially your amped setting changes the maximum number generated for the height/depth/width of terrain features. Then you'd get variety - though it would truly still only be around 4 types of terrain generating in various sizes and shapes, sometimes overlapping each other.
Perhaps. But if the person setting up the server can use those same sliders, it's not like (s)he can't use them to create an interesting world for everybody.
Ultimately, a computer can't do variety.
All these programs do is run through the same routine over and over, and it can only create whatever somebody personally can set up instructions for and takes the time to imbed - and the more instructions, the longer it takes to create.
A lot of the coolest stuff in Minecraft over various versions (and even from the Worldpainter tool) comes from cranking up the caves/cavern routines and watching them tear chunks out of the normal landscape. If you want a cool, strange land with floating chunks of land, amazing cliffs, crazy waterfalls, and a lot of rough landscape to struggle over, it doesn't have to be hard to design. But, ultimately, even that will become familiar - because the computer is really doing the same thing many, many times.
Don't worry about the exact computer-lingo, but consider how you'd tell somebody to make the map you want. You can't use any comparisons to things out of game, nor subjective descriptors, and need to give them a set of instructions that will place every block in your world, and every world you'll ever play on. How many pages do you need to write to make it so that you'll never get bored, never feel like you're looking at the same old stuff, and be happy with every world? It's no easy thing. The sliders are the same as starting the instructions with, "Let me set a bunch of numbers each time. Then..."
Floating sky islands.
Giant mountains.
Floating sky islands.
Large caves.
Ocean islands.
Lava oceans.
Floating sky islands.
Floating sky islands.
They are adding it.
Woo hoo it's in the game (kind of). Yay.
Play minecraft.
NOW