I hear a lot of complaining about the implemented hunger system. The idea of hunger sounds ridiculous to many players, so why add it to Minecraft? Here are some common complaints that I have seen:
1. "Minecraft shouldn't be realistic."
The realism card is always brought up. Why though? Whether you realize it or not, we have many elements in Minecraft that are directly based off of real life. Pigs, sheep, cows, wolves, caves, mountains, lakes, and gravity are all in Minecraft. Yet, we don't complain about them. The reason why is because it's familiar; it's easy to understand the concept of all these things. Similarly, it's easy to understand the concept of hunger. You need to eat or you will die. So why do people complain about this? Simply put, whether hunger is based off of realism or not is not the point. People who loath the new hunger system loath it because it "restricts them" or "adds nothing to the game", not because hunger is based off an aspect of reality. Those who say that hunger should not be added to Minecraft because it is too realistic are simply making bad excuses. The issue of whether more realistic concepts should be added to Minecraft does not pertain here.
2. "Hunger is just a tedious chore."
Unlike the last reason, a decent reason why people dislike the hunger system is because it's a "tedious" chore. That's a logical argument. Since the dawn of Minecraft hunger never existed. So why do we have to eat now every once in a while to replenish some "food meter"? Let's be honest here, dying of starvation should never be a problem. It's very easy to get food now, it's very easy to bring a lot with you, and it's also very easy to replenish your meter. You are a terrible player if you have trouble keeping that meter full. But why does the food meter even exist in the first place? The answer lies in the new health regeneration system.The reason why people try to keep their meters full is so they can replenish their health. Regenerating health now works A LOT differently. Hunger is not a tedious chore because hunger now indirectly influences your health regeneration. There is no other way to heal your health other than to keep that meter full. So in fact, the hunger meter is now an important chore because it helps keep your health up.
I wouldn't say this new health regain system is better or worse than the last system (simply bringing food and eating it when your health gets low) but it certainly is more complex and most certainly, exciting. Whether you like or hate the hunger system is your choice, but it is definitely not a "tedious" chore. (Well, tedious to some degree. Like mining a vein of coal)
3. "Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay."
On the contrary it does. Hunger adds a lot to the gameplay now. As said before, food now indirectly heals you. Gameplay wise, this forces the player to be extra careful about fighting enemies. In 1.7, if you had enough food, you could usually just fight a bunch of enemies, eat some pork, then continue fighting. While that tactic and system worked, it was honestly silly. All you had to do was fight, scroll to pork, right click, then keep fighting. If there was a break in fighting, it would be even easier to stay alive if you had food with you. In the new system, 3 full stacks of pork won't be able to save you if you're cornered by a zombie, or if three skeletons get the jump on you. If any of those situations occurred, you deserve to die for not being more careful. Pre 1.8, surviving involved switching to pork as quickly as you can so you can eat it. In 1.8, you are now forced to avoid high concentrated damage by enemies. As long as your food meter is full, you can survive one or two spider bites or one swipe by a zombie and not worry about it. However, getting caught off guard is now very dangerous compared to pre 1.8 because your health simply can't regenerate faster than the enemy can attack you.
So what does this do? 1.8 now makes you more careful in dealing with situations and not charging blindly, because you're not a tank anymore; more of a passive healer. Players might also worry about bringing the right type of food with them. If one brings cooked chicken, he might find himself eating a lot trying to keep the meter full. If one brings pork instead, there might be long intervals between meals. (If one does not want to waste the full potential of each individual meat) I am not arguing that this system is better or that the last system was horrible. Both of them work extremely well, but I feel this new system is more challenging and fresh.
I created this thread in hopes I could explain some bad reasoning behind the "hunger is horrible" threads. However, I also wanted those who hate the hunger system, to try fiddling around with it again. Change is not as bad as most people think.
I like hunger...it gives me something to do now :smile.gif: I want the game to be WAY more challenging in the future which i think notch is going to do so i am happy :tongue.gif:
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I'll admit I like hunger now. I had assumed it would **** me off until I realized bread was stack able.
I also find the new bow mechanics to be a lot more exciting...backing away from the creeper in order to get a good two shots off on it is more fun than clicking 5 times.
I agree, hunger does add an aspect to the game that is both realistic and fitting to a video game. The only thing that pisses me off is that taking damage makes you hungrier... I know not everything is logical in minecraft, but this really doesnt fit to me.
It's funny how some people cried about Mojang taking survival away, and what they don't realize is that by adding a hunger bar they made survival even better. And I agree with the OP on everything, especially if someone can't keep that meter full AND complaining about the hunger bar, then they are playing the game wrong.
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I tried once, I tried twice, I am done
I am the once now and irreplaceable son
If you are so sure it's a brilliant mechanic, then just leave these discussions alone, as surely Notch will not change it. You have nothing to fear.
But this ongoing personal attack on people for expressing their opinion on the changes is childish and stupid. And chock full of elitist comments about people not knowing how to play properly. Get over yourselves if you think that.
They have a right to their opinion. Your opinion is not 100% certain truth and reality. Nor is Notch's.
Saying that someone is "playing the game wrong" is not only vacuous, but needlessly incendiary.
Brilliantly put. People often accuse me of purposely using too many "big words" to try to sound smart, etc.. but you just put me to shame. You said everything I wanted to say, in depth, with one simple sentence. Bravo. Unfortunately, I bet it goes right over the head of most here. It's too smart.
I spend 30-40% of my time planting, harvesting, and crafting food I wouldn't otherwise need so that I can continue mining in my perfectly safe and well lit tunnels. This update adds nothing fun to the game for me. It's just time spent not playing the fun part of the game. Therefore it's bad. I rarely if ever take damage so whether my health regenerates slowly or instantly means absolutely nothing to me. What does matter to me is that now instead of being able to carry that much more cobble/dirt/tools I have to lug around a work bench mushrooms/wheat so that I don't die while mining.
This is the most boring/tedious/aggravating update I've ever seen to a video game ever. Okay, I take that back. The Spy/Sniper update for TF2 caused a few more forehead injuries but this takes the cake for Minecraft by a large margin.
I spend 30-40% of my time planting, harvesting, and crafting food I wouldn't otherwise need so that I can continue mining in my perfectly safe and well lit tunnels. This update adds nothing fun to the game for me. It's just time spent not playing the fun part of the game. Therefore it's bad. I rarely if ever take damage so whether my health regenerates slowly or instantly means absolutely nothing to me. What does matter to me is that now instead of being able to carry that much more cobble/dirt/tools I have to lug around a work bench mushrooms/wheat so that I don't die while mining.
This is the most boring/tedious/aggravating update I've ever seen to a video game ever. Okay, I take that back. The Spy/Sniper update for TF2 caused a few more forehead injuries but this takes the cake for Minecraft by a large margin.
I'm sorry, but if you take 30-40% of your playing time to get food you are doing some SEVERELY wrong. It takes me about 2 minutes of fishing for example to get enough fish to not die of hunger in a cave for AT LEAST an hour.
I hear a lot of complaining about the implemented hunger system. The idea of hunger sounds ridiculous to many players, so why add it to Minecraft? Here are some common complaints that I have seen:
1. Minecraft shouldn't be realistic.
The realism card is always brought up. Why though? Whether you realize it or not, we have many elements in Minecraft that are directly based off of real life. Pigs, sheep, cows, wolves, caves, mountains, lakes, and gravity are all in Minecraft. Yet, we don't complain about them. The reason why is because it's familiar; it's easy to understand the concept of all these things. Similarly, it's easy to understand the concept of hunger. You need to eat or you will die. So why do people complain about this? Simply put, whether hunger is based off of realism or not is not the point. People who loath the new hunger system loath it because it "restricts them" or "adds nothing to the game", not because hunger is based off an aspect of reality. Those who say that hunger should not be added to Minecraft because it is too realistic are simply making bad excuses. The issue of whether more realistic concepts should be added to Minecraft does not pertain here.
2. Hunger is just a tedious chore.
Unlike the last reason, a decent reason why people dislike the hunger system is because it's a "tedious" chore. That's a logical argument. Since the dawn of Minecraft hunger never existed. So why do we have to eat now every once in a while to replenish some "food meter"? Let's be honest here, dying of starvation should never be a problem. It's very easy to get food now, it's very easy to bring a lot with you, and it's also very easy to replenish your meter. You are a terrible player if you have trouble keeping that meter full. But why does the food meter even exist in the first place? The answer lies in the new health regeneration system.The reason why people try to keep their meters full is so they can replenish their health. Regenerating health now works A LOT differently. Hunger is not a tedious chore because hunger now indirectly influences your health regeneration. There is no other way to heal your health other than to keep that meter full. So in fact, the hunger meter is now an important chore because it helps keep your health up.
I wouldn't say this new health regain system is better or worse than the last system (simply bringing food and eating it when your health gets low) but it certainly is more complex and most certainly, exciting. Whether you like or hate the hunger system is your choice, but it is definitely not a "tedious" chore. (Well, tedious to some degree. Like mining a vein of coal)
3. Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay.
On the contrary it does. Hunger adds a lot to the gameplay now. As said before, food now indirectly heals you. Gameplay wise, this forces the player to be extra careful about fighting enemies. In 1.7, if you had enough food, you could usually just fight a bunch of enemies, eat some pork, then continue fighting. While that tactic and system worked, it was honestly silly. All you had to do was fight, scroll to pork, right click, then keep fighting. If there was a break in fighting, it would be even easier to stay alive if you had food with you. In the new system, 3 full stacks of pork won't be able to save you if you're cornered by a zombie, or if three skeletons get the jump on you. If any of those situations occurred, you deserve to die for not being more careful. Pre 1.8, surviving involved switching to pork as quickly as you can so you can eat it. In 1.8, you are now forced to avoid high concentrated damage by enemies. As long as your food meter is full, you can survive one or two spider bites or one swipe by a zombie and not worry about it. However, getting caught off guard is now very dangerous compared to pre 1.8 because your health simply can't regenerate faster than the enemy can attack you.
So what does this do? 1.8 now makes you more careful in dealing with situations and not charging blindly, because you're not a tank anymore; more of a passive healer. Players might also worry about bringing the right type of food with them. If one brings cooked chicken, he might find himself eating a lot trying to keep the meter full. If one brings pork instead, there might be long intervals between meals. (If one does not want to waste the full potential of each individual meat) I am not arguing that this system is better or that the last system was horrible. Both of them work extremely well, but I feel this new system is more challenging and fresh.
I created this thread in hopes I could explain some bad reasoning behind the "hunger is horrible" threads. However, I also wanted those who hate the hunger system, to try fiddling around with it again. Change is not as bad as most people think.
Sometimes you just meet a post that is so elequently worded you must speak up, this is one of those times.
I'm sorry, but if you take 30-40% of your playing time to get food you are doing some SEVERELY wrong. It takes me about 2 minutes of fishing for example to get enough fish to not die of hunger in a cave for AT LEAST an hour.
I have 1 small plot for wheat, 1 small plot of melons, a chicken coop, and i fish. I spend like 10 minutes securing food in droves and then go mining for hours and don't even think twice about it, even as I eat. I always take more than I need, too...
I think part of the hunger system disdain comes from an insecurity with understanding the system. As the players get used to having to eat they will begin to accept it, and like it. Or at least stop complaining about it.
This particular eating system, I think, is the best I have ever played in any game, ever. Keeping a well maintained farm just adds to the fun for me. Hunting is great too because I have to sail for days across oceans to find animals and I see a lot of cool stuff on the way.
Which is why there's 'creative' mode. Fly around and place infinite blocks! No worries!
2. Hunger is just a tedious chore.
Know what else is a tedious chore? Having to mine all those bricks I want to use to build something and... oh wait, CREATIVE MODE!
3. Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay.
I think it gives you a real reason to go back to your 'base' instead of spending infinite time underground. The new health system comes in tandem with the hunger system. I'm sure you'll eventually be able to mode in 'old school' food and remove the hunger system. Oh and turn in your ability to sprint too, because that's also linked to the hunger system.
I think the hunger system is great. If you feel that it's making the game 'tedious' then turn on creative mode.
Now, let's try approaching this with a more 'positive feedback' approach.
Suggestion: Remove the hunger bar in 'peaceful' mode. <-- How hard was that?
I spend 30-40% of my time planting, harvesting, and crafting food I wouldn't otherwise need so that I can continue mining in my perfectly safe and well lit tunnels. This update adds nothing fun to the game for me. It's just time spent not playing the fun part of the game. Therefore it's bad. I rarely if ever take damage so whether my health regenerates slowly or instantly means absolutely nothing to me. What does matter to me is that now instead of being able to carry that much more cobble/dirt/tools I have to lug around a work bench mushrooms/wheat so that I don't die while mining.
This is the most boring/tedious/aggravating update I've ever seen to a video game ever. Okay, I take that back. The Spy/Sniper update for TF2 caused a few more forehead injuries but this takes the cake for Minecraft by a large margin.
30-40% is a lot of time spent gathering food. Planting and harvesting should be easy and relatively quick to do. Gathering food from animals is even easier now that cows and chicken drop meat. Whatever way you are using to gather food, it is probably one of the least effective methods out there.
Even if you rarely get damaged, it is still unwise to not bring food with you, pre and post 1.8. As a bonus, it only takes up one space now so you can have 10+ porkchops in one slot. Of course, you will have to eat from time to time even if your health is full. It's a tradeoff. Food now takes up far less space but you have to eat it more often. That shouldn't be a big deal.
Which is why there's 'creative' mode. Fly around and place infinite blocks! No worries!
2. Hunger is just a tedious chore.
Know what else is a tedious chore? Having to mine all those bricks I want to use to build something and... oh wait, CREATIVE MODE!
3. Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay.
I think it gives you a real reason to go back to your 'base' instead of spending infinite time underground. The new health system comes in tandem with the hunger system. I'm sure you'll eventually be able to mode in 'old school' food and remove the hunger system. Oh and turn in your ability to sprint too, because that's also linked to the hunger system.
I think the hunger system is great. If you feel that it's making the game 'tedious' then turn on creative mode.
Now, let's try approaching this with a more 'positive feedback' approach.
Suggestion: Remove the hunger bar in 'peaceful' mode. <-- How hard was that?
Are you addressing me? If you are, please read my post before commenting.
The hunger system is pretty much what I couldn't wait for this update. Granted, all of the highlights talked about a month ago and what actually came out are all cool respectively, but the hunger part is what stood out for me. I fell in love with Minecraft because of the survival mode and how tedious or outrageous it could get. This adds such a huge element for me, because it has really set Minecraft far apart from any other games that could try and be like it, past, present, and probably future.
I'm sure though, if you qq hard enough, Notch will make it a toggle.
Personally, sometimes mining for an hour can get a bit dry, so having to farm, fish, or build elaborate water matrixes to auto-harvest are tons of fun.
In general I like the new hunger / health system. It adds quite a lot of challenge in combat and it makes the combat, well more combat like. It forces player to retreat and use the terrain more to their advance. Especially when facing those angry little spiders!
But I think it needs a bit tweaking. I haven't played that lot with 1.8 yet, but if I remember correctly the health doesn't regenerate if you are missing 2 full "points" in you hunger meter. Now that leaves 8 "points" that have really no purpose at all. After they are used up, you are going to starve to death, but before that... They just sit there doing nothing. I think the healing should be more gradual. Like if you have something like 5 points in your hunger meter you would heal, but extremely slowly and the fuller it gets the faster you heal.
That sounds like a good idea to help tone down some of the hunger hate.
It also IS survival mode. They should just make it an option for those who dislike the idea. There is plenty of food now (even zombie flesh) and I think it is a way to counter sprinting all the time. Drinking bar sounds like a good idea too and of course should be under advanced options. What I want to see is a greater variety of mobs. EXP will most likely increase your attack damage and resilence so I think rather than increasing the damage of the already made monsters they should just add in more common surface monsters, stronger monster depending on days, rare elite spawns (jockey), as well as rare daylight spawns of easier creatures for instance maybe giant crabs/scorpians spawn on sand with little health after day 1. Water based mobs and biome based mobs say for instance snakes/lizards in the swarm area or yetis/polar bears/evil snow men in the snow area. I got tired of seeing the say shades of green and white and feel that seeing a creeper should be less common and more OMG AAHHHHHH sprint sprint.
1. "Minecraft shouldn't be realistic."
The realism card is always brought up. Why though? Whether you realize it or not, we have many elements in Minecraft that are directly based off of real life. Pigs, sheep, cows, wolves, caves, mountains, lakes, and gravity are all in Minecraft. Yet, we don't complain about them. The reason why is because it's familiar; it's easy to understand the concept of all these things. Similarly, it's easy to understand the concept of hunger. You need to eat or you will die. So why do people complain about this? Simply put, whether hunger is based off of realism or not is not the point. People who loath the new hunger system loath it because it "restricts them" or "adds nothing to the game", not because hunger is based off an aspect of reality. Those who say that hunger should not be added to Minecraft because it is too realistic are simply making bad excuses. The issue of whether more realistic concepts should be added to Minecraft does not pertain here.
2. "Hunger is just a tedious chore."
Unlike the last reason, a decent reason why people dislike the hunger system is because it's a "tedious" chore. That's a logical argument. Since the dawn of Minecraft hunger never existed. So why do we have to eat now every once in a while to replenish some "food meter"? Let's be honest here, dying of starvation should never be a problem. It's very easy to get food now, it's very easy to bring a lot with you, and it's also very easy to replenish your meter. You are a terrible player if you have trouble keeping that meter full. But why does the food meter even exist in the first place? The answer lies in the new health regeneration system.The reason why people try to keep their meters full is so they can replenish their health. Regenerating health now works A LOT differently. Hunger is not a tedious chore because hunger now indirectly influences your health regeneration. There is no other way to heal your health other than to keep that meter full. So in fact, the hunger meter is now an important chore because it helps keep your health up.
I wouldn't say this new health regain system is better or worse than the last system (simply bringing food and eating it when your health gets low) but it certainly is more complex and most certainly, exciting. Whether you like or hate the hunger system is your choice, but it is definitely not a "tedious" chore. (Well, tedious to some degree. Like mining a vein of coal)
3. "Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay."
On the contrary it does. Hunger adds a lot to the gameplay now. As said before, food now indirectly heals you. Gameplay wise, this forces the player to be extra careful about fighting enemies. In 1.7, if you had enough food, you could usually just fight a bunch of enemies, eat some pork, then continue fighting. While that tactic and system worked, it was honestly silly. All you had to do was fight, scroll to pork, right click, then keep fighting. If there was a break in fighting, it would be even easier to stay alive if you had food with you. In the new system, 3 full stacks of pork won't be able to save you if you're cornered by a zombie, or if three skeletons get the jump on you. If any of those situations occurred, you deserve to die for not being more careful. Pre 1.8, surviving involved switching to pork as quickly as you can so you can eat it. In 1.8, you are now forced to avoid high concentrated damage by enemies. As long as your food meter is full, you can survive one or two spider bites or one swipe by a zombie and not worry about it. However, getting caught off guard is now very dangerous compared to pre 1.8 because your health simply can't regenerate faster than the enemy can attack you.
So what does this do? 1.8 now makes you more careful in dealing with situations and not charging blindly, because you're not a tank anymore; more of a passive healer. Players might also worry about bringing the right type of food with them. If one brings cooked chicken, he might find himself eating a lot trying to keep the meter full. If one brings pork instead, there might be long intervals between meals. (If one does not want to waste the full potential of each individual meat) I am not arguing that this system is better or that the last system was horrible. Both of them work extremely well, but I feel this new system is more challenging and fresh.
I created this thread in hopes I could explain some bad reasoning behind the "hunger is horrible" threads. However, I also wanted those who hate the hunger system, to try fiddling around with it again. Change is not as bad as most people think.
I also find the new bow mechanics to be a lot more exciting...backing away from the creeper in order to get a good two shots off on it is more fun than clicking 5 times.
I am the once now and irreplaceable son
If you are so sure it's a brilliant mechanic, then just leave these discussions alone, as surely Notch will not change it. You have nothing to fear.
But this ongoing personal attack on people for expressing their opinion on the changes is childish and stupid. And chock full of elitist comments about people not knowing how to play properly. Get over yourselves if you think that.
They have a right to their opinion. Your opinion is not 100% certain truth and reality. Nor is Notch's.
Brilliantly put. People often accuse me of purposely using too many "big words" to try to sound smart, etc.. but you just put me to shame. You said everything I wanted to say, in depth, with one simple sentence. Bravo. Unfortunately, I bet it goes right over the head of most here. It's too smart.
You deserve a cookie for having a sentence containing two words that I actually had to think about when reading them.
And your bird can swing
But you can't hear me
You can't hear me
This is the most boring/tedious/aggravating update I've ever seen to a video game ever. Okay, I take that back. The Spy/Sniper update for TF2 caused a few more forehead injuries but this takes the cake for Minecraft by a large margin.
I'm sorry, but if you take 30-40% of your playing time to get food you are doing some SEVERELY wrong. It takes me about 2 minutes of fishing for example to get enough fish to not die of hunger in a cave for AT LEAST an hour.
Sometimes you just meet a post that is so elequently worded you must speak up, this is one of those times.
I have 1 small plot for wheat, 1 small plot of melons, a chicken coop, and i fish. I spend like 10 minutes securing food in droves and then go mining for hours and don't even think twice about it, even as I eat. I always take more than I need, too...
I think part of the hunger system disdain comes from an insecurity with understanding the system. As the players get used to having to eat they will begin to accept it, and like it. Or at least stop complaining about it.
This particular eating system, I think, is the best I have ever played in any game, ever. Keeping a well maintained farm just adds to the fun for me. Hunting is great too because I have to sail for days across oceans to find animals and I see a lot of cool stuff on the way.
Well done mojang, well said OP.
Which is why there's 'creative' mode. Fly around and place infinite blocks! No worries!
2. Hunger is just a tedious chore.
Know what else is a tedious chore? Having to mine all those bricks I want to use to build something and... oh wait, CREATIVE MODE!
3. Hunger adds nothing to the gameplay.
I think it gives you a real reason to go back to your 'base' instead of spending infinite time underground. The new health system comes in tandem with the hunger system. I'm sure you'll eventually be able to mode in 'old school' food and remove the hunger system. Oh and turn in your ability to sprint too, because that's also linked to the hunger system.
I think the hunger system is great. If you feel that it's making the game 'tedious' then turn on creative mode.
Now, let's try approaching this with a more 'positive feedback' approach.
Suggestion: Remove the hunger bar in 'peaceful' mode. <-- How hard was that?
30-40% is a lot of time spent gathering food. Planting and harvesting should be easy and relatively quick to do. Gathering food from animals is even easier now that cows and chicken drop meat. Whatever way you are using to gather food, it is probably one of the least effective methods out there.
Even if you rarely get damaged, it is still unwise to not bring food with you, pre and post 1.8. As a bonus, it only takes up one space now so you can have 10+ porkchops in one slot. Of course, you will have to eat from time to time even if your health is full. It's a tradeoff. Food now takes up far less space but you have to eat it more often. That shouldn't be a big deal.
Are you addressing me? If you are, please read my post before commenting.
*Added quotation marks
I'm sure though, if you qq hard enough, Notch will make it a toggle.
Personally, sometimes mining for an hour can get a bit dry, so having to farm, fish, or build elaborate water matrixes to auto-harvest are tons of fun.
That sounds like a good idea to help tone down some of the hunger hate.