actually...it does if your survival is dependent on it...jus sayin...I know when I think of survival (particularly something like wilderness survival) I think of food/water, shelter, etc...so, it DOES make sense...
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MINECRAFT IS IN BETA...WE ARE BETA-TESTING. it's platforming...not parkour <<
actually...it does if your survival is dependent on it...jus sayin...I know when I think of survival (particularly something like wilderness survival) I think of food/water, shelter, etc...so, it DOES make sense...
Fallout: New Vegas featured a "Hunger" type of survival aspect in the game's "Hardcore" difficulty setting. You could also turn this off if you did not want to keep up with the additional variables. The Hardcore option was likely made optional because the previous Fallout installments did not feature such a gameplay aspect. Minecraft is the same way, it has existed long enough for entire communities and game-types to be created/invented that did not incorporate a then-unknown mechanic. Hunger should not suddenly be made mandatory, if anything it should be on an on/off toggle or should only kick in when the game is played on harder difficulties.
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The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
You are quick to label everything as maintenance. Maintenance is the least aspect of the hunger. It is a resource to manage, it is a revolutionized healing mechanic, it allows numerous other mechanics to function. The only maintenance impact it has is a couple of seconds on occasion to eat. Spawning on an island with aa single tree is an interesting experience now. Instead of an inconvience untilyou can build a wood supply up, you have a genuine challenge of "how do I get enough food". It is doable, but a real concern until you can set up your resources.
I've written out a detailed analysis and explanation here: Why hunger works for minecraft
Hunger could have been a simple maintenance task, and I was against hunger initially because of it. But after seeing how it works, I had to change my mind.
It is FACT. I can confirm, in an interview of Notch (it is him), that Hunger bar WILL NOT BE OPTIONAL AT ALL.
My opinion: I expected this. Notch as I've openly stated, does not know how to design games. He designs them like toys, they're fun, he wants them, he takes them and puts them into his little world. You don't exist, only he does. Simple really, whether we like it or not.
Please, be constructive in your flaming of this, and don't curse, rant, scream, but explain why you think this is a bad idea. :smile.gif:
-shrugs- he's making a game he'd like to play, sorta his option when you decide to make your own game without having to worry about investors, sure it'll be more niche, but the fans will love it even more.
I'll agree with that. I stated in a previous thread a mantra I follow seeing as how I design and do conceptual work for games myself. When you're looking at adding new features to an existing game that has had ample time to establish its own community and flavor, you have to be a little more careful than you do if you're making something brand new.
You have to look at every addition and ask yourself "If I add this, will there be a community-mod created to deactivate it or turn this feature off?". If the answer to that question is "YES" then you have to really take a look at why you think that might be. Hunger is retarded, it's out of place in Minecraft. If Hunger was a part of the game since day 1 there might not be so much animosity but it completely turns the existing concept of the game upside-down. It's simply yet another chore to keep up with, and the way health is restored is just ridiculous now.
You should never -- never -- design a game and be placid with knowing that all you're adding amounts to something someone is going to find a way to turn off. Hello? That's wasted effort and wasted time. If hunger is so broken and messed up right now all the time spent working on that worthless addition could have been funneled into other things like tweaking Endermen, etc.
I'm not going to sugar-coat anything, Mojang really dropped the ball with this update. There are some positives that came out with 1.8, but they are far far overshadowed by careless oversights on par with the lack of quality control exhibited by companies like EA and Activision these days.
A well thought out post, bit you missed one HUGE underlying facet of this.
The biggest and single most important factor governing the design.
The game is not even near its conceptual mechanics yet. It's only barely starting to finish up with basic aspects of the game and getting into the meat of its design, which means a ton is going to change, and there is nothing that can be done to change that. Are you suggesting he should tether his foot by the wants of people that do not want him to finish the product he is designing? We have no say here and your design concept is extremely naive. Notch used an unconvential release strategy, so your 'design philosophy' does not count here. He released the game before it was even in Alpha. BEFORE ALPHA. He told us we could play it while he designed it, and that it would change dramatically over the course of his events. So explain to me again how your logic makes sense. As an analogy, let me explain what you've said:
Someone is building a house. They get just barely halfway done making it, and some people decide they really like it and move in right away because the house designer allows them to. He moves to start completing the house, putting in walls, a ceiling, etc... and the people in the house (also not the only people who are going to be living there) start complaining that they like it better without walls etc. So the designer continues to finish the house, and they get enraged and say that they should have the right to CHOOSE if the house is finished or not since they already got there. The designer laughs and thinks to himself... I said you could move in early, I didn't say you could have a half built house.
A well thought out post, bit you missed one HUGE underlying facet of this.
The biggest and single most important factor governing the design.
The game is not even near its conceptual mechanics yet. It's only barely starting to finish up with basic aspects of the game and getting into the meat of its design, which means a ton is going to change, and there is nothing that can be done to change that. Are you suggesting he should tether his foot by the wants of people that do not want him to finish the product he is designing? We have no say here and your design concept is extremely naive. Notch used an unconvential release strategy, so your 'design philosophy' does not count here. He released the game before it was even in Alpha. BEFORE ALPHA. He told us we could play it while he designed it, and that it would change dramatically over the course of his events. So explain to me again how your logic makes sense. As an analogy, let me explain what you've said:
Someone is building a house. They get just barely halfway done making it, and some people decide they really like it and move in right away because the house designer allows them to. He moves to start completing the house, putting in walls, a ceiling, etc... and the people in the house (also not the only people who are going to be living there) start complaining that they like it better without walls etc. So the designer continues to finish the house, and they get enraged and say that they should have the right to CHOOSE if the house is finished or not since they already got there. The designer laughs and thinks to himself... I said you could move in early, I didn't say you could have a half built house.
Think about it.
A better analogy would be an apartment building. Just becuase you don't want walls, or find that the lack of a ceiling is great for sleeping under the stars, does not mean the should not finish the apartment complex, since everyone else may not appreciate the extra ventilation.
A better analogy would be an apartment building. Just becuase you don't want walls, or find that the lack of a ceiling is great for sleeping under the stars, does not mean the should not finish the apartment complex, since everyone else may not appreciate the extra ventilation.
I actually had the same thought when I was nearly done but didn't want to rewrite it :tongue.gif:
The point is: being allowed to see something and use it before it is done does not entitle you to get to complain about how it is being made. It is not bad design on the designers part. The guy I responded to claimed to be a designer but was not even able to grasp that, and I, as someone who has in fact designed about half a dozen games and played quite possibly over 500 games in his life, staunchly disagree. I actually READ design philosophies of designers over at places like Wizard of the Coast, and am always involved in new game betas and release tests, and have been heavily involved in design discussions relating to many franchises as they were being released over the last 10 years.
I actually had the same thought when I was nearly done but didn't want to rewrite it :tongue.gif:
The point is: being allowed to see something and use it before it is done does not entitle you to get to complain about how it is being made. It is not bad design on the designers part. The guy I responded to claimed to be a designer but was not even able to grasp that, and I, as someone who has in fact designed about half a dozen games and played quite possibly over 500 games in his life, staunchly disagree. I actually READ design philosophies of designers over at places like Wizard of the Coast, and am always involved in new game betas and release tests, and have been heavily involved in design discussions relating to many franchises as they were being released over the last 10 years.
It's not necessarily complaining, it's input. It's essentially the player base offering up their input as to what would make the game better or more fun for them. The community won't always be right, and Notch is of course free to ignore them, but ignoring your fans, the people who will play your game, is not necessarily a smart decision.
What the guy you responded to was saying is that Notch should really consider whether what he wants to do is the right thing to do for a game that already has a large player base. Doubtless people will jump down my throat about this, but Minecraft is not your traditional Beta. I would say the patches in Minecraft are more akin to patches in large MMOs than they are to the nightly tests builds of a game that's mostly trying to catch bugs. People don't view Minecraft as an unfinished product, they view it more as an expanding game. I can't speak for the entire community of course, but the general response on the forums tends to suggest that this is the case.
As far as Notch's vision is concerned, the simple truth is that very few people care anymore, if they ever did, and the huge modding community only serves to exacerbate this. People can make Minecraft whatever they want it to be; it's no longer Notch's game, it's our game. If Notch continues to veer away from what most people think of as "their Minecraft", I suspect mods are going to become larger and more game changing. It'll be interesting to see how many Minecraft clones (by this I mean the building games most of us think of as Minecrafty) pop up in the next few years and what quality they will be.
Anyway, not sure where that post ended up. Generally just wanted to say Minecraft is becoming less Minecrafty to most of us and it's kind of saddening.
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Stupid people say stupid things. Sometimes smart people say stupid things too. It's when the stupid people say smart things that life gets interesting.
A well thought out post, bit you missed one HUGE underlying facet of this.
The biggest and single most important factor governing the design.
The game is not even near its conceptual mechanics yet. It's only barely starting to finish up with basic aspects of the game and getting into the meat of its design, which means a ton is going to change, and there is nothing that can be done to change that. Are you suggesting he should tether his foot by the wants of people that do not want him to finish the product he is designing? We have no say here and your design concept is extremely naive. Notch used an unconvential release strategy, so your 'design philosophy' does not count here. He released the game before it was even in Alpha. BEFORE ALPHA. He told us we could play it while he designed it, and that it would change dramatically over the course of his events. So explain to me again how your logic makes sense. As an analogy, let me explain what you've said:
Someone is building a house. They get just barely halfway done making it, and some people decide they really like it and move in right away because the house designer allows them to. He moves to start completing the house, putting in walls, a ceiling, etc... and the people in the house (also not the only people who are going to be living there) start complaining that they like it better without walls etc. So the designer continues to finish the house, and they get enraged and say that they should have the right to CHOOSE if the house is finished or not since they already got there. The designer laughs and thinks to himself... I said you could move in early, I didn't say you could have a half built house.
Think about it.
I haven't played Minecraft since day 1, but I understand a "live beta" is intended to change and develop throughout the course of the game's development period. I've never released a game out in the open and worked on it while consumers play it, so I don't have experience in that scope of things, but that's needlessly demeaning of you to refer to my tactics as "naive". The issue with the hunger system is that as it stands it needs refining. Duh, that's the point of a beta, but then again as a dev myself I just don't understand how someone can put together a game knowing full well there are problems with the current code and just release it. Even as a beta Minecraft has been mostly stable. This (along with Endermen, XP, etc) has screwed that up.
Furthermore there is a HUGE issue with Minecraft not working on Apple computers. Nobody has been able to figure out if this is an OS issue, a user-end issue, something the Minecraft code itself is causing, etc. I don't have a Mac, but apparently Mojang/Notch has been silent about these issues with the Mac. Even if they have nothing to report on the issue they can at least Tweet/post that to demonstrate that they are actively looking at things.
Also, your analogy is just silly. Sorry. I understand the imagery but when you're talking about people moving into a house there's only 1 occupant, or multiple occupants that share the same tastes and ideas. Unless they are renting the house then they are free to do whatever they wish to it as they are the new owners.
The point is: being allowed to see something and use it before it is done does not entitle you to get to complain about how it is being made. It is not bad design on the designers part. The guy I responded to claimed to be a designer but was not even able to grasp that, and I, as someone who has in fact designed about half a dozen games and played quite possibly over 500 games in his life, staunchly disagree. I actually READ design philosophies of designers over at places like Wizard of the Coast, and am always involved in new game betas and release tests, and have been heavily involved in design discussions relating to many franchises as they were being released over the last 10 years.
No. Now you sound like a haughty, arrogant *****. I did not rub my freelance occupation in anybody's face like other people strutting around like they know everything about anything in the game industry. Your low blow at my expense was followed with a paragraph of nonsensical crap to fellate your own ego. I don't care how many games you've designed or played, the fact that you're throwing down those numbers makes you look about as credible as Chris-chan on the subject. (Really? 500 games? You keep track? Why even throw that down in the first place? That doesn't make you some genius because you apparently do nothing but play video games all day.)
Mojang has made Minecraft a live beta because they want ongoing feedback to come in on their projects to help shape the direction of the game's features and functions. This gives people a right to complain about things they are not happy with. That's the point of a beta. Let me turn the tables here and mention that if you've been beta testing games for a decade you would probably know this yourself. When a game's in beta guess what? YOU REPORT BUGS AND THINGS THAT AREN'T WORKING.
There's something called professionalism. You should go read the philosophies on that before you start attacking people and trying to paint them as stupid when you do a pretty good job of that on yourself.
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The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
So far hunger hasn't bugged me. I have 3 64 stacks of bread and have a renewable chicken farm to give me extra food. It doesn't seem like I am constantly having to think about hunger. When I'm just going at a slow pace(redesigning my town, moving around blocks and water, etc.) I only have to eat about once a minecraft day. But when I sprint around it takes a bit more effort. I keep cooked chickens and bread on my person at all times and it only takes up two blocks instead of individually holding each piece(honestly the biggest reason I never played on anything other than peaceful before. Healing through food was a pain in the BUTT!)
The lowest I've seen my hunger bar drop was down to two left, and that was during a hard day of mining. I haven't forgotten to eat so long that I started to lose health!
I actually made a post about this, I thought hunger was going to be wayyyyy more obnoxious than it turned out to be, so I guess my initial hatred of the idea made the real thing seem a lot more awesome? It could have been way worse. It makes the game easier for me personally! I actually fight mobs now! I used to be a bit of a coward.
Furthermore there is a HUGE issue with Minecraft not working on Apple computers. Nobody has been able to figure out if this is an OS issue, a user-end issue, something the Minecraft code itself is causing, etc. I don't have a Mac, but apparently Mojang/Notch has been silent about these issues with the Mac. Even if they have nothing to report on the issue they can at least Tweet/post that to demonstrate that they are actively looking at things.
No, that is a perfectly understood problem. Older macs don't support openGL 1.3, which they are now using. They didn't realize this beforehand, but they do now.
No, that is a perfectly understood problem. Older macs don't support openGL 1.3, which they are now using. They didn't realize this beforehand, but they do now.
I read in another thread it was pinpointed as being an issue with torches and the new lighting mechanics. I'm a Windows user myself so the issues with Macs never affected me, though has this been patched yet? It's good that it's finally been located though. I haven't heard any official word on it yet.
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The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
I read in another thread it was pinpointed as being an issue with torches and the new lighting mechanics. I'm a Windows user myself so the issues with Macs never affected me, though has this been patched yet? It's good that it's finally been located though. I haven't heard any official word on it yet.
I believe that it is the new lighting engine that is using opengl 1.3, so that would be accurate. Jebs statement was essentially "The beta period is about working out bugs, we are aware of the issue". So I am pretty sure they are planning on fixing it, but removing a dependency like that is probably not simple.
I haven't played Minecraft since day 1, but I understand a "live beta" is intended to change and develop throughout the course of the game's development period. I've never released a game out in the open and worked on it while consumers play it, so I don't have experience in that scope of things, but that's needlessly demeaning of you to refer to my tactics as "naive". The issue with the hunger system is that as it stands it needs refining. Duh, that's the point of a beta, but then again as a dev myself I just don't understand how someone can put together a game knowing full well there are problems with the current code and just release it. Even as a beta Minecraft has been mostly stable. This (along with Endermen, XP, etc) has screwed that up.
Furthermore there is a HUGE issue with Minecraft not working on Apple computers. Nobody has been able to figure out if this is an OS issue, a user-end issue, something the Minecraft code itself is causing, etc. I don't have a Mac, but apparently Mojang/Notch has been silent about these issues with the Mac. Even if they have nothing to report on the issue they can at least Tweet/post that to demonstrate that they are actively looking at things.
Also, your analogy is just silly. Sorry. I understand the imagery but when you're talking about people moving into a house there's only 1 occupant, or multiple occupants that share the same tastes and ideas. Unless they are renting the house then they are free to do whatever they wish to it as they are the new owners.
No. Now you sound like a haughty, arrogant *****. I did not rub my freelance occupation in anybody's face like other people strutting around like they know everything about anything in the game industry. Your low blow at my expense was followed with a paragraph of nonsensical crap to fellate your own ego. I don't care how many games you've designed or played, the fact that you're throwing down those numbers makes you look about as credible as Chris-chan on the subject. (Really? 500 games? You keep track? Why even throw that down in the first place? That doesn't make you some genius because you apparently do nothing but play video games all day.)
Mojang has made Minecraft a live beta because they want ongoing feedback to come in on their projects to help shape the direction of the game's features and functions. This gives people a right to complain about things they are not happy with. That's the point of a beta. Let me turn the tables here and mention that if you've been beta testing games for a decade you would probably know this yourself. When a game's in beta guess what? YOU REPORT BUGS AND THINGS THAT AREN'T WORKING.
Yep, as a beta, we are free to report bugs and things we don't like, but we also have to accept that the game is not finished yet. Without knowing how the current feature set will interact with the eventual feature set, some features cannot really be judged well. For example, complaining that experience orbs do nothing is not productive. Hunger is pretty well integrated, but we are still missing the animal husbandry component, so even that is pretty unreasonable to judge too harshly. I get tired of people complaining about things in a non-constructive way, shining the light on things which will be fixed in the next patch or two whether they are mentioned or not, and drawing attention away from actual bugs or problem features, or things that might not be noticed without a beta tester announcing it. Yes, performance issues on some pcs, and the mac issues are the most important thing right now. Not being able to play is much worse than dealing with the endermen.
Also, if the game is turning into a slightly different kind of game that you don't like, I think it's fair to say that you don't like the direction it's going, but it's a little unreasonable to expect that the final version will make everyone happy. Also, the creator should have room to explore his vision without being too polluted by a committee.
You are right about the point of a beta, but I think most people have the wrong viewpoint. They either think that: because its beta and not final, that we should all be quiet and wait for the finished version to say anything; or that because we get to play a game that's in progress we should expect to have any real control over the direction of the game. Or job is not to direct the game development, but to provide testing and information to the team to allow them to make the most informed decisions and fixes that they can.
Being a paid beta does not change that, although as an independent, mojang has in fact used a lot of the communities input to guide the direction of the game. Unfortunately it can only do so in a cumulative fashion rather than an individual basis :smile.gif:
I like the hunger system, because it came along with stack-able food and health regeneration based on hunger. I'm now able to survive far more damage over the long haul because I bring a few stacks of food.
actually...it does if your survival is dependent on it...jus sayin...I know when I think of survival (particularly something like wilderness survival) I think of food/water, shelter, etc...so, it DOES make sense...
it's platforming...not parkour <<
Fallout: New Vegas featured a "Hunger" type of survival aspect in the game's "Hardcore" difficulty setting. You could also turn this off if you did not want to keep up with the additional variables. The Hardcore option was likely made optional because the previous Fallout installments did not feature such a gameplay aspect. Minecraft is the same way, it has existed long enough for entire communities and game-types to be created/invented that did not incorporate a then-unknown mechanic. Hunger should not suddenly be made mandatory, if anything it should be on an on/off toggle or should only kick in when the game is played on harder difficulties.
The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
You are quick to label everything as maintenance. Maintenance is the least aspect of the hunger. It is a resource to manage, it is a revolutionized healing mechanic, it allows numerous other mechanics to function. The only maintenance impact it has is a couple of seconds on occasion to eat. Spawning on an island with aa single tree is an interesting experience now. Instead of an inconvience untilyou can build a wood supply up, you have a genuine challenge of "how do I get enough food". It is doable, but a real concern until you can set up your resources.
I've written out a detailed analysis and explanation here:
Why hunger works for minecraft
Hunger could have been a simple maintenance task, and I was against hunger initially because of it. But after seeing how it works, I had to change my mind.
-shrugs- he's making a game he'd like to play, sorta his option when you decide to make your own game without having to worry about investors, sure it'll be more niche, but the fans will love it even more.
Don't like it because it mucks up PvP? Minecraft wasn't meant to be PvP. Deal with it, then go and play some Team Fortress 2.
A well thought out post, bit you missed one HUGE underlying facet of this.
The biggest and single most important factor governing the design.
The game is not even near its conceptual mechanics yet. It's only barely starting to finish up with basic aspects of the game and getting into the meat of its design, which means a ton is going to change, and there is nothing that can be done to change that. Are you suggesting he should tether his foot by the wants of people that do not want him to finish the product he is designing? We have no say here and your design concept is extremely naive. Notch used an unconvential release strategy, so your 'design philosophy' does not count here. He released the game before it was even in Alpha. BEFORE ALPHA. He told us we could play it while he designed it, and that it would change dramatically over the course of his events. So explain to me again how your logic makes sense. As an analogy, let me explain what you've said:
Someone is building a house. They get just barely halfway done making it, and some people decide they really like it and move in right away because the house designer allows them to. He moves to start completing the house, putting in walls, a ceiling, etc... and the people in the house (also not the only people who are going to be living there) start complaining that they like it better without walls etc. So the designer continues to finish the house, and they get enraged and say that they should have the right to CHOOSE if the house is finished or not since they already got there. The designer laughs and thinks to himself... I said you could move in early, I didn't say you could have a half built house.
Think about it.
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
A better analogy would be an apartment building. Just becuase you don't want walls, or find that the lack of a ceiling is great for sleeping under the stars, does not mean the should not finish the apartment complex, since everyone else may not appreciate the extra ventilation.
I actually had the same thought when I was nearly done but didn't want to rewrite it :tongue.gif:
The point is: being allowed to see something and use it before it is done does not entitle you to get to complain about how it is being made. It is not bad design on the designers part. The guy I responded to claimed to be a designer but was not even able to grasp that, and I, as someone who has in fact designed about half a dozen games and played quite possibly over 500 games in his life, staunchly disagree. I actually READ design philosophies of designers over at places like Wizard of the Coast, and am always involved in new game betas and release tests, and have been heavily involved in design discussions relating to many franchises as they were being released over the last 10 years.
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
It's not necessarily complaining, it's input. It's essentially the player base offering up their input as to what would make the game better or more fun for them. The community won't always be right, and Notch is of course free to ignore them, but ignoring your fans, the people who will play your game, is not necessarily a smart decision.
What the guy you responded to was saying is that Notch should really consider whether what he wants to do is the right thing to do for a game that already has a large player base. Doubtless people will jump down my throat about this, but Minecraft is not your traditional Beta. I would say the patches in Minecraft are more akin to patches in large MMOs than they are to the nightly tests builds of a game that's mostly trying to catch bugs. People don't view Minecraft as an unfinished product, they view it more as an expanding game. I can't speak for the entire community of course, but the general response on the forums tends to suggest that this is the case.
As far as Notch's vision is concerned, the simple truth is that very few people care anymore, if they ever did, and the huge modding community only serves to exacerbate this. People can make Minecraft whatever they want it to be; it's no longer Notch's game, it's our game. If Notch continues to veer away from what most people think of as "their Minecraft", I suspect mods are going to become larger and more game changing. It'll be interesting to see how many Minecraft clones (by this I mean the building games most of us think of as Minecrafty) pop up in the next few years and what quality they will be.
Anyway, not sure where that post ended up. Generally just wanted to say Minecraft is becoming less Minecrafty to most of us and it's kind of saddening.
I haven't played Minecraft since day 1, but I understand a "live beta" is intended to change and develop throughout the course of the game's development period. I've never released a game out in the open and worked on it while consumers play it, so I don't have experience in that scope of things, but that's needlessly demeaning of you to refer to my tactics as "naive". The issue with the hunger system is that as it stands it needs refining. Duh, that's the point of a beta, but then again as a dev myself I just don't understand how someone can put together a game knowing full well there are problems with the current code and just release it. Even as a beta Minecraft has been mostly stable. This (along with Endermen, XP, etc) has screwed that up.
Furthermore there is a HUGE issue with Minecraft not working on Apple computers. Nobody has been able to figure out if this is an OS issue, a user-end issue, something the Minecraft code itself is causing, etc. I don't have a Mac, but apparently Mojang/Notch has been silent about these issues with the Mac. Even if they have nothing to report on the issue they can at least Tweet/post that to demonstrate that they are actively looking at things.
Also, your analogy is just silly. Sorry. I understand the imagery but when you're talking about people moving into a house there's only 1 occupant, or multiple occupants that share the same tastes and ideas. Unless they are renting the house then they are free to do whatever they wish to it as they are the new owners.
No. Now you sound like a haughty, arrogant *****. I did not rub my freelance occupation in anybody's face like other people strutting around like they know everything about anything in the game industry. Your low blow at my expense was followed with a paragraph of nonsensical crap to fellate your own ego. I don't care how many games you've designed or played, the fact that you're throwing down those numbers makes you look about as credible as Chris-chan on the subject. (Really? 500 games? You keep track? Why even throw that down in the first place? That doesn't make you some genius because you apparently do nothing but play video games all day.)
Mojang has made Minecraft a live beta because they want ongoing feedback to come in on their projects to help shape the direction of the game's features and functions. This gives people a right to complain about things they are not happy with. That's the point of a beta. Let me turn the tables here and mention that if you've been beta testing games for a decade you would probably know this yourself. When a game's in beta guess what? YOU REPORT BUGS AND THINGS THAT AREN'T WORKING.
There's something called professionalism. You should go read the philosophies on that before you start attacking people and trying to paint them as stupid when you do a pretty good job of that on yourself.
The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
The lowest I've seen my hunger bar drop was down to two left, and that was during a hard day of mining. I haven't forgotten to eat so long that I started to lose health!
I actually made a post about this, I thought hunger was going to be wayyyyy more obnoxious than it turned out to be, so I guess my initial hatred of the idea made the real thing seem a lot more awesome? It could have been way worse. It makes the game easier for me personally! I actually fight mobs now! I used to be a bit of a coward.
No, that is a perfectly understood problem. Older macs don't support openGL 1.3, which they are now using. They didn't realize this beforehand, but they do now.
I read in another thread it was pinpointed as being an issue with torches and the new lighting mechanics. I'm a Windows user myself so the issues with Macs never affected me, though has this been patched yet? It's good that it's finally been located though. I haven't heard any official word on it yet.
The preceding user isn't fond of listening to mindless crap from other people.
I believe that it is the new lighting engine that is using opengl 1.3, so that would be accurate. Jebs statement was essentially "The beta period is about working out bugs, we are aware of the issue". So I am pretty sure they are planning on fixing it, but removing a dependency like that is probably not simple.
Yep, as a beta, we are free to report bugs and things we don't like, but we also have to accept that the game is not finished yet. Without knowing how the current feature set will interact with the eventual feature set, some features cannot really be judged well. For example, complaining that experience orbs do nothing is not productive. Hunger is pretty well integrated, but we are still missing the animal husbandry component, so even that is pretty unreasonable to judge too harshly. I get tired of people complaining about things in a non-constructive way, shining the light on things which will be fixed in the next patch or two whether they are mentioned or not, and drawing attention away from actual bugs or problem features, or things that might not be noticed without a beta tester announcing it. Yes, performance issues on some pcs, and the mac issues are the most important thing right now. Not being able to play is much worse than dealing with the endermen.
Also, if the game is turning into a slightly different kind of game that you don't like, I think it's fair to say that you don't like the direction it's going, but it's a little unreasonable to expect that the final version will make everyone happy. Also, the creator should have room to explore his vision without being too polluted by a committee.
You are right about the point of a beta, but I think most people have the wrong viewpoint. They either think that: because its beta and not final, that we should all be quiet and wait for the finished version to say anything; or that because we get to play a game that's in progress we should expect to have any real control over the direction of the game. Or job is not to direct the game development, but to provide testing and information to the team to allow them to make the most informed decisions and fixes that they can.
Being a paid beta does not change that, although as an independent, mojang has in fact used a lot of the communities input to guide the direction of the game. Unfortunately it can only do so in a cumulative fashion rather than an individual basis :smile.gif: