1. As if everyone would mod.
2. I already said he could utilize community moderation. IT WORKS FOR WIKIPEDIA!
3. You're just playing devil's advocate to everyone, slow down, think a second about some of what is being said. Just relax brah!
1. Given the option they will.
2. Oh those bunch of jokers?
3. If i relax I get bitten on the ass by a Brown Recluse. No thanks.
Sorry about the length, believe it or not it was probably twice as long before I edited out all of the *rage*.
I see what you're getting at. They did create a pretty awesome game with lots of potential in Minecraft. I don't feel that their "newness" to the industry is any sort of excuse for the runaround that I feel we've been getting though. Notchs recent attitude and comments have really rubbed me the wrong way. He comes across like he's too good/too busy to work on the single reason (Minecraft) that he is enjoying the success that he currently has. I'm rather insulted by that notion, but I understand that many other people are not.
I realize that a date for 1.8 was never set in stone. But at the same time, this update has been hyped up by Mojang for quite some time now and the amount of content that it seems we'll actually be getting with the 1.8.1 (or whatever it is) update is rather... lackluster.
To further reinforce this point, please take a moment to go read the 1.9 FAQ thread that is stickied. Check out all the features that were pretty much set in stone for 1.8 that have been pushed back into the hazy future of 1.9+ updates. Yes, I realize most of the features were never promised to be in 1.8, but our 1.8 "adventure update" is seeming less and less adventurous by the day. On top of that, Notch, one of the games main programmers (as far as I know) isn't even concerned enough with how buggy the game is (otherwise we'd be getting a more robust 1.8 and earlier at that). He is instead devoting his time to a different project (which I'm sure he's planning on making money on).
This kind of (what appears to be) greed driven behavior is not the kind of thing that I find acceptable, especially in a customer driven business like the "release beta games for money but promise future updates/content" one.
It would be best for all involved here if we could refrain from calling each others opinions or ideas "stupid" though.
I partly agree with your opinions. He promised dragons a while back, did he not? Where the dragons ever implemented? No.
But, I understand the position Notch is in. He's working on a very large project with a very large fan base. You say he doesn't care about how buggy the game is, and that he wrongly feels he's entitled to a break.
I once wrote a 6 page free-verse poem, which I gave to my family and some friends to read (and my Literature teacher- I'm only 14,) and they loved it. They said I was a talented writer. I started working on a novelization write away, and they seemed excited about. I worked on it, worked…and stopped. I couldn’t go any further; I had writer’s block. I would tell them how the story was going occasionally, but when I stopped, I didn’t get long rage toward me. They were fine with it.
About the bugginess of the game, like pistons pushing each other, editing comes after you’ve written that part out, not during the development (notwithstanding editing during writing is what I do.) On a side note, I think pistons pushing pistons and redstone circuits completing themselves are supposed to be part of the game.
1. Given the option they will.
2. Oh those bunch of jokers?
3. If i relax I get bitten on the ass by a Brown Recluse. No thanks.
1. Untrue, it requires an idea, and effort to even make a simple mod. Most people are lazy.
2. Yes, the very same, you have seen what they're capable of? The mods on this forum for example?
3. Stop being a troll, it's not endearing.
It is obvious that you are just a flameboating troll, and i will no longer respond to you.
1. Untrue, it requires an idea, and effort to even make a simple mod. Most people are lazy.
2. Yes, the very same, you have seen what they're capable of? The mods on this forum for example?
3. Stop being a troll, it's not endearing.
It is obvious that you are just a flameboating troll, and i will no longer respond to you.
1. Someone will make an easy mod making program. Bam.
2. You trying to get me banned?
3. Yep.
You're complaining that you have to wait for patch releases that get delayed when there was no original date for the patch to be released.
You sir - Are an idiot. The ONLY promised date I've seen was 11/11/11.
1.8 is the last content update before 11/11/11 (commercial release). We still have 3 months til then?
As for releasing the smaller updates: It's a smarter move to install smaller chunks of data into a game - tweak the fixes and then install some more than it is to just dump 15 updates worth of code into the game and then tweaking it.
Want proof? Look at WoW updates where they do the huge content patches and the game is unplayable for a week after the patch.
The internet honestly needs a damn IQ test to sign on to. Seriously.
flyingchihuahua: You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless." That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it. It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it. Don't. Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute.
OP: I completely agree. Mojang has dealt with Minecraft in an incredibly unprofessional and nonchalant way. I think that while "delayed" may not have been the most proper word, it gets the point across to anyone who is not semantically challenged (half of the posters in this topic, apparently). 1.8 has always been speculated to be released soon after PAX. This is a completely reasonable expectation because 1.8 was shown at PAX. Now we find out that 1.8 barely conforms to the plan for 1.8. Knowing this (that 1.8 has not fulfilled all the changes promised, and that 1.8 is being released both later than expected and in "two" parts, it is fair to say that "1.8 has been delayed."
That's all for now. Gotta go play Borderlands.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Foxy1990 »
if some higher beings ever got to view this forum before coming to our planet they would turn back and not bother!
Quote from Blindburrows »
do you know how to get to the Netherlands other than a portal
First off, thank you for the well organized an logical post detailing your concerns about Mojang.
On the steam issue, I completely disagree with you. Notch has the right to make money from Minecraft, and I see no problem with an online store. If people are willing to pay for capes or maps, I say let them. Furthermore, the revenue from an online store could help support the game financially and prolong development which is only a good thing. Saying that notch is greedy for spending time on other projects and wanting to make money is (in my opinion) entirely uncalled for. The point of games is to make money, and Minecraft is now subject to diminishing marginal returns (for the ignorant out there, it means that Mojang makes less money per time spent on Minecraft than on a new game). Notch should be working on new games to ensure future income for his company. This is not greed, it is common sense.
I do agree with many of your complaints on the speed of development and dropped or postponed features. However, I believe that there is a better explanation than greed or laziness. Minecraft is currently being developed by two people, Notch and Jeb. Looking at the 1.8 feature list I believe that this is a reasonable amount of work for two people. The real problem with Mojang's development is that they don't have enough people working on the game! Like it or not, the only way to speed up development is to increase the number of developers and better organize the workload. As has been pointed out earlier Mojang is currently transitioning from an indie developer to a more mainstream one, but they have not sufficiently increased their manpower to cope with the increased content required from them! Minecraft has made millions and Notch could and should use some of this money to hire a dozen or so developers to help move things along.
But, who listens to us, huh? Things will probably continue on as they have and we'll be left with a great game which could and should have been so much more. Thank God for modders!
You're complaining that you have to wait for patch releases that get delayed when there was no original date for the patch to be released.
You sir - Are an idiot. The ONLY promised date I've seen was 11/11/11.
1.8 is the last content update before 11/11/11 (commercial release). We still have 3 months til then?
As for releasing the smaller updates: It's a smarter move to install smaller chunks of data into a game - tweak the fixes and then install some more than it is to just dump 15 updates worth of code into the game and then tweaking it.
Want proof? Look at WoW updates where they do the huge content patches and the game is unplayable for a week after the patch.
The internet honestly needs a damn IQ test to sign on to. Seriously.
Oh No! Someone has a different opinion then me! BURN HIM!
flyingchihuahua: You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless." That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it. It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it. Don't. Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute.
OP: I completely agree. Mojang has dealt with Minecraft in an incredibly unprofessional and nonchalant way. I think that while "delayed" may not have been the most proper word, it gets the point across to anyone who is not semantically challenged (half of the posters in this topic, apparently). 1.8 has always been speculated to be released soon after PAX. This is a completely reasonable expectation because 1.8 was shown at PAX. Now we find out that 1.8 barely conforms to the plan for 1.8. Knowing this (that 1.8 has not fulfilled all the changes promised, and that 1.8 is being released both later than expected and in "two" parts, it is fair to say that "1.8 has been delayed."
That's all for now. Gotta go play Borderlands.
I think alot of it stems from the odd fact that this is not your average J. O. B.
Basically, if this were a normal company with deadlines and a hardass boss, and a PR department, things would be wayyyyy different. A little more like what the OP was suggesting. This however, is not, and so there's a rather large disconnect from what we expect, to what we get.
I'd have to agree with the maker of this thread. I think it's terrible that the creators are making another game, "Scrolls", that less the half of the community will probably play. Don't listen to all these other guys, that still believe in "You get what You get, and You don't get Upset."
flyingchihuahua: You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless." That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it. It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it. Don't. Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute.
OP: I completely agree. Mojang has dealt with Minecraft in an incredibly unprofessional and nonchalant way. I think that while "delayed" may not have been the most proper word, it gets the point across to anyone who is not semantically challenged (half of the posters in this topic, apparently). 1.8 has always been speculated to be released soon after PAX. This is a completely reasonable expectation because 1.8 was shown at PAX. Now we find out that 1.8 barely conforms to the plan for 1.8. Knowing this (that 1.8 has not fulfilled all the changes promised, and that 1.8 is being released both later than expected and in "two" parts, it is fair to say that "1.8 has been delayed."
That's all for now. Gotta go play Borderlands.
THANK YOU! Finaly! Someone who can say this: "Okey, it has been delayed. Lets play some other games meanwhile" And, they dont realy are beeing nonchalant. If they are, so are allmost all gaming companies. Lionhead: Having a Fable 3 stuck in tree bug since XBOX 360 realese to PC realese. So, I hope our disagreements about Mojang will make us enemies, since you seem to be a allright guy.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Imma Yognaught. Naught as in nothing. Nothing. Nice. I have a youtube channel you know. Theres no videos uploaded! Seriously, check it out!
I think your post is a bit disrespectful to Notch and I'm skeptical about your concerns. What is your goal with this message, honestly? To make people hate Mojang? To force Notch to concentrate his life entirely on minecraft? I don't know... to me it seems like a well-disguised troll or a frustrated user that wrote a post on impulse and now tries to justify it but only manages to get bogged down in muddy arguments.
OP: I completely agree. Mojang has dealt with Minecraft in an incredibly unprofessional and nonchalant way. I think that while "delayed" may not have been the most proper word, it gets the point across to anyone who is not semantically challenged (half of the posters in this topic, apparently). 1.8 has always been speculated to be released soon after PAX. This is a completely reasonable expectation because 1.8 was shown at PAX. Now we find out that 1.8 barely conforms to the plan for 1.8. Knowing this (that 1.8 has not fulfilled all the changes promised, and that 1.8 is being released both later than expected and in "two" parts, it is fair to say that "1.8 has been delayed."
That's another thing that was bugging me; the 1.8 demo was half this is what we've done and half what the planned to add. It was obviously not even close to completion. As I said earlier, HIRE MORE DEVELOPERS!
I'd have to agree with the maker of this thread. I think it's terrible that the creators are making another game, "Scrolls", that less the half of the community will probably play. Don't listen to all these other guys, that still believe in "You get what You get, and You don't get Upset."
Its a difference aggreeing to "You get what you get" than aggreeing to: "I like this game. But the company arent my slaves. Therefore, I wont play it anymore. And you shall not play it anymore either"
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Imma Yognaught. Naught as in nothing. Nothing. Nice. I have a youtube channel you know. Theres no videos uploaded! Seriously, check it out!
flyingchihuahua: You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless." That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it. It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it. Don't. Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute.
Gotta Break this big boy down!
"You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless."
Because we won't! Besides, have you run a company before? No?
"That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it."
First of, I'm never gonna leave. I'm here weather I'm wanted or not and there is nothing you can do about it. Secondly, "repulsive"? Wow good way to be tolerant to someone else's opinion. Thirdly, I've contributed more than you have. All you did was bash Mojang. Finally, IMO all discussion is pointless, it never gets anywhere.
"It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it."
What I want to here is an official statement about what is going on. I don't speculate cause if I do I get hyped up over absolutely nothing.
"Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute."
I'm not trying to devalue the conversation. Like I said I want OFFICIAL PROOF, NOT RANDOM SPECULATION. WHAT IS GOING ON RIGHT NOW IS SPECULATION. Being Mute wouldn't change anything. I can still type and drool down your ear.
The game update will come, take a chill pill man. I want it too, but it's not stopping me from playing the game that's there now. Relax, take a slow deep breath, release.
Your position is flawed. Like many others on this thread have said before me, there is no actual release date for 1.8. For all we know it could be released in November. Just wait patiently, or go play another game, or do something other than playing minecraft if you really dislike it and the company that made it so much. I read that you weren't *trying* to bash Mojang and Notch, but you did anyways. My view is that yes, the development is slowing down, BUT there are much more complicated aspects being implemented into the game which would obviously take more time to complete.
The other side of the argument is basically "I think mojang is doing alright. Even though I'd like 1.8 to come out sooner, I'm okay waiting a few more weeks." Which is pretty much means "You get what You get, and You don't get Upset...
1. Given the option they will.
2. Oh those bunch of jokers?
3. If i relax I get bitten on the ass by a Brown Recluse. No thanks.
Click em'!
I partly agree with your opinions. He promised dragons a while back, did he not? Where the dragons ever implemented? No.
But, I understand the position Notch is in. He's working on a very large project with a very large fan base. You say he doesn't care about how buggy the game is, and that he wrongly feels he's entitled to a break.
I once wrote a 6 page free-verse poem, which I gave to my family and some friends to read (and my Literature teacher- I'm only 14,) and they loved it. They said I was a talented writer. I started working on a novelization write away, and they seemed excited about. I worked on it, worked…and stopped. I couldn’t go any further; I had writer’s block. I would tell them how the story was going occasionally, but when I stopped, I didn’t get long rage toward me. They were fine with it.
About the bugginess of the game, like pistons pushing each other, editing comes after you’ve written that part out, not during the development (notwithstanding editing during writing is what I do.) On a side note, I think pistons pushing pistons and redstone circuits completing themselves are supposed to be part of the game.
1. Untrue, it requires an idea, and effort to even make a simple mod. Most people are lazy.
2. Yes, the very same, you have seen what they're capable of? The mods on this forum for example?
3. Stop being a troll, it's not endearing.
It is obvious that you are just a flameboating troll, and i will no longer respond to you.
1. Someone will make an easy mod making program. Bam.
2. You trying to get me banned?
3. Yep.
Click em'!
You are so full of yourself it's pathetic.
Notch took a 2 week break?? OMG! blasphemy!
Notch is working on another game??! BLASPHEMY!!!
You're complaining that you have to wait for patch releases that get delayed when there was no original date for the patch to be released.
You sir - Are an idiot. The ONLY promised date I've seen was 11/11/11.
1.8 is the last content update before 11/11/11 (commercial release). We still have 3 months til then?
As for releasing the smaller updates: It's a smarter move to install smaller chunks of data into a game - tweak the fixes and then install some more than it is to just dump 15 updates worth of code into the game and then tweaking it.
Want proof? Look at WoW updates where they do the huge content patches and the game is unplayable for a week after the patch.
The internet honestly needs a damn IQ test to sign on to. Seriously.
OP: I completely agree. Mojang has dealt with Minecraft in an incredibly unprofessional and nonchalant way. I think that while "delayed" may not have been the most proper word, it gets the point across to anyone who is not semantically challenged (half of the posters in this topic, apparently). 1.8 has always been speculated to be released soon after PAX. This is a completely reasonable expectation because 1.8 was shown at PAX. Now we find out that 1.8 barely conforms to the plan for 1.8. Knowing this (that 1.8 has not fulfilled all the changes promised, and that 1.8 is being released both later than expected and in "two" parts, it is fair to say that "1.8 has been delayed."
That's all for now. Gotta go play Borderlands.
On the steam issue, I completely disagree with you. Notch has the right to make money from Minecraft, and I see no problem with an online store. If people are willing to pay for capes or maps, I say let them. Furthermore, the revenue from an online store could help support the game financially and prolong development which is only a good thing. Saying that notch is greedy for spending time on other projects and wanting to make money is (in my opinion) entirely uncalled for. The point of games is to make money, and Minecraft is now subject to diminishing marginal returns (for the ignorant out there, it means that Mojang makes less money per time spent on Minecraft than on a new game). Notch should be working on new games to ensure future income for his company. This is not greed, it is common sense.
I do agree with many of your complaints on the speed of development and dropped or postponed features. However, I believe that there is a better explanation than greed or laziness. Minecraft is currently being developed by two people, Notch and Jeb. Looking at the 1.8 feature list I believe that this is a reasonable amount of work for two people. The real problem with Mojang's development is that they don't have enough people working on the game! Like it or not, the only way to speed up development is to increase the number of developers and better organize the workload. As has been pointed out earlier Mojang is currently transitioning from an indie developer to a more mainstream one, but they have not sufficiently increased their manpower to cope with the increased content required from them! Minecraft has made millions and Notch could and should use some of this money to hire a dozen or so developers to help move things along.
But, who listens to us, huh? Things will probably continue on as they have and we'll be left with a great game which could and should have been so much more. Thank God for modders!
Oh No! Someone has a different opinion then me! BURN HIM!
Click em'!
I think alot of it stems from the odd fact that this is not your average J. O. B.
Basically, if this were a normal company with deadlines and a hardass boss, and a PR department, things would be wayyyyy different. A little more like what the OP was suggesting. This however, is not, and so there's a rather large disconnect from what we expect, to what we get.
THANK YOU! Finaly! Someone who can say this: "Okey, it has been delayed. Lets play some other games meanwhile" And, they dont realy are beeing nonchalant. If they are, so are allmost all gaming companies. Lionhead: Having a Fable 3 stuck in tree bug since XBOX 360 realese to PC realese. So, I hope our disagreements about Mojang will make us enemies, since you seem to be a allright guy.
Amen that.
That's another thing that was bugging me; the 1.8 demo was half this is what we've done and half what the planned to add. It was obviously not even close to completion. As I said earlier, HIRE MORE DEVELOPERS!
Its a difference aggreeing to "You get what you get" than aggreeing to: "I like this game. But the company arent my slaves. Therefore, I wont play it anymore. And you shall not play it anymore either"
Gotta Break this big boy down!
"You're trying to discredit everyone's arguments by claiming this: "Because we will never be able to make a change in the way Mojang operates, discussion is worthless."
Because we won't! Besides, have you run a company before? No?
"That is an absolutely repulsive standpoint and I wish you would just leave this topic. You've barely contributed to the discussion - putting most of your energy into trying to stop it."
First of, I'm never gonna leave. I'm here weather I'm wanted or not and there is nothing you can do about it. Secondly, "repulsive"? Wow good way to be tolerant to someone else's opinion. Thirdly, I've contributed more than you have. All you did was bash Mojang. Finally, IMO all discussion is pointless, it never gets anywhere.
"It's not what you want to hear so you want to stop it."
What I want to here is an official statement about what is going on. I don't speculate cause if I do I get hyped up over absolutely nothing.
"Quit trying to devalue conversation based on whether or not the conversation will bring about the next great revolution. I wish you were mute."
I'm not trying to devalue the conversation. Like I said I want OFFICIAL PROOF, NOT RANDOM SPECULATION. WHAT IS GOING ON RIGHT NOW IS SPECULATION. Being Mute wouldn't change anything. I can still type and drool down your ear.
Click em'!
Here we have 2 options:
Release 1.8 as one big update, and take about a week to fix all of the bugs that render the game unplayable.
Outcome:
We have to wait longer for the entire update.
There are also game-breaking bugs that take about a week to fix.
Forum gets flooded with whiny immature brats throwing a fit about not being able to play a certain game for a little while.
Release 1.8 as two separate updates:
Outcome:
We get some of the content earlier than we would in a single massive update
Fewer bugs, which means les whiners throwing a fit and a faster fix time.