Most sever owners don't have the ability to allow their players to travel over 10,000 blocks in one direction to find new biomes due to the amount of lag that's caused. Even if they could, with the current generations there is no guarantee that they will even be able to find a new biome in 10,000 blocks!
It's not *that* far. I got into a argument with another poster who was saying you normally didn't have to travel more than 2000 blocks to find most biomes. I actually looked at about 20 random seeds and the actual distance to reach essentially all biomes (excepting only Bryce and Ice Spikes) was 3,000 to 7,000 blocks. So while there's no *guarantee* a 15K x 15K area is almost certain to have everything. Now you may have to *search* a longer linear distance than that; a square spiral search of a 15K x 15K area with a distance between passes of 1K requires 400,000 blocks of travel.
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Geographicraft (formerly Climate Control) - Control climate, ocean, and land sizes; stop chunk walls; put modded biomes into Default worlds, and more!
RTG plus - All the beautiful terrain of RTG, plus varied and beautiful trees and forests.
It's not *that* far. I got into a argument with another poster who was saying you normally didn't have to travel more than 2000 blocks to find most biomes. I actually looked at about 20 random seeds and the actual distance to reach essentially all biomes (excepting only Bryce and Ice Spikes) was 3,000 to 7,000 blocks. So while there's no *guarantee* a 15K x 15K area is almost certain to have everything. Now you may have to *search* a longer linear distance than that; a square spiral search of a 15K x 15K area with a distance between passes of 1K requires 400,000 blocks of travel.
Anything over 1000 blocks is what I consider to be far. Within 500 blocks is what I consider to be ideal. A 15,000 x 15,000 area is absolutely massive.
It is game-breaking for anyone who plays survival, or has a survival sever. There will be resources that you will never be able to obtain.
Your opinion is not fact. I have a survival server and we are totally fine with the new generation.
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XP Guide Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
Your opinion is not fact. I have a survival server and we are totally fine with the new generation.
How is what you just quoted me saying not fact? Explain that for me please.
Because it is indeed very possible to generate a server world where you will never be able to obtain some resources. Unless you have crazy amounts of RAM and don't set world limits, otherwise not setting limits would be idiotic.
How is what you just quoted me saying not fact? Explain that for me please.
Because it is indeed very possible to generate a server world where you will never be able to obtain some resources. Unless you don't set world limits because you have crazy amounts of RAM, otherwise not setting limits would be idiotic.
You are saying that it IS game breaking, but it is only your opinion that it is. I have a survival server and have no problems with the new generation. World size is not related to server lag. The whole world isn't loaded at once, so they only effect on server lag would be the amount of players that are loading their own set of chunks.
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XP Guide Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
You are saying that it IS game breaking, but it is only your opinion that it is. I have a survival server and have no problems with the new generation. World size is not related to server lag. The whole world isn't loaded at once, so they only effect on server lag would be the amount of players that are loading their own set of chunks.
So players travelling all over the map for say 7,500 blocks, generating new terrain, searching for a jungle biome so they can get cocoa, melons, and jungle wood doesn't cause lag? What if there is no jungle within your world limits? What if it's all desert?
So players travelling all over the map for say 7,500 blocks, generating new terrain, searching for a jungle biome so they can get cocoa, melons, and jungle wood doesn't cause lag? What if there is no jungle within your world limits? What if it's all desert?
Use your head.
Would you mind reading what I just said?
And I quote
so the only effect on server lag would be the amount of players that are loading their own set of chunks.
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XP Guide Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
So, travelling 7,500 plus blocks generating new terrain doesn't cause lag?
Use your head. It's your opinion that isn't fact.
You.......ugh.
I JUST said that WORLD SIZE does NOT cause LAG. THE ONLY thing that will cause lag in this case is PLAYERS LOADING THEIR OWN SET OF CHUNKS. THAT INCLUDES PLAYERS TRAVELING 7500 BLOCKS TO FIND A JUNGLE.
Seriously though, try reading what I said before you just repeat yourself.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
XP Guide Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
THE ONLY thing that will cause lag in this case is PLAYERS LOADING THEIR OWN SET OF CHUNKS. THAT INCLUDES PLAYERS TRAVELING 7500 BLOCKS TO FIND A JUNGLE.
Thank you that's exactly what I was looking for.
Now how is this not game-breaking?
That is unnecessary lag that not every sever owner is equipped to handle. This is why owners set world limits and do to the sheer ridiculous size of desert and forest biomes it is entirely possible for your players to not have access to a jungle biome (for example) and all of the resources that only spawn there.
That is unnecessary lag that not every sever owner is equipped to handle. This is why they owners world limits and do to the sheer ridiculous size of desert and forest biomes it is entirely possible for your player to not have access to a jungle biome for example and all of the resources that only spawn there.
Fact.
This obviously isn't fact. It hasn't broken my survival server, and it hasn't broken a lot of other servers. Server owners are unfortunately going to have to cope with changes to the game.
They can do so through various options.
Remove the borders (which may involve upgrading their server storage or bandwidth)
Set up shop plugins
Find a random plains biome and turn it into a jungle through worldedit
Choose a good seed by sifting through it in amidst.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
XP Guide Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
This obviously isn't fact. It hasn't broken my survival server, and it hasn't broken a lot of other servers. Server owners are unfortunately going to have to cope with changes to the game.
They can do so through various options.
Remove the borders (which may involve upgrading their server storage or bandwidth)
Set up shop plugins
Find a random plains biome and turn it into a jungle through worldedit
Choose a good seed by sifting through it in amidst.
It hasn't broken your server because you already had your map generated prior to the update!
Just the fact that server owners now have to resort to buying more RAM, or using 3rd party software to find/edit a map to play on is a sure sign that the world generator is broken. Stop being such a fanboy and use common sense.
I wouldn't hold my breath on the temperature system getting modified in the near future, the entire terrain generator changes were put together before the first 1.7 snapshot and then they were never touched again for the remainder of the 1.7 testing phase, despite the plethora of feedback from the playerbase.
You might as well be talking to a brick wall really, but if you really want some Mojang response then try contact Jens directly. He was responsible for the new terrain generator and, like the rest of Mojang, doesn't view this forum as far as I can tell.
I wouldn't hold my breath on the temperature system getting modified in the near future, the entire terrain generator changes were put together before the first 1.7 snapshot and then they were never touched again for the remainder of the 1.7 testing phase, despite the plethora of feedback from the playerbase. You might as well be talking to a brick wall really.
That's a shame because really I see 2 major problems with it.
1 - There's double, or even triple the number of temperate biomes, so chances are forests will end up being most of your map due to large numbers of them being grouped together. We need much more diversity.
2 - The size of the biomes are way too large. They are enormous.
That is unnecessary lag that not every sever owner is equipped to handle. This is why owners set world limits and do to the sheer ridiculous size of desert and forest biomes it is entirely possible for your players to not have access to a jungle biome (for example) and all of the resources that only spawn there.
Fact.
Biome size doesn't affect how many chunks are loaded, because ram is what's needed to load chunks. World size has to do with storage, but If a part of the world is loaded they retrieve the information, and reload the chunk, (which as I said before; loading chunks needs ram)
so the con I see of big biomes is not that It lags, (It doesn't actually lag anymore than smaller biomes) but rather how people who need different resources then what they have in, say a desert biome, they would have to travel further distances to get to a different biome to obtain different resources.
All this would do is make It more likely to use up more storage space on your computer, due to the tendency of players traveling different biomes to get different things.
So, overall this would make It more likely for players on your server to use up your storage space.
That's a shame because really I see 2 major problems with it.
1 - There's double, or even triple the number of temperate biomes, so chances are forests will end up being most of your map due to large numbers of them being grouped together. We need much more diversity.
2 - The size of the biomes are way too large. They are enormous.
Yes, the rule of thumb seems to be that whatever biome you spawn in will be the dominant temperature system throughout large expanses of your world. If you spawn in a cold biome then chances are you'll have as much trouble finding warmer biomes as ones who spawn in warmer biomes (like myself) have finding colder ones.
Out of curiosity, how large are biomes on Default? My 1.7 world is set to Large biomes and I guess each biome can be as large as 2000 blocks across, but that's a very very rough estimate.
You guys are arguing over something stupid, I don't like the new biomes but you can still find ENOUGH resources in one area. If you need to go out and find something, thats the whole POINT of the game. You survive, look for stuff you need, and do whatever you want. In real life you don't have all the resources next to each other, they are SPREAD out. Your acting like you want the resources HANDED to you..
If you don't like the new biomes stop complaining about it because mojang isnt going to fix it, they are a big company now and they get about 1 million complaints a day. Downgrade your minecraft, and play it when it WAS good.
Yes, the rule of thumb seems to be that whatever biome you spawn in will be the dominant temperature system throughout large expanses of your world. If you spawn in a cold biome then chances are you'll have as much trouble finding warmer biomes as ones who spawn in warmer biomes (like myself) have finding colder ones.
Out of curiosity, how large are biomes on Default? My 1.7 world is set to Large biomes and I guess each biome can be as large as 2000 blocks across, but that's a very very rough estimate.
Using Amidst it's nothing to see a 2000 x 2000 or larger biome on default. I'd say that's average. I'd say temperature zones are about 10,000 x 10,000 blocks, perhaps a bit more. I have seen deserts and forests that are pushing 15,000 - 20,000 squared blocks and that's on default too. For Large Biomes multiple that by 4.
If you don't like the new biomes stop complaining about it because mojang isnt going to fix it
Oh really? I wish I could get such important inside info from Mojang. You must be high up in Jeb's list of people to trust with new secret information no one else knows about. Congratulations.
It's not *that* far. I got into a argument with another poster who was saying you normally didn't have to travel more than 2000 blocks to find most biomes. I actually looked at about 20 random seeds and the actual distance to reach essentially all biomes (excepting only Bryce and Ice Spikes) was 3,000 to 7,000 blocks. So while there's no *guarantee* a 15K x 15K area is almost certain to have everything. Now you may have to *search* a longer linear distance than that; a square spiral search of a 15K x 15K area with a distance between passes of 1K requires 400,000 blocks of travel.
Geographicraft (formerly Climate Control) - Control climate, ocean, and land sizes; stop chunk walls; put modded biomes into Default worlds, and more!
RTG plus - All the beautiful terrain of RTG, plus varied and beautiful trees and forests.
Anything over 1000 blocks is what I consider to be far. Within 500 blocks is what I consider to be ideal. A 15,000 x 15,000 area is absolutely massive.
Your opinion is not fact. I have a survival server and we are totally fine with the new generation.
Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten
If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
How is what you just quoted me saying not fact? Explain that for me please.
Because it is indeed very possible to generate a server world where you will never be able to obtain some resources. Unless you have crazy amounts of RAM and don't set world limits, otherwise not setting limits would be idiotic.
You are saying that it IS game breaking, but it is only your opinion that it is. I have a survival server and have no problems with the new generation. World size is not related to server lag. The whole world isn't loaded at once, so they only effect on server lag would be the amount of players that are loading their own set of chunks.
Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten
If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
So players travelling all over the map for say 7,500 blocks, generating new terrain, searching for a jungle biome so they can get cocoa, melons, and jungle wood doesn't cause lag? What if there is no jungle within your world limits? What if it's all desert?
Use your head.
Would you mind reading what I just said?
And I quote
Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten
If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
Use your head. You're arguing your opinion against fact.
You.......ugh.
I JUST said that WORLD SIZE does NOT cause LAG. THE ONLY thing that will cause lag in this case is PLAYERS LOADING THEIR OWN SET OF CHUNKS. THAT INCLUDES PLAYERS TRAVELING 7500 BLOCKS TO FIND A JUNGLE.
Seriously though, try reading what I said before you just repeat yourself.
Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten
If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
Thank you that's exactly what I was looking for.
Now how is this not game-breaking?
That is unnecessary lag that not every sever owner is equipped to handle. This is why owners set world limits and do to the sheer ridiculous size of desert and forest biomes it is entirely possible for your players to not have access to a jungle biome (for example) and all of the resources that only spawn there.
Fact.
This obviously isn't fact. It hasn't broken my survival server, and it hasn't broken a lot of other servers. Server owners are unfortunately going to have to cope with changes to the game.
They can do so through various options.
Remove the borders (which may involve upgrading their server storage or bandwidth)
Set up shop plugins
Find a random plains biome and turn it into a jungle through worldedit
Choose a good seed by sifting through it in amidst.
Regardless of what change you do, no matter how small, someone will complain. - Jens Bergensten
If you want me to see your reply, make sure to quote my post in your reply.
It hasn't broken your server because you already had your map generated prior to the update!
Just the fact that server owners now have to resort to buying more RAM, or using 3rd party software to find/edit a map to play on is a sure sign that the world generator is broken. Stop being such a fanboy and use common sense.
Also, I'd suggest learning what a fact is.
You might as well be talking to a brick wall really, but if you really want some Mojang response then try contact Jens directly. He was responsible for the new terrain generator and, like the rest of Mojang, doesn't view this forum as far as I can tell.
That's a shame because really I see 2 major problems with it.
1 - There's double, or even triple the number of temperate biomes, so chances are forests will end up being most of your map due to large numbers of them being grouped together. We need much more diversity.
2 - The size of the biomes are way too large. They are enormous.
Biome size doesn't affect how many chunks are loaded, because ram is what's needed to load chunks. World size has to do with storage, but If a part of the world is loaded they retrieve the information, and reload the chunk, (which as I said before; loading chunks needs ram)
so the con I see of big biomes is not that It lags, (It doesn't actually lag anymore than smaller biomes) but rather how people who need different resources then what they have in, say a desert biome, they would have to travel further distances to get to a different biome to obtain different resources.
All this would do is make It more likely to use up more storage space on your computer, due to the tendency of players traveling different biomes to get different things.
So, overall this would make It more likely for players on your server to use up your storage space.
"Something profound usually goes here but I decided to place a
self-referential and self-aware quote that others probably used
instead."
Yes, the rule of thumb seems to be that whatever biome you spawn in will be the dominant temperature system throughout large expanses of your world. If you spawn in a cold biome then chances are you'll have as much trouble finding warmer biomes as ones who spawn in warmer biomes (like myself) have finding colder ones.
Out of curiosity, how large are biomes on Default? My 1.7 world is set to Large biomes and I guess each biome can be as large as 2000 blocks across, but that's a very very rough estimate.
If you don't like the new biomes stop complaining about it because mojang isnt going to fix it, they are a big company now and they get about 1 million complaints a day. Downgrade your minecraft, and play it when it WAS good.
Using Amidst it's nothing to see a 2000 x 2000 or larger biome on default. I'd say that's average. I'd say temperature zones are about 10,000 x 10,000 blocks, perhaps a bit more. I have seen deserts and forests that are pushing 15,000 - 20,000 squared blocks and that's on default too. For Large Biomes multiple that by 4.
Oh really? I wish I could get such important inside info from Mojang. You must be high up in Jeb's list of people to trust with new secret information no one else knows about. Congratulations.
/sarcasm