Say that to the save I've been using since infdev.
:tongue.gif:
You know what I meant! There are always ways around - deleting chunks, traveling to new areas, MCEditing the save... These guys don't seem to want to do that, or perhaps simply don't know. I can't blame them either way - neither of those are very favorable (IMO).
Like I said before, just because it snowed on palm trees doesn't mean tundra existing right next to jungles is anything but an staggeringly unlikely fluke of nature (and in this case a figment of your imagination). In game terms it just looks like sloppy design. The biome generation is an incoherent mess no matter how many pics of flukes of nature you can find on Google images.
If I could dig up the quote I would, but the internet is a big place. Jeb assured us we wouldn't have to generate new worlds. I'm not the first person in this thread to bring up that point.
There is a lot of room for uncertainty in having biomes generate in a manner that makes some sort of sense. The biomes on Earth certainly don't seem to "predictable" according to all the adventure stories ever written. There are a ton of variable possibilities. Preventing tundras from spawning next to jungles or deserts isn't going to change that.
Wait... didn't you just quote, in the very same post, a previous post about how realistic it is for such things to happen?
It would be fun if it didn't happen practically every time a biome is generated. As it stands, it just looks sloppy.
It's amazing how consistently you guys defend Mojang's glaring **** ups. It's not like this is a feature of the game. It's an obvious design flaw. When Jeb starts talking about making a more coherent world generator where tundras don't spawn next to jungles and desert, I'm going to remind you guys about this thread.
I will agree, the new jungles are awesome.
But, getting past that, your ideas for the organization of biomes is a bit ludicrous. We have no way of telling whether it was a "design flaw" in the first place anyway. Random biomes aren't a feature, but neither would predictable patterns of their spawning. Currently, you wander until you find the right biome you want. With predictable forms of spawning, it would make people walk further just to find the right one. Personally, I enjoy the randomness of it and the fact that I can find everything in one location, rather than know exactly where it is. Your solution would cause the terrain generation to become even more boring than it currently is.
Also, I'm not quite sure what your resentment for the Mojang crew is from, but I kind of find this quotes fitting. If it's not a correct portrayal of your criticism, let me know, and I'll find some new ones.
Most of these critics are usually frustrated artists, and they criticise other people's art because they can't do it themselves. It's a really disgusting job. They must feel horrible inside.
Rosanna Arquette
Criticism is an indirect form of self-boasting.
Emmet Fox
Most critical writing is drivel and half of it is dishonest. It is a short cut to oblivion, anyway. Thinking in terms of ideas destroys the power to think in terms of emotions and sensations.
Chandler, Raymond
Happens periodically in games like Wow, where you have to grind stuff again the moment new content comes out.
Still there's at least a 5 month delay between each patch. Which is "ok" since by that time you'd probably be bored with the game.
I could recognize this as an issue if the time elapsed between patches was shorter, but 3/4 months for each patch seems fair enough to me. ( Hopefully they'll keep the current trend, maybe delaying official patches just a little bit more )
Yes, but in that situation you don't have to start over, there is simply more gear to get; which is how patches in minecraft should work. You don't have to rebuild from the ground up, you simply have more to build and explore.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
-God Damn Banners for Mods and Suggestions-
-Quote by some guy you've never heard of-
This picture seems to have caused some people a bit of confusion. I tried to briefly clarify what the picture means in a previous post on page 2 but I don't think anyone looked at it.
Rainforests do exist in the light green areas. Notice for the light green areas it says "temperate deciduous & rain forest". This means that the forests that exist in these areas are temperate deciduous forest and temperate rainforest.
Temperate rainforests aren't the same thing as tropical rainforests.
Temperate rainforest: High annual rainfall, moderate humidity. Warm in summer, often below freezing in winter. Deciduous plant life that usually sheds their leaves in the winter, leaving the winter landscape looking very bare and frozen.
Tropical rainforest: High annual rainfall, high humidity. Little variation in seasons, hot all year round. Deciduous plant life whose leaves don't all drop collectively in any one season, so the forest is green and lush all year round.
And as stated previously, jungle isn't the same thing as rainforest either. But I believe the "jungle" biome probably encompasses all of these biomes, so it's probably just fine to have a tundra biome next to it. All I'd personally like to see is less sharp a transition, rather have it blend in slowly over one or two hundred blocks or so.
This is kind of what I was thinking as well, not that I expect realism from minecraft worlds to begin with. You're probably wasting your time with this post though, some people just live to complain. This seems like such a minor thing, I don't get why it's such a big deal to some people.
Personally I'm retexturing jungles into the sort of temperate rain forests you see on the BC coast, I don't think tropics really fit into minecraft worlds, so this is a non-issue for me. Overall I think they're really cool, nice to finally see giant trees, I'm looking forward to shitting around with this biome more when the mod api comes out.
You see, the thing I dislike is a bug! No one has ever stated that it's a bug, nor have they ever said it would be fixed, but it's a bug because I dislike it and I say so!
Now everyone agree with me or I'll start giving smart-ass answers to people who disagree with me!
(FYI - This has been my dramatic re-enactment of this sad little thread.)
This.
I like how, when somebody doesn't like a feature or part of the game mechanics, all those that do are "fanboys". Because really, anyone who disagrees can't do so because they like something the way it is; but because they love Mojang.
Flukes of nature are natural occurrences... extremely uncommon occurrences. Having a tundra next to a jungle, even if it existed in Quebec (not so much), looks nothing more than sloppy game design. Just because you found an image on the internet with blue right next to green doesn't mean tundra exists next to jungle in reality, and even if it did, that wouldn't mean that it would seem anything other than sloppy when implemented in game.
Granted, weird **** happens on Earth. But just because it snowed on palm trees doesn't mean tundra existing right next to jungle is anything but an staggeringly unlikely fluke of nature. And again, in game terms it just looks sloppy. The biome generation is an incoherent mess no matter how many odd flukes of nature you can find on Google images.
Its a $14, or was when I bought it, indie game. I mean really.
If you don't see that that is a design flaw, you're either being stubborn out of fanboyism, or you're very dense.
Why is some tiny glitch in the land generation more important than bugs that actually hinder gameplay?
For instance, did you know that the Enderdragon boss fight doesn't really work in SMP? You have to spawn in your own dragons and they don't recharge health really. It's pretty lame. So that's an entire facet of the game unavailable in multiplayer.
Then there's the latest item duplication glitch. Probably should fix that.
Hell, there are plenty of aesthetic glitches which impact gameplay more than biome placement. How about the numerous lighting glitches, which include water and chests which magically hold light even after you break any light sources around them?
This is essentially why your argument fails. You just say "Oh, it's sloppy game design." But guess what: No one else really gives a **** about random biome placement. There are plenty of other problems which are far more important and are actually bugs rather than something which is (in your opinion) "sloppy".
Yeah, it took me an hour to find the perfect combination of jungle next to other biomes. I wasn't satisfied with the myriad of portmanteaus involved with my world generation. Jungles next to snow? No way boss. Jungle next to desert? Yes. Jungle next to desert on one side and next to snow on the other? No good god damn way.
I think some sort of temperature related placement would be best. It would much more sense.
My biggest problem is not as much that jungles spawn next to tundra, though I'm not a fan of that kind of illogical randomness. My problem is that its very easy to have a forest spawn next to a desert with a tiny bit of tundra in between. That is a case where I feel the biome coding is sloppy, especially since there is no gradual transition between any of those three biomes. This same problem applies in a lesser extent to the swamps, which (unlike many people) I still feel need serious work. It's nearly impossible to walk and/or swim through a swamp without finding isolated trees with a few leaves in a different biome color and puddles of lighter water scattered around the darker swamp water. In my opinion, a sensible biome code would at the very least reduce these kinds of generation quirks, as I feel they distract from the often beautiful nature of minecraft's biomes.
Why is some tiny glitch in the land generation more important than bugs that actually hinder gameplay?
Because nonsense biome placement is a bug that is going to inevitably show up on Jeb's radar, and Mojang will once again redo the terrain generation code and cause us all to lose our progress in order to experience the new features, and that's getting kind of old.
And I agree with Zark. The biome transitions need to be extended a great deal as well. I don't know why Mojang thinks it's a good idea for biomes to have such abrupt transitions. It should vary to some degree, but be mainly gradual.
Because nonsense biome placement is a bug that is going to inevitably show up on Jeb's radar, and Mojang will once again redo the terrain generation code and cause us all to lose our progress in order to experience the new features, and that's getting kind of old.
And I agree with Zark. The biome transitions need to be extended a great deal as well. I don't know why Mojang thinks it's a good idea for biomes to have such abrupt transitions. It should vary to some degree, but be mainly gradual.
Yea, you still didn't explain why that's more important than other bugs which actually impact gameplay. I don't really care what you choose to do when it comes to experiencing new content, seeing the current content being rid of major bugs seems like a much more important issue.
Because nonsense biome placement is a bug that is going to inevitably show up on Jeb's radar, and Mojang will once again redo the terrain generation code and cause us all to lose our progress in order to experience the new features, and that's getting kind of old.
Superficial bugs don't cause us to wipe all our time and effort away and start over every couple weeks.
Another thing I must point out that, while it is true that real life nature sometimes can be very freaky, in no way is it freaky to the point that minecraft terrain generation is. As an example, that picture people keep posting of a snowy jungle might be neat, but believable. Planet earth sometimes has very unusual temparature variations, which can lead to things like that. But can you really say that's just as freaky as finding a patch of icy cold snow right on the border of a desert and a forest? I hardly think so.
Also, keep in mind that since the minecraft world does not have a seasonal cycle, we have to assume that the temparature of any given biome always remains relatively the same. That makes these terrain generation quirks even more glaring. If a minecraft jungle is always sweltering hot and a minecraft tundra always freezing cold, is there any logical reason they should appear next to each other? Again, in the real world, if we saw something like that snowy jungle posted previously, we would assume the entire region is going though an incredibly cold shift. But in the world of minecraft, there is no such thing as "a jungle going through a cold shift," only "a jungle with an eternal patch of snowing tundra smack dab in the middle."
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
:tongue.gif:
You know what I meant! There are always ways around - deleting chunks, traveling to new areas, MCEditing the save... These guys don't seem to want to do that, or perhaps simply don't know. I can't blame them either way - neither of those are very favorable (IMO).
They are random, why that woudnt happen if its randomized? I dont think mojang looked for a specific biome order.
I will agree, the new jungles are awesome.
But, getting past that, your ideas for the organization of biomes is a bit ludicrous. We have no way of telling whether it was a "design flaw" in the first place anyway. Random biomes aren't a feature, but neither would predictable patterns of their spawning. Currently, you wander until you find the right biome you want. With predictable forms of spawning, it would make people walk further just to find the right one. Personally, I enjoy the randomness of it and the fact that I can find everything in one location, rather than know exactly where it is. Your solution would cause the terrain generation to become even more boring than it currently is.
Also, I'm not quite sure what your resentment for the Mojang crew is from, but I kind of find this quotes fitting. If it's not a correct portrayal of your criticism, let me know, and I'll find some new ones.
Most of these critics are usually frustrated artists, and they criticise other people's art because they can't do it themselves. It's a really disgusting job. They must feel horrible inside.
Rosanna Arquette
Criticism is an indirect form of self-boasting.
Emmet Fox
Most critical writing is drivel and half of it is dishonest. It is a short cut to oblivion, anyway. Thinking in terms of ideas destroys the power to think in terms of emotions and sensations.
Chandler, Raymond
Yes, but in that situation you don't have to start over, there is simply more gear to get; which is how patches in minecraft should work. You don't have to rebuild from the ground up, you simply have more to build and explore.
-Quote by some guy you've never heard of-
What I want to know is, how the **** do you approve of a jungle, which is hot and humid, is right next to a taiga, which is frigid and dry.
This is kind of what I was thinking as well, not that I expect realism from minecraft worlds to begin with. You're probably wasting your time with this post though, some people just live to complain. This seems like such a minor thing, I don't get why it's such a big deal to some people.
Personally I'm retexturing jungles into the sort of temperate rain forests you see on the BC coast, I don't think tropics really fit into minecraft worlds, so this is a non-issue for me. Overall I think they're really cool, nice to finally see giant trees, I'm looking forward to shitting around with this biome more when the mod api comes out.
This.
I like how, when somebody doesn't like a feature or part of the game mechanics, all those that do are "fanboys". Because really, anyone who disagrees can't do so because they like something the way it is; but because they love Mojang.
Its a $14, or was when I bought it, indie game. I mean really.
Take a look at that first picture I posted.
If you don't see that that is a design flaw, you're either being stubborn out of fanboyism, or you're very dense.
Wait, I was also under the impression that this was a WORLD SIMULATION game.
Hence the inclusion of "biomes" in the first place.
Why is some tiny glitch in the land generation more important than bugs that actually hinder gameplay?
For instance, did you know that the Enderdragon boss fight doesn't really work in SMP? You have to spawn in your own dragons and they don't recharge health really. It's pretty lame. So that's an entire facet of the game unavailable in multiplayer.
Then there's the latest item duplication glitch. Probably should fix that.
Hell, there are plenty of aesthetic glitches which impact gameplay more than biome placement. How about the numerous lighting glitches, which include water and chests which magically hold light even after you break any light sources around them?
This is essentially why your argument fails. You just say "Oh, it's sloppy game design." But guess what: No one else really gives a **** about random biome placement. There are plenty of other problems which are far more important and are actually bugs rather than something which is (in your opinion) "sloppy".
I think some sort of temperature related placement would be best. It would much more sense.
Am I dense or a fanboy?
No, I'm just more focused on building than making everything in Minecraft reflect real life.
Because nonsense biome placement is a bug that is going to inevitably show up on Jeb's radar, and Mojang will once again redo the terrain generation code and cause us all to lose our progress in order to experience the new features, and that's getting kind of old.
And I agree with Zark. The biome transitions need to be extended a great deal as well. I don't know why Mojang thinks it's a good idea for biomes to have such abrupt transitions. It should vary to some degree, but be mainly gradual.
Yea, you still didn't explain why that's more important than other bugs which actually impact gameplay. I don't really care what you choose to do when it comes to experiencing new content, seeing the current content being rid of major bugs seems like a much more important issue.
Superficial bugs don't cause us to wipe all our time and effort away and start over every couple weeks.
Also, keep in mind that since the minecraft world does not have a seasonal cycle, we have to assume that the temparature of any given biome always remains relatively the same. That makes these terrain generation quirks even more glaring. If a minecraft jungle is always sweltering hot and a minecraft tundra always freezing cold, is there any logical reason they should appear next to each other? Again, in the real world, if we saw something like that snowy jungle posted previously, we would assume the entire region is going though an incredibly cold shift. But in the world of minecraft, there is no such thing as "a jungle going through a cold shift," only "a jungle with an eternal patch of snowing tundra smack dab in the middle."