I actually disagree with this.
The fact is that everyone THINKS they know what they want, but humans are prone to self sabotage (such as using cheats in video games til it gets boring when it would have lasted twice as long if you didn't cheat). I realize you're not a designer of interactive media, but this is a common situation among people who create it: how to design the game so that people enjoy it. If you were to design a game based on the loudest yelling individuals, you would ultimately have a terrible game, and most game studios and designers know this (Bethesda is a good example, there are times to listen to criticism, and times to ignore it) Pandering to peoples wants does not automatically equate to making the game more enjoyable, as in reality people do not always know what they want, or what they want is often short term or short sighted or self defeating. Why do you think Diablo has a hardcore mode that deletes your save file when you die? It's because the designers at Blizzard know that people who want to play that way will, in that last moment of losing their hard earned character who got so far, decide instead to not delete the character, and cheapen the value of the setting in any sense, because people are weak and often will undermine a goal they set for themselves.
Sometimes forcing people to do things they don't want to do, is the best way to get them to have fun. If you don't believe this is true, then you are simply naive, because I can guarantee you've had fun at a time when you were certain you wouldn't. This is a natural part of interactive media design, and your naivety of the topic is showing.
Also: what Mystify said.
Notch once said somethign along the lines of "I give players what they want, not what they think they want". Because honestly, people don't really know what is good design. I had to flee the suggestions board because this became so aparant.
Maintenance is not fulfilling gameplay. It's just irritating.
But this hunger bar is not about maintanance. In fact, I suspect that eating food just ot maintain hunger will be a rare occurance. It is probably going to be far more relevant as fuel for sprinting, or being consumed to get some healing. The change revolutionized many mechanics, fixes a lot of long-standing problems in the game. The cost? Occasionally, you might have to eat some food to not die. Eating food to stay alive is not the focus of the mechanic. If there is something that drains your hunger, so you need to eat, that is an alternative form of danger, countered with food. Things that drain your hunger bar are really just costing food to perform. I agree, if the mechanic was just "eat food every 15 minutes or you die", it would be an irritating maintenance task. But notch has not done that.
awww......that sucks, i like minecraft as a sandbox, not necessarily survival.But i like normal mode,because without monsters its boring...and i wouldnt like to rely on an undoubtedly glitchy mod to take away the hunger bar.Meh,i guess ill live....
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
(10/5/15) If you want to have a laugh, go look at some of my posts from back in ~2010 ( i was 10/11 what can i say)
Wow! I haven't seen much anger at ALL on this thread. When I saw this, I expected all caps rage on every single page.
To be honest, the only reason why I don't like hunger being mandatory is the fact that someone, SOMEWHERE is going to make a thread saying notch sucks at development. (Not saying that he doesn't.)It's just annoying, really.
Eh, hunger bar being forced. Hey, that's cool. While we're at it, let's turn this into SimCity.
No, that's not what I mean to say.
I meant to say these 4 (strong?) words:
"Screw the hunger bar."
No, even better, lets turn it into dwarf fortress!
Soooo, first people complain that Adventure mode is going to ruin survival mode, now we have another aspect of survival and people complain. Wow, a lot of you people really can't be pleased.
Soooo, first people complain that Adventure mode is going to ruin survival mode, now we have another aspect of survival and people complain. Wow, a lot of you people really can't be pleased.
Well, while I agree with you that people should shut up more, you are discussing two different groups of people and claiming they are the same people because they have a common element. That is a logical fallacy and we're all now dumber for reading it. Great job.
We live in a community where no one can agree on any gameplay decisions. Just look at the active modding community. There are literally mods which reject minor stock gameplay elements in favor of easily-coded useful elements, like Better Than Wolves. Just think of the amount of people who consider certain mods "critical" to their game experience. And then the people who don't use said mods look at them funny and go "Why?"
We live in a community where no one can agree on any gameplay decisions. Just look at the active modding community. There are literally mods which reject minor stock gameplay elements in favor of easily-coded useful elements, like Better Than Wolves. Just think of the amount of people who consider certain mods "critical" to their game experience. And then the people who don't use said mods look at them funny and go "Why?"
Yet even among those people, some enjoy it more than others, but there are so many factors at play its nearly impossible to determine, but it is more than just 'we are all different'. There is a such thing as a bad design idea, you know.
There is a such thing as a bad design idea, you know.
Quite true. I'm probably thinking in terms of a perfectly ideal situation, which doesn't seem to be what we have on our hands.
EDIT: "Perfectly Ideal?" Nah, I don't think I'm thinking that, as this argument wouldn't have happened in a perfectly ideal situation. Perhaps just more ideal than reality?
Maybe to you, but I find your post unfulfilling and just irritating :3
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
Notch once said somethign along the lines of "I give players what they want, not what they think they want". Because honestly, people don't really know what is good design. I had to flee the suggestions board because this became so aparant.
But this hunger bar is not about maintanance. In fact, I suspect that eating food just ot maintain hunger will be a rare occurance. It is probably going to be far more relevant as fuel for sprinting, or being consumed to get some healing. The change revolutionized many mechanics, fixes a lot of long-standing problems in the game. The cost? Occasionally, you might have to eat some food to not die. Eating food to stay alive is not the focus of the mechanic. If there is something that drains your hunger, so you need to eat, that is an alternative form of danger, countered with food. Things that drain your hunger bar are really just costing food to perform. I agree, if the mechanic was just "eat food every 15 minutes or you die", it would be an irritating maintenance task. But notch has not done that.
(10/5/15) If you want to have a laugh, go look at some of my posts from back in ~2010 ( i was 10/11 what can i say)
(02/12/21) cannot believe i still play this game
To be honest, the only reason why I don't like hunger being mandatory is the fact that someone, SOMEWHERE is going to make a thread saying notch sucks at development. (Not saying that he doesn't.)It's just annoying, really.
No, even better, lets turn it into dwarf fortress!
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
That would be freakin' awesome yes please lets turn it into Dwarf Fortress.
minecraft was actually heavily inspired by dwarf fortress :3
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
That was sort of the original idea behind minecraft iirc.
I like how you posted that DIRECTLY after the post I made saying that, but almost an hour after the fact.
wut?
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
Shrug, must have left a tab of this topic open for a bit before replying. ohnohz!
Well, while I agree with you that people should shut up more, you are discussing two different groups of people and claiming they are the same people because they have a common element. That is a logical fallacy and we're all now dumber for reading it. Great job.
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
"sometimes, wizards are so awesome, it hurts"
Yet even among those people, some enjoy it more than others, but there are so many factors at play its nearly impossible to determine, but it is more than just 'we are all different'. There is a such thing as a bad design idea, you know.
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)
EDIT: "Perfectly Ideal?" Nah, I don't think I'm thinking that, as this argument wouldn't have happened in a perfectly ideal situation. Perhaps just more ideal than reality?
"sometimes, wizards are so awesome, it hurts"
Not a problem. :smile.gif:
Why?
http://notch.tumblr.com/post/123343045/my-vision-for-survival (follow this link if you need proof)