Two people working on Minecraft. 100s of modders. And so what if SOME of the features of 1.8 have already been done.That doesn't mean Notch/Jeb aren't allowed to add it.
dose this mean ur aginst 1.8? also, calling lil an idiot was uncalled for.
also mojang dosent just do minecraft, they have the law suit to focus on, minecon preporations, other games they develop, budget managing for their staff, their personal lives, and of course the countless amount of e-mails they must get from trolls like you! moders on the other hand can just focus on their mods!
Okay, so Mojang has Jeb and Notch working on code, and C418 doing music. I am not aware of anyone else working on it directly. There are thousands of modders. Of course modders are going to get things done faster. And they will put more out. It is inevitable that a feature will be added that is similar to something that a mod has done.
Then compare them to how long it takes for individual modders to update their content and add more :sleep.gif:
Like better then wolves, buildcraft and ETC, they update their content a lot faster and add more each time (with bug fixes)
@boxx I don't/can't understand you
@all the downies you keep misunderstanding this thread.
I'm not whining and I don't think Mojang should stop what they're doing just because it's done :sleep.gif:
I just think that they should focus on the GAMEPLAY much more then the actual content and focus on the mod API
Full release is in Nov, after that people will HAVE to mod if they want new content :sleep.gif: since Notch will most likely move onto developing his other games or he might pop in for DLC which is optional (no different then a mod)
the whole purpose of a mod api (again :sleep.gif:) is to have all of those mods work in harmony, that's the thing Notch should be focusing on, also Mojang is going to stop updating one way or another, this isn't an MMO or online based game, once it's finished=No support except for DLC which is modability should be the number one focus.
Your point is? It's still not fair to people if Mojang start working on an update that they promise, see that there's already a mod that does something similar, and says "Screw it, it's already been done." And DLC is completely different from a mod. DLC simply requires you to click a few buttons (namely "install"), while modding requires you get your (metaphorical) hands dirty and mess with the (metaphorical) guts of the game. The slightest error in which can corrupt a save file, or cause the game to crash, or some other problem that not everybody knows how to fix.
The purpose of an API is to make it simpler to mod, not to make it so that every mod works with every other. The way this game is put together, certain mods will always conflict with certain others, unless the creators of those mods find a way to change them. Then they may conflict with another mod, and so on. Mods are inherently unstable. It's much safer to have the content in the vanilla game.
Then compare them to how long it takes for individual modders to update their content and add more :sleep.gif:
Like better then wolves, buildcraft and ETC, they update their content a lot faster and add more each time (with bug fixes)
@boxx I don't/can't understand you
@all the downies you keep misunderstanding this thread.
I'm not whining and I don't think Mojang should stop what they're doing just because it's done :sleep.gif:
I just think that they should focus on the GAMEPLAY much more then the actual content and focus on the mod API
Let the modders fill the content
so, ender men, more food, hunger, sprinting, NPC villages dont envole gameplay is what ur saying?
let's not forget that adding to the vanilla game also means multiplayer support. Not many mods have multi support. And DON'T say "ooooooooh the nether took forever" because that was ONE THING. Also don't say "boats are laggy" , or "mobs are laggy" because that's just the server. Mojang is adding interesting things, like leveling and hunger.
dose this mean ur aginst 1.8? also, calling lil an idiot was uncalled for.
also mojang dosent just do minecraft, they have the law suit to focus on, minecon preporations, other games they develop, budget managing for their staff, their personal lives, and of course the countless amount of e-mails they must get from trolls like you! moders on the other hand can just focus on their mods!
Mojang has lawyers to focus on the lawsuit
I'm sure Ez or some other watch over minecon
There's another/a few other devs focusing on scrolls and anything else
their business CEO is watching over the budget management and ETC
Well duh their personal lives, but let's assume they mod from 9-5
and social media doesn't take much time :sleep.gif:
Modders on the other hand have social lives, jobs, significant others, school as well as other responsibilities.
People are just ungrateful whiners. Modding does not need to be limited, people just need to try coding a game and keeping a community happy before they start complaining.
Here they aren't just ungrateful assholes though.
They DDoS'd minecraft.net cause they thought Notch wasn't working hard enough. I kinda wish he would've pulled multiplayer after incident, teach them a lesson.
I just think that they should focus on the GAMEPLAY much more then the actual content and focus on the mod API
That is what 1.8 is going to fill in. When you have done everything, got a stash of diamonds, have a huge mansion, and have tamed an army of creepers, it does get a bit dry. The discovery part is gone. 1.8 will fix that with ruins, strongholds, ravines, rivers, a new biome, NPC Villages with Smiths, citizens, wells, farms, and interaction with the player. There will be at least one new mob, but probably more to fill in the villages. More farming, more terrain features to discover. Nobody can say that that is not adding gameplay.
Then compare them to how long it takes for individual modders to update their content and add more :sleep.gif:
Like better then wolves, buildcraft and ETC, they update their content a lot faster and add more each time (with bug fixes)
Again, Mojang has 2 coders working on their game. Mojang has their lawsuit, Minecon, Notch's wedding, Ludum Dare, and a myriad of other things to keep track of as well. Mod coders don't have to worry about release dates or keeping a community happy. They do it on their leisure time, because they want to. At least, that is why I mod.
Anyway, I believe that it is unfair to criticize Mojang on their "lack of originality" or content.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Intelligence is not one and the same with knowledge.
Your point is? It's still not fair to people if Mojang start working on an update that they promise, see that there's already a mod that does something similar, and says "Screw it, it's already been done." And DLC is completely different from a mod. DLC simply requires you to click a few buttons (namely "install"), while modding requires you get your (metaphorical) hands dirty and mess with the (metaphorical) guts of the game. The slightest error in which can corrupt a save file, or cause the game to crash, or some other problem that not everybody knows how to fix.
The purpose of an API is to make it simpler to mod, not to make it so that every mod works with every other. The way this game is put together, certain mods will always conflict with certain others, unless the creators of those mods find a way to change them. Then they may conflict with another mod, and so on. Mods are inherently unstable. It's much safer to have the content in the vanilla game.
I don't see how mods and DLC should be any different in the sense that you can "install" them with a click of a few buttons, they both do the exact same thing (add class files and other custom files :sleep.gif:)
They shouldn't be any different in the sense that they're optional and can be turned on and off (With the addition of the API) You make it sound like current modding is like defusing a bomb and not simply downloading, dragging and dropping. Also adding a mod API would take help mods become more stable :sleep.gif:.
Most games actually refer to mods as custom DLC (look at Oblivion) instead of mods because they're honestly not any different.
@Epic once Spout is fully functional it will allow the addition of custom Mobs and blocks into multiplayer from the serverside so that all the clients can simply download the extra content when connecting to the server, voila horses in SMP :biggrin.gif:
@Bob Enderman and NPC villages are content, the other can be referred to as either or both
Your point is? It's still not fair to people if Mojang start working on an update that they promise, see that there's already a mod that does something similar, and says "Screw it, it's already been done." And DLC is completely different from a mod. DLC simply requires you to click a few buttons (namely "install"), while modding requires you get your (metaphorical) hands dirty and mess with the (metaphorical) guts of the game. The slightest error in which can corrupt a save file, or cause the game to crash, or some other problem that not everybody knows how to fix.
The purpose of an API is to make it simpler to mod, not to make it so that every mod works with every other. The way this game is put together, certain mods will always conflict with certain others, unless the creators of those mods find a way to change them. Then they may conflict with another mod, and so on. Mods are inherently unstable. It's much safer to have the content in the vanilla game.
That is what 1.8 is going to fill in. When you have done everything, got a stash of diamonds, have a huge mansion, and have tamed an army of creepers, it does get a bit dry. The discovery part is gone. 1.8 will fix that with ruins, strongholds, ravines, rivers, a new biome, NPC Villages with Smiths, citizens, wells, farms, and interaction with the player. There will be at least one new mob, but probably more to fill in the villages. More farming, more terrain features to discover.
Again, Mojang has 2 coders working on their game. Mojang has their lawsuit, Minecon, Notch's wedding, Ludum Dare, and a myriad of other things to keep track of as well. Mod coders don't have to worry about release dates or keeping a community happy. They do it on their leisure time, because they want to. At least, that is why I mod.
Anyway, I believe that it is unfair to criticize Mojang on their "lack of originality" or content.
Im criticizing them on their priorities not their lack or originality.
@Bob if there was no infiniminer there would be no minecraft ETC ETC
I really, really despise the idea that the developers should stop making the game they want to make, following their vision of the game, becuase modders duplicate some of the work. I'm sure a fair handful of those mods exist because mojang has been talking about adding them. Disparate modders do not have a unified goal. They add individual features that they work on only in relation to their own little universe. You can't just throw all of them together and expect a functional result, technical problems aside. The gameplay would be a complete mess. Few mods are balanced, even on their own, and that balance will get further skewed with every mod you add.
Even when mods duplicate apparantly identical funcionality, they end up doing it much differently than mojang would. Take pistons for instance. Mojang's pistons were designed to do less than the original mod, and are made with a much cheaper recipie. I find the pistons in game to be much better balanced and fit in with the game much better than the mod does.
You can find mods for a lot of these featurs because they are changes that the game could use, and other people have recognized that. There are far more mods that do not expand the game in a nice way. Saying that all future updates should just be mods means every individual will ahve to find, out of the sea of mods, the few that they want.
People should not have to mod the game to get it to the intended state. Imagine if you bought starcraft II, then had to go and download 3rd party mods to get all of the buildings, missions, and upgrades that are meant to be in the game. That doesn't make sense. You create a game to its own design requirements. If modders feel like creating a variant based off of it, it should be just that: a variant, not the rest of the game.
The other aspect you are missing is that mojang has to maintain the engine as a whole, fix bugs, etc, whilst modders are just throwing new content on it. There are a few exceptions to this, but mojang has not been focused on adding new content. They have been establishing a framework. Biomes are a framework, not a complete aspect to the game. In fact, they are gettign a rework at the framework level since it was decided their current framework was not adequate. The advanture update represents a shift to where they are more focused on content, and are getting around to fleshing out the game.
Imagine if notch was working on a painting. His progress is visible to all, and his starting strokes captured peoples interest. He continues to paint the picture, and draws more and more attention. Other artists start studying his work, and create their own varaitions. Some of these are also widely acclaimed. Now you come along, look at notch's work, look at the other artist's works, and tell notch "You are too slow. Stop working on it. i want that guy's sky, I like how that girl does shading, these people were really clever with the added bunnies in the background. Together that content finishes your painting, so we'll just use that instead". I know its a rough analagy, but that is what you are doing. You are barging in on a widely acclaimed peice of work, telling the creator he is not good enough, and we should instead cobble together other people's work.
Let mojang make minecraft. Its what they do, and they have been successful at it. If you want to modify the game to suit your own desirs, feel free. But don't be so presumptuos as to suggest mojang should stop developing it.
I don't see how mods and DLC should be any different in the sense that you can "install" them with a click of a few buttons, they both do the exact same thing (add class files and other custom files :sleep.gif:)
They shouldn't be any different in the sense that they're optional and can be turned on and off (With the addition of the API) You make it sound like current modding is like defusing a bomb and not simply downloading, dragging and dropping. Also adding a mod API would take help mods become more stable :sleep.gif:.
To some people, it is like defusing a bomb. Particularly if you have a Mac. I still have nightmares about trying to figure out how to mod on that. The fact that Windows 7, by default, hides the folder in which .minecraft is doesn't help either. And then there are the people who just don't want to mod in general.
also mojang dosent just do minecraft, they have the law suit to focus on, minecon preporations, other games they develop, budget managing for their staff, their personal lives, and of course the countless amount of e-mails they must get from trolls like you! moders on the other hand can just focus on their mods!
Then compare them to how long it takes for individual modders to update their content and add more :sleep.gif:
Like better then wolves, buildcraft and ETC, they update their content a lot faster and add more each time (with bug fixes)
@boxx I don't/can't understand you
@all the downies you keep misunderstanding this thread.
I'm not whining and I don't think Mojang should stop what they're doing just because it's done :sleep.gif:
I just think that they should focus on the GAMEPLAY much more then the actual content and focus on the mod API
Let the modders fill the content
Your point is? It's still not fair to people if Mojang start working on an update that they promise, see that there's already a mod that does something similar, and says "Screw it, it's already been done." And DLC is completely different from a mod. DLC simply requires you to click a few buttons (namely "install"), while modding requires you get your (metaphorical) hands dirty and mess with the (metaphorical) guts of the game. The slightest error in which can corrupt a save file, or cause the game to crash, or some other problem that not everybody knows how to fix.
The purpose of an API is to make it simpler to mod, not to make it so that every mod works with every other. The way this game is put together, certain mods will always conflict with certain others, unless the creators of those mods find a way to change them. Then they may conflict with another mod, and so on. Mods are inherently unstable. It's much safer to have the content in the vanilla game.
so, ender men, more food, hunger, sprinting, NPC villages dont envole gameplay is what ur saying?
Mojang has lawyers to focus on the lawsuit
I'm sure Ez or some other watch over minecon
There's another/a few other devs focusing on scrolls and anything else
their business CEO is watching over the budget management and ETC
Well duh their personal lives, but let's assume they mod from 9-5
and social media doesn't take much time :sleep.gif:
Modders on the other hand have social lives, jobs, significant others, school as well as other responsibilities.
Here they aren't just ungrateful assholes though.
They DDoS'd minecraft.net cause they thought Notch wasn't working hard enough. I kinda wish he would've pulled multiplayer after incident, teach them a lesson.
Click em'!
Withought notch there WOULDNT BE A MINECRAFT SO STOP COMPLAINING
I bet Notch could do better if he decided to use another language and not ("shitty" and slow JAVA).
That is what 1.8 is going to fill in. When you have done everything, got a stash of diamonds, have a huge mansion, and have tamed an army of creepers, it does get a bit dry. The discovery part is gone. 1.8 will fix that with ruins, strongholds, ravines, rivers, a new biome, NPC Villages with Smiths, citizens, wells, farms, and interaction with the player. There will be at least one new mob, but probably more to fill in the villages. More farming, more terrain features to discover. Nobody can say that that is not adding gameplay.
Again, Mojang has 2 coders working on their game. Mojang has their lawsuit, Minecon, Notch's wedding, Ludum Dare, and a myriad of other things to keep track of as well. Mod coders don't have to worry about release dates or keeping a community happy. They do it on their leisure time, because they want to. At least, that is why I mod.
Anyway, I believe that it is unfair to criticize Mojang on their "lack of originality" or content.
I don't see how mods and DLC should be any different in the sense that you can "install" them with a click of a few buttons, they both do the exact same thing (add class files and other custom files :sleep.gif:)
They shouldn't be any different in the sense that they're optional and can be turned on and off (With the addition of the API) You make it sound like current modding is like defusing a bomb and not simply downloading, dragging and dropping. Also adding a mod API would take help mods become more stable :sleep.gif:.
Most games actually refer to mods as custom DLC (look at Oblivion) instead of mods because they're honestly not any different.
@Epic once Spout is fully functional it will allow the addition of custom Mobs and blocks into multiplayer from the serverside so that all the clients can simply download the extra content when connecting to the server, voila horses in SMP :biggrin.gif:
@Bob Enderman and NPC villages are content, the other can be referred to as either or both
A MODDER WOULD'VE MADE IT AND MADE IT BETTER!
Click em'!
Mojang dosent know about every mod ever invented
Im criticizing them on their priorities not their lack or originality.
@Bob if there was no infiniminer there would be no minecraft ETC ETC
Even when mods duplicate apparantly identical funcionality, they end up doing it much differently than mojang would. Take pistons for instance. Mojang's pistons were designed to do less than the original mod, and are made with a much cheaper recipie. I find the pistons in game to be much better balanced and fit in with the game much better than the mod does.
You can find mods for a lot of these featurs because they are changes that the game could use, and other people have recognized that. There are far more mods that do not expand the game in a nice way. Saying that all future updates should just be mods means every individual will ahve to find, out of the sea of mods, the few that they want.
People should not have to mod the game to get it to the intended state. Imagine if you bought starcraft II, then had to go and download 3rd party mods to get all of the buildings, missions, and upgrades that are meant to be in the game. That doesn't make sense. You create a game to its own design requirements. If modders feel like creating a variant based off of it, it should be just that: a variant, not the rest of the game.
The other aspect you are missing is that mojang has to maintain the engine as a whole, fix bugs, etc, whilst modders are just throwing new content on it. There are a few exceptions to this, but mojang has not been focused on adding new content. They have been establishing a framework. Biomes are a framework, not a complete aspect to the game. In fact, they are gettign a rework at the framework level since it was decided their current framework was not adequate. The advanture update represents a shift to where they are more focused on content, and are getting around to fleshing out the game.
Imagine if notch was working on a painting. His progress is visible to all, and his starting strokes captured peoples interest. He continues to paint the picture, and draws more and more attention. Other artists start studying his work, and create their own varaitions. Some of these are also widely acclaimed. Now you come along, look at notch's work, look at the other artist's works, and tell notch "You are too slow. Stop working on it. i want that guy's sky, I like how that girl does shading, these people were really clever with the added bunnies in the background. Together that content finishes your painting, so we'll just use that instead". I know its a rough analagy, but that is what you are doing. You are barging in on a widely acclaimed peice of work, telling the creator he is not good enough, and we should instead cobble together other people's work.
Let mojang make minecraft. Its what they do, and they have been successful at it. If you want to modify the game to suit your own desirs, feel free. But don't be so presumptuos as to suggest mojang should stop developing it.
To some people, it is like defusing a bomb. Particularly if you have a Mac. I still have nightmares about trying to figure out how to mod on that. The fact that Windows 7, by default, hides the folder in which .minecraft is doesn't help either. And then there are the people who just don't want to mod in general.